What you need to do is heal them up front, then threaten to kill them if they don't pay up after.

Because people have it ingrained in their mind that Empaths provide service of healing for free after many years. Basically, you are fighting against the standard and it'll always be an uphill climb.

- Simon

I decided to log on my Empath for the first time in forever and go a'roletardin' by asking some noobly-looking person for 5 silver or a few rat pelts for healing.

Several people flipped, but not the novice, oddly enough. Kenoselaris immediately threatened me and Tabbiene started berating me for being a bad Empath. (more names for the books!)

They didn't remain in the guild for very long.

---

Rev. Reene

The black panther growls, "Are you blind Tachid? Kill Caelumia."
>
Tachid says, "SHE HAS BLUE FIRE"

>>5 plat is a kind of ridiculous amount to charge

5 plat was just the starting point for negotiations in that guy's case.

He had one of those godawful obsidian forehead things so 5 plat shouldn't be a huge deal to him. However, my complaint wasn't with the dead guy, he basically didn't say anything.

That's actually not the first time someone has come right back with "I won't kill you for 2x(Asking price)." I thought it was post-worthy since this isn't even the first time I've seen that response, and it's fairly up there on the insulting scale.

And yeah, if you want to be constantly insulted and attacked, an Empath with a spine who charges upfront is a great class to play. I don't even have to try. Which is why I try to keep her in out of the way spots if I can. It does get sort of old after a while. (See: Netherlich incidents).

-- Player of Szrael --

---

You grip the oversized book hanging from your leather belt and survey the area with a hint of malice in your eyes.

With a violent cross-body motion, you draw your oversized book.

>> 5 silver or a few rat pelts is a tip that even a novice should be able to afford, just doing a few tasks for the various npcs that offer them will get you that

Pretty much my thoughts, yes. I know you can make a couple plat from the tasks system as a newbie in almost no time which is why I settled on 5 silver; it's really a meager amount even for a newbie fresh out of the char gen.

>> I think the smoke is clearing and more people are catching on that not all empaths are there to be healing robots.

Not really.

People (specifically me, and I know a few other oldies) have been doing this sort of thing for the better part of a RL decade. I was berating people for being bad tippers and asking for payment back when no one did that because healing was the only way to get Transference and no one wanted their source cut off.

Peoples attitudes haven't changed a lot in that time. They act like they have, but when it comes down to it, no one wants to be asked for money for healing.

The attitudes of a lot of Empaths haven't changed either, because you still get a lot of them taking it upon themselves to go "well I'LL heal you for free" whenever you try to charge in a busy area.

---

Rev. Reene

The black panther growls, "Are you blind Tachid? Kill Caelumia."
>
Tachid says, "SHE HAS BLUE FIRE"

>I think some people just assume that all empaths are sweet, living to heal and don't want tips and expecially payment. I think the smoke is clearing and more people are catching on that not all empaths are there to be healing robots. We're all different just like characters of other guilds.

>I've mentioned before that I don't take tips or payment and at least in my situation, I still hugely appreciate a good offer.

By not taking tips, you're kind of reinforcing that stereotype.

my empath usually doesn't take tips either, if i do it's either because the gem is huge, or they offered coins, boxes or pelts. I'd say once you get to goblins and up you should be tipping in atleast gold though.


--
If life doesn't need intelligence,
Then why should intelligence need life?
--
http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/User:Legeres
http://www.myspace.com/ledge_ear_us
http://legeres.deviantart.com

NPC empath prices need to go up. Way up. They should scale nicely by circle, so RPing an empath that overcharges for healing can actually be viable and not marshal negative resentment.

And those who RP empaths who heal for free will be even more appreciated. Everyone wins?



---
"All models are wrong, some are useful." -George C. Box

>> I'd much rather not have to deal with waiting for a fluffykittypants empath to finish hugging me and get their act together enough to actually heal me. Free or not.

I can't remember the last time it took me more than a minute to heal someone, barring multiple pulped vital body parts + grievous wounds of my own.

And I'm actually out of practice. Tell them they are doing it wrong.

---

Rev. Reene

The black panther growls, "Are you blind Tachid? Kill Caelumia."
>
Tachid says, "SHE HAS BLUE FIRE"

<<I can't remember the last time it took me more than a minute to heal someone, barring multiple pulped vital body parts + grievous wounds of my own.

Its all the hugging, giggling, chatting with their friends and so on that happens between saying they'll heal me and actually doing it that's the annoyance.

Not all empaths are like this. I'd just rather not invest the time finding out if any given empath is going to heal me in a timely manner or not.

-Evran

Crackling with unspent rage since 386AV.

<<<<He'd never let me hear the end of it if I wasted his empathy XP on an auto-healer while he was around.
<<Sounds like wounds are a rare commodity.

Yeah that was more a joke at his expense than anything else. :D

<<I don't think the fluffykittypants empath would finish hugging you in this kind of wound market, rather jump on you first and fluffysissyslap any other empath who tries to take "their" wounds.

You'd be surprised.

-Evran

Crackling with unspent rage since 386AV.

>>I can't remember the last time it took me more than a minute to heal someone, barring multiple pulped vital body parts + grievous wounds of my own.

>>And I'm actually out of practice. Tell them they are doing it wrong.

Especially if you're an empath with some skill (say 50th circle). One excuse I have heard is, well I use the Crutch and can't take wounds quickly. :(

Nikpack
player of more than I should list

Climbing List:http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/Climbing_skill
Swimming List:http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/Swimming_skill

And while I am evil, I try to avoid being just plain mean.
-Z

yeah i don't hug strangers very much any more, and usually only if they hug me first, i prefer healing someone completely first, no bleeding on me, i do enough bleeding on myself


--
If life doesn't need intelligence,
Then why should intelligence need life?
--
http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/User:Legeres
http://www.myspace.com/ledge_ear_us
http://legeres.deviantart.com

I'm curious. Of those who have tried asking for payment upfront, how often do people balk? Have you ever had people accept and be OK with it?


Nikpack
player of Zakuro and Pheer

>>I'm curious. Of those who have tried asking for payment upfront, how often do people balk? Have you ever had people accept and be OK with it?

It depends on where you try it really. In the Empath guild, people just ignore Szrael about 75% of the time -- they just keep hitting their "may i be healed" macro without saying anything to her.

About 10% of the time someone -- a lot of times just a bystander -- will say something like,

"Coden asks, 'What has this guild turned into while i've been gone?'"

And start going off about how Empaths have a duty/obligation whatever to heal people. This may or may not lead to violence.

Basically, asking up front never works when there are other Empaths around. Szrael generally doesn't ask unless she's the only Empath there (seller's market) or she knows the other Empaths are unlikely to heal either.

Szrael adjusts her rate for what she thinks the person can afford. 5 plat is the most she's ever asked from someone.

But basically, asking up front doesn't work. People are seemingly fundamentally opposed to paying Empaths up front. They seem to think the Empath should be happy with whatever they choose to give (many times nothing.)

For Szrael, it's just a mechanism to make sure the healing is worth her time, since she can be doing other things and doesn't really care if the person gets healed or not.

-- Player of Szrael --

---

You grip the oversized book hanging from your leather belt and survey the area with a hint of malice in your eyes.

With a violent cross-body motion, you draw your oversized book.

>>Its all the hugging, giggling, chatting with their friends and so on that happens between saying they'll heal me and actually doing it that's the annoyance.

I never, ever heal immediately. It usually happens in spurts, but it's never failed yet that when I try to make it a point to heal immediately the patient didn't want me to take a bleeder or something.

DISCLAIMER: THIS POSTER IS NOT A MEMBER OF STAFF AND HIS INFORMATION IS/MIGHT BE WRONG.

Szrael I think you are one of few empaths who I believe is taking the guild in the direction I've always wanted it to go. For a long time I've been telling folks that are dragged in unconscious(sparring) that I want payment up front for healing. I will usually do dead folks for free by my own choice.. as I know how that feels. If someone doesn't tip appropriately to their hunting level or amount of wounds healed I simply won't reply to their requests any longer.

This feeling most recently reared it's head as I spent several days in Crossing backtraining teaching for my next few circles. I felt no obligation what so ever to heal - firstly because I don't need empathy - power walking is way more effective - and secondly because the other empaths seemed to reinforce those who came in with "gimme more wounds" syndrome.

As far as raising NPC empath prices - I think a "Sorry about the price gauging we're in a recession." response from Quentin would be priceless.

I think Emps should be nerf'd.




-liiililillliili-

I was going to start a new topic, but I think I'll just add a twist to this one.

What if one of the, "Pay up front" Empaths actually start pulling their own fellow Empaths out of the guildhall because they were willing to heal for a tip and not charge up front?

Let me give you the situation of what the Empath's guild is like late at night...well, one night at least.

First, My character spoke to this fourth circle Paladin who was whining to my character because he was booted out of the guild due to being rude. He admitted he was rude, but only in response to how he was treated.

According to him, he asked if a healer was available, and was told by an Empath, "1 Gold Kronar". So, he didn't have a gold to pay on him. So he asked again (He said s/he pointed at him then, which he didn't understand), and another Empath told him, "At least 1 Gold Dokora", so he asked a few more times, during which he was being laughed at and tormented. Then he did get rude because he thought his honor was being questioned by the Empaths and their friends.

At which point he was thumped and then thrown out of the guild. Where one of the empaths followed him and continued to torment him.

So, after that story...I decided to send my character in to see what all the hubbub was about. I mean, he did have a few scratches anyway.

He walked in, asked for healing and got the same response as the person he spoke to on the street. "1 Gold Kronar". To which my character laughed because he'd never tip just one gold not at this point in his career.

He asked again, and another Empath agreed and started healing him. At which point the other, 'charge first' Empaths started questioning this guy's loyalty to the guild and other taunts and threats.

Somehow my character got drug out and spam stunned over and over by some Moon Mage friend of the two empaths in question. The Empath healing me came out to continue healing while my character was being stunned, and he was put to sleep then drug away by one of the "charging Empaths".

Afterward we all returned and got into a heated discussion (which was awesome RP btw, no one broke character which is a rarity).

In my opinion it crosses the line. They have a right to charge but another empath has just as much right to do it for free, or accept a tip, or to not heal at all, if they don't want to.

Just wondering what you guys think about it and if that is acceptable behavior?

v/r
Bryan, player of Mordiazi

>>if that is acceptable behavior?

no, I don't think it is - charging up front however is their right but abusing empaths that don't I will agree is wrong. I think it's about 10 times worse to spam someone with dazzle because they disagree with you.

Bringing in your alt to do this for you is pretty bad as well, especially if it's somebody that loves to report for that type of thing because that's what the top roleplayers do nowadays.

I would however prefer to see a log of the encounter since there are two sides of every story and generally I have to say, the person that was "stunned for no reason" generally brings it on by throwing out insults and attacks.

~Arwinia

The Empath spellbook is a riddle trapped in an enigma hidden inside a lot of suck.-Armifer