>2. The cost seems to be based on what's in the box - Base the price off the difficulty of the lock. If, upon inspection, the locksmith finds a trap then tack on an additional fee based off the difficulty of the trap. Sometimes the box would pay out significantly less than it cost and other times significantly more.

I always thought it was the lock/trap difficulty, that's why people lose money

I always thought it was the lock/trap difficulty, that's why people lose money

I am under the impression that the value of the contents of the box is factored in somehow. I might be totally wrong.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

I would like to see a drop-off service for boxes.
You drop off the boxes at the locksmith, then player locksmiths can grab an allotment and pick them and return them.
You return later and pick up unlocked boxes.

Anyways, its an idea.

Hazado

I have to be honest Robert. Locksmithing is the one system in game I know basically nothing about. I'm all for anything that gets people to the player locksmiths instead of the NPCs and making it easier for the PC locksmiths is certainly one of the ways.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

I actually run two locksmith characters, one which has even (finally) mastered lock mastery. Neither of them are skilled enough to open capped boxes yet though. Locksmithing in general is a very fun and rewarding aspect of the game for me. I've spent time in the landing tower, at the well in Icemule, and other places and while I think the experience earned for opening boxes is actually very good (and should not be increased) there just aren't enough customers to make sitting around waiting for boxes worth it (it's way too boring). I think this is the primary reason you don't see a lot of PC locksmiths focused on opening boxes any more, myself included.

On the flip side, as a client with boxes to be opened, I don't generally enjoy spending the amount of time it takes for a PC locksmith to open my boxes even when they available and ready to go (which is infrequent). Time is my primary complaint, the risk from locksmiths that push their limits too far is another. I can mitigate the risk by working with locksmiths that I know but we still have PC locksmith availability and box opening times to contend with. The NPC locksmith wins hands down here.

Making the NPC locksmith take as long as the PC locksmith will likely send more boxes to PC locksmiths but at the expense of players enjoyment of the game in general (with the possible exception of PC locksmiths).

Making the NPC locksmith take a little bit of time, and allowing PC locksmiths to open boxes faster seems like a potential compromise solution that might help the profession without detracting too much from general enjoyment of the game.

For what its worth, a rogue with Lock Mastery can open boxes pretty darned efficiently but still not efficiently as the NPC locksmith. Ideally I would like to see a PC locksmith with Lock Mastery able to open boxes as fast, if not faster, than the NPC. Just not at the expense of everyone by slowing the NPC down to current PC box opening times.

An alternative idea that has been proposed ad nauseam (and one that I am not a fan of) would be to reduce the number of boxes generated in general - less boxes, more loot per box - thus decreasing the time sink that is getting boxes opened today.

-- Robert

"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."

Its both (lock/trap difficulty and box value), with a roughly equal contribution..

I would like to see contents value removed from the formula. Just use lock/trap difficulty. Maybe a small bump from those unscrupulous locksmiths based on the weight.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

You'd like to see people losing 5k instead of 1k on a low treasure capped box? Because thats what a purely difficulty based formula would do.

C'mon now Rath, that's a bit of a stretch based on what I said. No one is suggesting we just strip out the value part of the formula and leave the numbers exactly as they are otherwise. Obviously numbers would have to be tweaked to account for the change. Let's put Chicken Little back in the coop for right now please.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

Make it based on % of content value and the % scale with lock difficulty

Can someone explain to me what IC sense it makes to have the contents of the box factor in at all when the NPC locksmith doesn't know what's in it?

You pay him before the box is picked, and he hands it back to you unopened, so how would be know what to charge based on the contents?

~ Methais

"Hey Larton, why does it seem like anytime I find something good in a box, you're charging me a lot more than normal?

~ Methais

<"Hey Larton, why does it seem like anytime I find something good in a box, you're charging me a lot more than normal?

~ Methais>

Slaps Larton and leaves him gutted in the alley for one too many overcharges.

>Slaps Larton and leaves him gutted in the alley for one too many overcharges.


This might explain his only wanting 6290 silver to open a 132 pound chest this afternoon, he took the hint. <g>


Tanivar Somakre

Retired 'vulture'

Thought about this a little more, and probably a better solution is something completely different, which is an in-game delivery system.

Let's suppose there are several different types of delivery services. One is like a letter. One is like money (silvers or notes). One is an individual item. And one is a crate type.

For this case, let's explore the crate type option. Imagine something like a small locker, which can be delivered to another character. Perhaps within a given town, it's nearly free, and some shipping charges between towns perhaps. You have to send the crate upon loading it up, and perhaps include a letter or a cover memo. "To Rlen; Boxes from the Bowels." The person receiving the crate should need to receive it within a fixed time, and unload it somewhat promptly on their accepting the package (but perhaps not immediately, since the encumbrance could be large). It can be automatically returned on failure to deliver within a week, say. Supposing in this instance shipping boxes to pick, once the locksmith picks all the locks, they can return the contents. Maybe they empty the boxes into the crate to reduce the shipping cost. Maybe they tip themselves, or maybe the original person, upon getting the loot back, sends a tip via the money delivery option. Obviously, some trust between the two characters/players is required, since the work is being done remotely.

There are certainly other components of a delivery system of interest, like an EXCHANGE type option, allowing a loresong to be affixed to the item, etc, for general merchant business. But I definitely like the sort of crate-shipping option for a method of lockpicking.

As far as versus the NPC case, the job is basically instantaneous for the person with locked boxes. There's time for the shipping, and to have the work done, but unless you're really in a rush to get the treasure out of the box in real time, you just send the package and go about your business, and wait until a crate is returned.

The coding for this kind of system would be utterly non-trivial, but it's definitely the kind of system with lots of uses where I think the dev time would be really well spent to add a spectacular feature to the game.

And anyone who doesn't like PCs smiths can still use the NPC smiths if they want. They have different pros and cons, which is why I don't think there is a real need to change the NPC system (if you don't like it, get a PC smith).

---

>An officer of the Sorcerer Guild arrives and glances around. "Ah, there you are, Vathon!" he says in a slightly agitated tone. "I have come to formally declare that your membership privileges have been revoked."

I liked the idea someone posted about being able to drop my boxes off somewhere and allowing player locksmiths a chance to open them at their discression. Maybe there could still be a loot reduction rate and an exp reduction for trap opening to the locksmith. Or maybe while "on duty" a player locksmith has access to unlimited picks based on their level and ability.

Either the treasure can then be deposited automatically into my bank, or I can stop in later to pick up my cache of loot. Player locksmiths get to keep scarabs and the sort like the NPC ones do as well. Could even be a little note in the box I'd pick up stating who picked it for me so I could find them out later and give a tip.

I'd love to have more ability to allow players to be locksmiths but would also hate to lose the NPC option because there are times when there just isn't a smith available.

That sounds like a very complicated system. I'd like to propose something a bit easier....

Make the town locksmiths less desirable to use and let us remember how to talk to each other without an automated system doing it for us.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

>Make the town locksmiths less desirable to use and let us remember how to talk to each other without an automated system doing it for us.

I think what you meant to say was, "Give locksmiths more incentive to train in picking so there will be more of them to open our boxes."

~ Methais

>Oh I think that's a wonderful idea too but it seems like dev that makes classes better regularly takes a back seat to dev that makes the game more tedious. I was hedging my bets here.

What in the last year or two are you referring to here? Or are you living in gemstone from a decade or two ago? 319, paladin spell revamping hardly seems to make the game more tedious. I understand being bitter and wishing they would work on the stuff that you'd prefer but it's clouding your opinions.

We aren't going to talk about the paladin spell revamp. I love that a class that a new semi gets created AND gets a full spell circle revamp while NOTHING gets done for the other two semis.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

Bards who haven't had any significant dev in over a decade. Who suffer from cripplingly bad spiritual TD? Who's spell list has been badly in need a revamp since GS3? That profession?

Or...

Rangers who have not had any significant dev since Mestys took over for Warden. Who's companions are horribly buggy and near useless. With a 50th rank spell that is bar none the WORST amongst it's peers. Who lack any sort of viable escape mechanism when they get in a tough spot.

VS...

Paladins who were a brand new profession introduced after either of the other semis got any dev. Who, while still being semis get CMans, shield mans, armor mans like a square. Have the most overpowered defensive spell in the game in 1635. Have one of the most powerful self buffs in 1625. That's the profession that needed it's spell circle revamped first? That's the semi that was most in need?

You know where you can stick those three dots.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!

>>Oh I think that's a wonderful idea too but it seems like dev that makes classes better regularly takes a back seat to dev that >>makes the game more tedious. I was hedging my bets here.

>What in the last year or two are you referring to here? Or are you living in gemstone from a decade or two ago?

>SHAYD11

That screwed up priority was around back then and is still going strong today. Wonder how many less players would have left over all those years if the devs priority was making the game more fun than making it more generally tedious and irritating?

Want specifics? Just read these forums or play the game.


Tanivar Somakre

Retired 'vulture'