KELLYM40
THW empath
05/22/2020 09:10 PM CDT
Thanks in advance for any insight folks can offer. I am currently a lvl 38 THW empath in plat, i enjoy swinging THW and the self healing is a bonus but i wonder if i might be better off rolling a THW warrior. My main issue is low DS since i am currently using 4x brig and a +8 claid.
I really looking for assurance that this path is viable for cap, i dont expect to be the best hunter/healer or ubber powerful, but i enjoy the character but would hate to realize later that I would have better playing a warrior since thats the fighting style i enjoy, I just dont want to have to rely on spells as a warrior, but maybe thats my trade off with this THW empath. Thanks again
OM1E5GA
Re: THW empath
05/23/2020 05:00 AM CDT
THW as an empath is considered a mutant path, so you're generally going to have to be more selective with where you hunt and it will be more challenging then a warrior using THW. That said, there have been several empaths that have gone all the way to cap with that build.... including a well known halfling empath that swung a claid.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
IMSATI
Re: THW empath
05/24/2020 11:50 AM CDT
Not sure what the conditions are in Plat and prefer polepaths to THW, but I recall Arctic Titans and Frost Giants being stupid easy in Prime. Also, the Miasmal Forrest and Carrack in RR was good hunting too. Just be prepared to stance dance and don't take on a group. What race? Standard training plan?
JTU
Re: THW empath
05/24/2020 09:50 PM CDT
I leveled a THW empath from lvl 1 to 100. It is a viable path for cap.
My experience at your level, hunting self spelled, was that my DS was generally ok in defensive, but getting hit in offensive would hurt and cause stuns. Getting some crit padding on the armor will help with the times you do get hit, something like "somewhat" level of crit padding is enough to make a difference. Your best bet is to not get hit at all since you're not a warrior in plate. Learning to stance dance and time your attacks will help a bit with that. As your level becomes higher, most critters you kill should be disabled anyway before you even swing your weapon, so that they have no chance to hit you at all.
At 38, I would use the warding version of web to disable the stuff that I could ward reliably (possibly followed up with a feint) and just attack with my weapon. I'd use 117 on myself and stun with a big hit on the critters that I can not reliably ward, which usually occur when I overhunt - when I use this tactic I may wait for the critter to swing first for their stance to drop so long as it's safe to do so. This strategy works even better when I was able to aim legs reliably. Caster type critters with DS too high for me to handle gets 1106 spam instead, which also conveniently stuns them. Sometimes you bump into stuff you just can't kill efficiently and you learn to ignore those, for me those tend to be either incorporeal undeads (like phantasma) or when I was overhunting caster critters whose DS and TD are both too high (seekers were like that for me).
I also want to add I started training in ambush in my mid 40s and it greatly improved my ability to kill stuff. Even something like 5-7 ranks of ambush along with my 1x training in combat maneuvers allowed me to reliably leg things, which was very helpful. Eventually with higher ranks in both ambush and CM you can start experimenting with head shots. I spent most of my character's life with 10 to 15 ranks in ambush, and now that I'm capped I have 17 ranks and use a piece of enhancive with +7 ambush ranks to push it to 24.
I never used a claidh on my empath, but my impression is that it's one of those weapon bases that are pretty hard to aim. If you do decide to try out open ambushing, you might want to experiment with different weapon bases. My experience is that the maul is the most mechanically powerful if you don't care about looks. Flamberge is fine for anything not wearing plate, and is slightly easier to aim than the maul if you prefer your character to use a big sword. Greatsword is noticeably harder to aim than the maul, I can manage leg shots easily with them, but it took about 100 combat maneuver ranks and 24 ambush ranks to get the accuracy to be tolerable on head shots. Katanas & bastard swords don't hit hard enough to be useful.
My experience at your level, hunting self spelled, was that my DS was generally ok in defensive, but getting hit in offensive would hurt and cause stuns. Getting some crit padding on the armor will help with the times you do get hit, something like "somewhat" level of crit padding is enough to make a difference. Your best bet is to not get hit at all since you're not a warrior in plate. Learning to stance dance and time your attacks will help a bit with that. As your level becomes higher, most critters you kill should be disabled anyway before you even swing your weapon, so that they have no chance to hit you at all.
At 38, I would use the warding version of web to disable the stuff that I could ward reliably (possibly followed up with a feint) and just attack with my weapon. I'd use 117 on myself and stun with a big hit on the critters that I can not reliably ward, which usually occur when I overhunt - when I use this tactic I may wait for the critter to swing first for their stance to drop so long as it's safe to do so. This strategy works even better when I was able to aim legs reliably. Caster type critters with DS too high for me to handle gets 1106 spam instead, which also conveniently stuns them. Sometimes you bump into stuff you just can't kill efficiently and you learn to ignore those, for me those tend to be either incorporeal undeads (like phantasma) or when I was overhunting caster critters whose DS and TD are both too high (seekers were like that for me).
I also want to add I started training in ambush in my mid 40s and it greatly improved my ability to kill stuff. Even something like 5-7 ranks of ambush along with my 1x training in combat maneuvers allowed me to reliably leg things, which was very helpful. Eventually with higher ranks in both ambush and CM you can start experimenting with head shots. I spent most of my character's life with 10 to 15 ranks in ambush, and now that I'm capped I have 17 ranks and use a piece of enhancive with +7 ambush ranks to push it to 24.
I never used a claidh on my empath, but my impression is that it's one of those weapon bases that are pretty hard to aim. If you do decide to try out open ambushing, you might want to experiment with different weapon bases. My experience is that the maul is the most mechanically powerful if you don't care about looks. Flamberge is fine for anything not wearing plate, and is slightly easier to aim than the maul if you prefer your character to use a big sword. Greatsword is noticeably harder to aim than the maul, I can manage leg shots easily with them, but it took about 100 combat maneuver ranks and 24 ambush ranks to get the accuracy to be tolerable on head shots. Katanas & bastard swords don't hit hard enough to be useful.
THROGG
Re: THW empath
05/25/2020 10:47 AM CDT
I have a capped Empath who is currently using a 7X maul, although she also has a 2X claidh. Rather a bit of a mutant, as she also has 30 ranks of MOC. Amusing to do an open MStrike when doing bandit bounties with friends. This also pretty much eliminates the FoF effect except from overly large swarms. However, as mentioned, some sort of disabler
should be used prior to doing such a thing. I like Sympathy for multiple foes; doesn't last long but the critters will spend at least one round swinging at each other, giving a window of opportunity for that MStrike. Web is, of course, ideal for use on single opponents.
Compared to a warrior, a Warpath will be wearing much lighter armor, however, at or near cap your magical skills should be great enough that you don't have to worry about wearing outside spells in spellburst areas. Also, I have been playing for a while and had amassed a fair amount ot Premium points, so I took some 7X armor ... a freebie enchant by my Wizard ... and added HCP to it.
Using CM and Ambush for open aiming is an interesting concept, which I have never experimented with.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
should be used prior to doing such a thing. I like Sympathy for multiple foes; doesn't last long but the critters will spend at least one round swinging at each other, giving a window of opportunity for that MStrike. Web is, of course, ideal for use on single opponents.
Compared to a warrior, a Warpath will be wearing much lighter armor, however, at or near cap your magical skills should be great enough that you don't have to worry about wearing outside spells in spellburst areas. Also, I have been playing for a while and had amassed a fair amount ot Premium points, so I took some 7X armor ... a freebie enchant by my Wizard ... and added HCP to it.
Using CM and Ambush for open aiming is an interesting concept, which I have never experimented with.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
JTU
Re: THW empath
05/25/2020 11:19 AM CDT
I really like open ambushing on my warpath. On stuff like triton radicals and combatants, it's often a one hit one kill deal. 118 or 1108 to disable, followed by maul to face.
1108 is a very pleasant surprise for me when I got closer to cap, too. With level + 21 ranks in empath spells and 40-50 ranks in telepathy lore, it's a really nice disabler. Half the cost of web and powered by my much higher empath CS, instead of minor spirit CS.
1108 is a very pleasant surprise for me when I got closer to cap, too. With level + 21 ranks in empath spells and 40-50 ranks in telepathy lore, it's a really nice disabler. Half the cost of web and powered by my much higher empath CS, instead of minor spirit CS.
LEAFIARA
Re: THW empath
05/25/2020 01:30 PM CDT
Warpaths work at every level. Only three things to add to what's already been said:
1 - The very next day after your post, the mana formula was changed to give drastically more mana at low levels, which makes warpaths even more amazing than they already were since now they can get their disablers going earlier and more often.
2 - You were questioning the idea of having regrets later and wondering if you should have played a warrior. These are such different things that I almost hesitate to even compare them (I say this having a level 92 warrior and a post-cap warpath). It's true the warrior doesn't have to use spells, but they do still often have to make use of Feint or even Disarm as setup. Also, in some ways I found my warpath more satisfying than my warrior, despite the lower AS, since a warrior has to deal with more cases of enemy EBP (evade, block, parry) than an empath who can just cast Web (or Bind against enemies who can't be webbed) and then connect with hits almost every time. This does taper off a bit at cap where many enemies will have too high TDs to be immobilized, but...
3 - ...by the time you're in post-cap life, or honestly even a bit before that, you'll have the mana for regular 1117. With even just 5 or 15 ranks of MOC, it'll be one of your greatest experiences in GS combat.
IMO, empaths are the coolest profession in the game design-wise by a long shot and I hope you enjoy yours. (Note I didn't say strongest, but they're not far off there either!)
1 - The very next day after your post, the mana formula was changed to give drastically more mana at low levels, which makes warpaths even more amazing than they already were since now they can get their disablers going earlier and more often.
2 - You were questioning the idea of having regrets later and wondering if you should have played a warrior. These are such different things that I almost hesitate to even compare them (I say this having a level 92 warrior and a post-cap warpath). It's true the warrior doesn't have to use spells, but they do still often have to make use of Feint or even Disarm as setup. Also, in some ways I found my warpath more satisfying than my warrior, despite the lower AS, since a warrior has to deal with more cases of enemy EBP (evade, block, parry) than an empath who can just cast Web (or Bind against enemies who can't be webbed) and then connect with hits almost every time. This does taper off a bit at cap where many enemies will have too high TDs to be immobilized, but...
3 - ...by the time you're in post-cap life, or honestly even a bit before that, you'll have the mana for regular 1117. With even just 5 or 15 ranks of MOC, it'll be one of your greatest experiences in GS combat.
IMO, empaths are the coolest profession in the game design-wise by a long shot and I hope you enjoy yours. (Note I didn't say strongest, but they're not far off there either!)
IMSATI
Re: THW empath
05/25/2020 02:24 PM CDT
Moving up to 5x brig and/or something with crit padding helps too. Are you dead-set on using a claid? Why only +8?
BREAUX
Re: THW empath
02/16/2021 08:52 AM CST
Why only +8 claid? Do ora claidhmores fall out of the sky or something? A +8 claid is 5 million silvers in prime and probably twice as expensive in plat, given the horrible hoarder's economy over there.
