Previous
Would it be possible for magic users to get a guild "pass" when they are given tasks that are for magic immune critters? It's very frustrating when you are in gift and get magic immune critters multiple times in a row, IE: the guild has tasked you to kill 17 warlocks, the guild has tasked you to find a grizzled warlock, the guild has tasked you to kill 22 warlocks....it's frustrating to sit for 15 min for a new task but then to have the same damn one or same critter given to you is worse.
You also see the Shilarra disk etched with the image of a Vathor
WINTERMYST
KRAKII
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/13/2015 09:45 AM CDT
Silly question, perhaps, but... could you not go out and do something else for that 15 minutes? Catch up on your Enchanting projects, chit-chat with buddies in town, maybe even go out and wax the plows of something non-Adventurer-Guild-task related?
CLUNK24963
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/13/2015 06:06 PM CDT
or even maybe, learn to forge?
Forging is a great filler for inbetween adventures. :)
Clunk
(Buy your swords at CBD weapons in Zul Logoth.)
ARIETTA
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/13/2015 07:34 PM CDT
In addition to the aforementioned suggestions...you could also purchase some Bounty Task Vouchers from the SimuCoin store. A mere 75 SimuCoins gets you a book of 10. Very handy for skipping those troublesome tasks when you're in a rush. :)
~ GtG and minions
~ GtG and minions
DAID
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/14/2015 12:15 AM CDT
Definitely appreciate the frustration here. Unfortunately not all tasks are designed to be equally easy for all characters. Some professions have major advantages for foraging, some are terrible at bandits, others have better AoE options for child rescues, etc. I always found the looting tasks on non-corporeal dissipating undead to be a nuisance on any non-magical class.
>In addition to the aforementioned suggestions...you could also purchase some Bounty Task Vouchers from the SimuCoin store. A mere 75 SimuCoins gets you a book of 10. Very handy for skipping those troublesome tasks when you're in a rush. :)
It's a pretty good option. I use them for my disliked tasks only while gifting, and the book of 100 is still running since the SimuCoins release on two characters.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>In addition to the aforementioned suggestions...you could also purchase some Bounty Task Vouchers from the SimuCoin store. A mere 75 SimuCoins gets you a book of 10. Very handy for skipping those troublesome tasks when you're in a rush. :)
It's a pretty good option. I use them for my disliked tasks only while gifting, and the book of 100 is still running since the SimuCoins release on two characters.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
WINTERMYST
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/14/2015 07:40 AM CDT
<In addition to the aforementioned suggestions...you could also purchase some Bounty Task Vouchers from the SimuCoin store. A mere 75 SimuCoins gets you a book of 10. Very handy for skipping those troublesome tasks when you're in a rush. :)>
That's not the point has nothing to do with being in a rush or not being able to just go hunt, when you do not have enough skinning knowledge you are not assigned skinning tasks, if you do not wield a weapon that can damage a critter you should not be assigned those tasks.
I have no issue buying task vouchers, IF I don't wish to do a task say as take an escort from Icemule to Vaalor, I am making the choice of not wanting to complete that task, however when being assigned a critter to kill that is magic immune I am not refusing to do the task I have no ability to do so, so why should I have to spend rl money to pass it, it is not by choice I am refusing it.
You also see the Shilarra disk etched with the image of a Vathor
That's not the point has nothing to do with being in a rush or not being able to just go hunt, when you do not have enough skinning knowledge you are not assigned skinning tasks, if you do not wield a weapon that can damage a critter you should not be assigned those tasks.
I have no issue buying task vouchers, IF I don't wish to do a task say as take an escort from Icemule to Vaalor, I am making the choice of not wanting to complete that task, however when being assigned a critter to kill that is magic immune I am not refusing to do the task I have no ability to do so, so why should I have to spend rl money to pass it, it is not by choice I am refusing it.
You also see the Shilarra disk etched with the image of a Vathor
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/14/2015 03:54 PM CDT
I'm pretty sure the OP wasn't asking you folks what you like to do with your time. Cut the nonsense and call it what it is: poor design. Not a game-breaker, certainly. But poor design nonetheless. As Wintermyst points out, we don't assign first aid tasks to folks without first aid skill. Why send someone with no weapon skills to kill a monster that can only be killed by weapons?
Either way, I don't think the answer to poor design is to tell people to find something else to do with their time. I think we all know where that road leads.
~Taverkin
Either way, I don't think the answer to poor design is to tell people to find something else to do with their time. I think we all know where that road leads.
~Taverkin
KRAKII
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/14/2015 04:00 PM CDT
I'm perfectly alright with building in more skill checks.
(Now with that said, I would be totally against having enough skill checks such that it were possible for a character to TOTALLY AVOID all possible Guild bounties but the one single one that they want. You want to duck out of everything, you need to pay for it, be it by time or 'coin or whatever.)
However, someone posting that he has NO RECOURSE but to just sit there like a bump for the fifteen minutes before it can be turned in, no. That's all on him.
(Now with that said, I would be totally against having enough skill checks such that it were possible for a character to TOTALLY AVOID all possible Guild bounties but the one single one that they want. You want to duck out of everything, you need to pay for it, be it by time or 'coin or whatever.)
However, someone posting that he has NO RECOURSE but to just sit there like a bump for the fifteen minutes before it can be turned in, no. That's all on him.
ARIETTA
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/14/2015 07:54 PM CDT
<<<I have no issue buying task vouchers, IF I don't wish to do a task say as take an escort from Icemule to Vaalor, I am making the choice of not wanting to complete that task, however when being assigned a critter to kill that is magic immune I am not refusing to do the task I have no ability to do so, so why should I have to spend rl money to pass it, it is not by choice I am refusing it.>>>
The problem is, you're asking for something that would then create a very slippery slope. For example:
Ranged Users should be exempt from tasks involving puncture-resistant or non-corporeal creatures.
Squares who can't bless weapons should be exempt from undead bounties.
Characters with poor or zero perception should be exempt from searching for heirlooms.
Characters with poor or zero climbing/swimming should be exempt from bounties in locations that require climbing/swimming.
UAC characters should be exempt from creatures (like lesser vruul) that hurt you if you hit them without a weapon.
I could go on and on, but you get the point. Things could get ridiculous pretty fast.
I'm sympathetic to the problem, and wouldn't be hurt if the GMs decided to fix this particular issue. But I wouldn't hold my breath. In the meantime, there are perfectly feasible solutions (i.e. task vouchers).
~ GtG and minions
The problem is, you're asking for something that would then create a very slippery slope. For example:
Ranged Users should be exempt from tasks involving puncture-resistant or non-corporeal creatures.
Squares who can't bless weapons should be exempt from undead bounties.
Characters with poor or zero perception should be exempt from searching for heirlooms.
Characters with poor or zero climbing/swimming should be exempt from bounties in locations that require climbing/swimming.
UAC characters should be exempt from creatures (like lesser vruul) that hurt you if you hit them without a weapon.
I could go on and on, but you get the point. Things could get ridiculous pretty fast.
I'm sympathetic to the problem, and wouldn't be hurt if the GMs decided to fix this particular issue. But I wouldn't hold my breath. In the meantime, there are perfectly feasible solutions (i.e. task vouchers).
~ GtG and minions
WINTERMYST
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 08:29 AM CDT
<However, someone posting that he has NO RECOURSE but to just sit there like a bump for the fifteen minutes before it can be turned in, no. That's all on him.>
I never once stated that there was nothing I could do, please reread the post I stated stated...it's frustrating to sit for 15 min for a new task but then to have the same damn one or same critter given to you is worse. That means waiting for a new guild task, NOT meaning have nothing to do. What is worse is waiting for a new guild task and having the same one reassigned, which means now you are waiting for half an hour for a task.
<Ranged Users should be exempt from tasks involving puncture-resistant or non-corporeal creatures.> I play a capped ranger, nothing I can't hit with arrows including demons
<Squares who can't bless weapons should be exempt from undead bounties.> Squares can get weapons blessed by any Volner or Cleric
<Characters with poor or zero perception should be exempt from searching for heirlooms.> Perceptions helps but does not stop you from being able to search for an heirloom, I have chars with zero perception and can find a heirloom.
<Characters with poor or zero climbing/swimming should be exempt from bounties in locations that require climbing/swimming.> That is a choice to make not to get climbing and swimming in a land that requires it, though that can even be circumvented by asking a sorcerer to gate you or a wizard to gate you.
<UAC characters should be exempt from creatures (like lesser vruul) that hurt you if you hit them without a weapon.> All creatures are designed to hurt you, best example I can think of is fire mages, they hurt you when they die, that again is a choice of hunting them or not.
It is not a choice when you are a pure, something that was designed to not not be able to hit magic immune critters.
You also see the Shilarra disk etched with the image of a Vathor
I never once stated that there was nothing I could do, please reread the post I stated stated...it's frustrating to sit for 15 min for a new task but then to have the same damn one or same critter given to you is worse. That means waiting for a new guild task, NOT meaning have nothing to do. What is worse is waiting for a new guild task and having the same one reassigned, which means now you are waiting for half an hour for a task.
<Ranged Users should be exempt from tasks involving puncture-resistant or non-corporeal creatures.> I play a capped ranger, nothing I can't hit with arrows including demons
<Squares who can't bless weapons should be exempt from undead bounties.> Squares can get weapons blessed by any Volner or Cleric
<Characters with poor or zero perception should be exempt from searching for heirlooms.> Perceptions helps but does not stop you from being able to search for an heirloom, I have chars with zero perception and can find a heirloom.
<Characters with poor or zero climbing/swimming should be exempt from bounties in locations that require climbing/swimming.> That is a choice to make not to get climbing and swimming in a land that requires it, though that can even be circumvented by asking a sorcerer to gate you or a wizard to gate you.
<UAC characters should be exempt from creatures (like lesser vruul) that hurt you if you hit them without a weapon.> All creatures are designed to hurt you, best example I can think of is fire mages, they hurt you when they die, that again is a choice of hunting them or not.
It is not a choice when you are a pure, something that was designed to not not be able to hit magic immune critters.
You also see the Shilarra disk etched with the image of a Vathor
KRAKII
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 08:54 AM CDT
It's almost like reading a text game. :)
"Sit for 15 minutes" has the implicit sense of you... sitting there.
"Sit for 15 minutes" has the implicit sense of you... sitting there.
RUFUSMORAY
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 09:39 AM CDT
So... Devil's Advocate here:
<That is a choice to make not to get climbing and swimming in a land that requires it>
Technically so is not having weapon skills in a land that has magic immune creatures... All characters have access to weapons. And if you know the right people even if your weapon skill sucks a 117 combined with a warrior disabling your target, you'd likely be able to scratch the magic immune thing and have the warrior finish it off. (Use a 4x naginata, with one rank of skill for best AvD and bonuses.) Technically that's a work around you can do in game...
In all honesty, I understand the frustration. I just don't think it is worth the time and effort to change the mechanics of the guild assignments. I've definitely gotten magic immune things on characters that couldn't do those quests. I dropped them and moved on. I can say I'm sorry you were so unlucky to get multiple ones in a row, but one of two things seems to have happened there from my perspective.
1) You just were horribly unlucky. Like rolling snake eyes three times in a row.
2) The magic immune creatures are the best thing in your level range in that area and thus are the most likely thing assigned to you... which means you need to go to another adventure guild.
It does end up in a slippery slope as people will start finding reasons to say "I shouldn't have to do x bounty." The end result really seems to be that it isn't worth the effort of changing the code for a fringe situation. While frustrating and unlucky, it just isn't a real flaw in the system.
TROUBLE13
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 12:10 PM CDT
>>Technically so is not having weapon skills in a land that has magic immune creatures... All characters have access to weapons.
Except that even as a weapon using pure you are still going to have a devil of a time fighting witches and warlocks in the rift who tend to have unusually high defenses due to spells. And because of their magic immunity you can't use spells to disable or dispel them. Because of this I can't think of any weapon using pure that actually took those tasks and kept them.
Except that even as a weapon using pure you are still going to have a devil of a time fighting witches and warlocks in the rift who tend to have unusually high defenses due to spells. And because of their magic immunity you can't use spells to disable or dispel them. Because of this I can't think of any weapon using pure that actually took those tasks and kept them.
RUFUSMORAY
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 12:33 PM CDT
My response was more to the fact that you suggested outside help for undead creatures or other things like that which require certain outside spells or skills that the person didn't choose to train in.
202 Ranks in Weapon ~ 303 AS.
101 Ranks in Weapon ~ 201 AS.
Add in a blue crystal, train your Earth lore for bonuses to strength, yaddy yaddy. (Obviously over doing this, not meaning to be 100% serious.) And you CAN get your AS high enough to do those. Also, as I stated before, bring a warrior along to knock down the enemy and it becomes much more doable.
Like I said. I feel your pain. I hate Stone Gargoyles... glad I'm not doing those suckers anymore. To be honest I stopped doing bounties in landing for a while because I seemed to get those and then later vortices (Or whatever they are called) on my sorcerer.
I guess my main point is I don't see it being a big enough issue to devote resources to. Simu has always been lacking in resources and I'm sure a change to a core system like the Adventure guild would require a decent amount of time, QA, and design.
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 01:16 PM CDT
<The problem is, you're asking for something that would then create a very slippery slope. For example:
<Ranged Users should be exempt from tasks involving puncture-resistant or non-corporeal creatures.
<Squares who can't bless weapons should be exempt from undead bounties.
<Characters with poor or zero perception should be exempt from searching for heirlooms.
<Characters with poor or zero climbing/swimming should be exempt from bounties in locations that require climbing/swimming.
<UAC characters should be exempt from creatures (like lesser vruul) that hurt you if you hit them without a weapon.
There is no slippery slope. We already have a precedent for this in skinning tasks and nobody is asking for any of the things you've mentioned here. The items listed don't logically follow the request.
~Taverkin
<Ranged Users should be exempt from tasks involving puncture-resistant or non-corporeal creatures.
<Squares who can't bless weapons should be exempt from undead bounties.
<Characters with poor or zero perception should be exempt from searching for heirlooms.
<Characters with poor or zero climbing/swimming should be exempt from bounties in locations that require climbing/swimming.
<UAC characters should be exempt from creatures (like lesser vruul) that hurt you if you hit them without a weapon.
There is no slippery slope. We already have a precedent for this in skinning tasks and nobody is asking for any of the things you've mentioned here. The items listed don't logically follow the request.
~Taverkin
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 01:19 PM CDT
From an RP perspective I'm not sure why the Adv Guild would bother to cater to any individual anyway. They have a mission that needs to be done, they offer it to you in hopes that you'll take it. Sure they could try and match up each task to the adventurer but hey - this is a frontier town, things are rough, townsfolk are hungry, people don't have enough deeds! Take or leave it, if you want to pass on the current opportunity then back to the end of the line with you!
That said, I think it would be an interesting idea to allow someone to spend Bounty Points to bypass the 15 minute wait. The logic being that you are a regular and are willing to forgo some of your reward (whatever you would have purchased with said bounty points) in order to move to the front of the line again.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
That said, I think it would be an interesting idea to allow someone to spend Bounty Points to bypass the 15 minute wait. The logic being that you are a regular and are willing to forgo some of your reward (whatever you would have purchased with said bounty points) in order to move to the front of the line again.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 01:20 PM CDT
<I guess my main point is I don't see it being a big enough issue to devote resources to. Simu has always been lacking in resources and I'm sure a change to a core system like the Adventure <guild would require a decent amount of time, QA, and design.
Why don't we let the GMs determine that? I realize you aren't the only one doing this, but part of the reason we have so little participation on these forums could have something to do with the fact that anything one says is routinely struck down by other players who have little else to say but that it's not a priority to them and therefore not deserving of whatever amount of resources may be required to make it happen.
FWIW, poor designs are a pet peeve for me and this one personally affects me as a Rift hunter. If it isn't too much trouble, I would like to see Vvrael removed from my task list so I can pick up lich tasks without getting destroyers.
~Taverkin
Why don't we let the GMs determine that? I realize you aren't the only one doing this, but part of the reason we have so little participation on these forums could have something to do with the fact that anything one says is routinely struck down by other players who have little else to say but that it's not a priority to them and therefore not deserving of whatever amount of resources may be required to make it happen.
FWIW, poor designs are a pet peeve for me and this one personally affects me as a Rift hunter. If it isn't too much trouble, I would like to see Vvrael removed from my task list so I can pick up lich tasks without getting destroyers.
~Taverkin
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 01:22 PM CDT
<From an RP perspective I'm not sure why the Adv Guild would bother to cater to any individual anyway. They have a mission that needs to be done, they offer it to you in hopes that you'll take <it. Sure they could try and match up each task to the adventurer but hey - this is a frontier town, things are rough, townsfolk are hungry, people don't have enough deeds! Take or leave it, <if you want to pass on the current opportunity then back to the end of the line with you!
From an RP perspective, that makes about as much sense as pointing out that they have an interest in your success. So why assign you a task you have 0 chance of completing?
~Taverkin
From an RP perspective, that makes about as much sense as pointing out that they have an interest in your success. So why assign you a task you have 0 chance of completing?
~Taverkin
TROUBLE13
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 01:27 PM CDT
>>From an RP perspective I'm not sure why the Adv Guild would bother to cater to any individual anyway. They have a mission that needs to be done, they offer it to you in hopes that you'll take it.
One could also look at it as they have many missions to complete and they'll offer you one that you could reasonably complete. Like in the same way that you don't hire a roofer to fix your flooring.
One could also look at it as they have many missions to complete and they'll offer you one that you could reasonably complete. Like in the same way that you don't hire a roofer to fix your flooring.
RUFUSMORAY
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 02:11 PM CDT
Honestly it would be much more reasonable to assume that they would fit the bounty to the profession for RP reasons. Need locks picked? Hire a rogue! Need walls knocked down? Hire a warrior! Ghosts haunting your house? WHO YOU GUNNA CALL!
Either they would tailor to professions or it would be a giant bulletin board of jobs and you would snag one. But I guess there is some RP to a giant nation spanning organization that can only be bothered to interact with you every 15 minutes and if you don't like what they say putting you on hold for another 15 minutes... lol
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 02:34 PM CDT
If they had a bulletin board of current bounties then I suspect all the 'popular' bounties would be gone and there would be a lot of unpopular bounties to choose from. We can all stand around at the board waiting for the 'good' bounty to be posted and then see whose 'grab it' macro is faster.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
KRAKII
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 02:36 PM CDT
"They have a mission that needs to be done, they offer it to you in hopes that you'll take <it. Sure they could try and match up each task to the adventurer but hey - this is a frontier town, things are rough, townsfolk are hungry, people don't have enough deeds! Take or leave it, <if you want to pass on the current opportunity then back to the end of the line with you!
From an RP perspective, that makes about as much sense as pointing out that they have an interest in your success." -- BlackKobold, quoting and replying to PeregrineFalcon
That's daft, and you know it.
"HI, I'm here to fix your roof!"
"My roof is fine. I called about my plumbing."
"Nope, I'm here to fix your roof!"
These are the four things that my Journeyman supervisor has told me need to get done today: cooking, cleaning, database programming, and engine work on the GuildMaster's car. These are the four tasks that I'm giving out. I will pay for them.
"Hi, I'm here to prepare your tax return!"
"Hi, I'm here to fix your phone!"
"Hi, I'm here to kill non-magic-immune living creatures with both boxable treasure and skins, that are known to carry weapons!"
"Hi, I'm here to connect your cable!"
Not a single one of them does me any good to getting cooking, cleaning, database programming, or engine work done.
Fifteen minutes from now, I'll try again. I will have the same four tasks on offer for work, and be offering the same rewards.
.
You tell me which attitude is more believable in a Guild-ridden frontier medieval-esque town.
From an RP perspective, that makes about as much sense as pointing out that they have an interest in your success." -- BlackKobold, quoting and replying to PeregrineFalcon
That's daft, and you know it.
"HI, I'm here to fix your roof!"
"My roof is fine. I called about my plumbing."
"Nope, I'm here to fix your roof!"
These are the four things that my Journeyman supervisor has told me need to get done today: cooking, cleaning, database programming, and engine work on the GuildMaster's car. These are the four tasks that I'm giving out. I will pay for them.
"Hi, I'm here to prepare your tax return!"
"Hi, I'm here to fix your phone!"
"Hi, I'm here to kill non-magic-immune living creatures with both boxable treasure and skins, that are known to carry weapons!"
"Hi, I'm here to connect your cable!"
Not a single one of them does me any good to getting cooking, cleaning, database programming, or engine work done.
Fifteen minutes from now, I'll try again. I will have the same four tasks on offer for work, and be offering the same rewards.
.
You tell me which attitude is more believable in a Guild-ridden frontier medieval-esque town.
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 05:35 PM CDT
<That's daft, and you know it.
<"HI, I'm here to fix your roof!"
<"My roof is fine. I called about my plumbing."
<"Nope, I'm here to fix your roof!"
More like...
Adventurer #1: "Hi! I'm here to fix your roof!"
Taskmaster: "Roof? Sorry, I only need plumbing work done."
Adventurer #1: "Darn! Okay, I'll be back in 15 minutes."
Adventurer #2 walks in 2 seconds later.
Adventurer #2: "Hi! I'm here to fix your roof!"
Taskmaster: "I'm so glad you're here! Our roof is leaking all over the place!"
Adventurer #2 (to Adventurer #1): "Wanna help me fix this roof?"
Adventurer #1: "It wasn't leaking 2 seconds ago, but whatever!"
Anyway, this is getting rather pointless. Is it too much to just admit that you don't really care one way or another what happens on this issue? If the system had been designed to automatically exclude casters from Vvrael tasks unless they have the requisite skillset, would you be here arguing for that to change on the basis of realism? I seriously doubt it. You folks are probably just bored and looking for something to talk about, huh?
~Taverkin
<"HI, I'm here to fix your roof!"
<"My roof is fine. I called about my plumbing."
<"Nope, I'm here to fix your roof!"
More like...
Adventurer #1: "Hi! I'm here to fix your roof!"
Taskmaster: "Roof? Sorry, I only need plumbing work done."
Adventurer #1: "Darn! Okay, I'll be back in 15 minutes."
Adventurer #2 walks in 2 seconds later.
Adventurer #2: "Hi! I'm here to fix your roof!"
Taskmaster: "I'm so glad you're here! Our roof is leaking all over the place!"
Adventurer #2 (to Adventurer #1): "Wanna help me fix this roof?"
Adventurer #1: "It wasn't leaking 2 seconds ago, but whatever!"
Anyway, this is getting rather pointless. Is it too much to just admit that you don't really care one way or another what happens on this issue? If the system had been designed to automatically exclude casters from Vvrael tasks unless they have the requisite skillset, would you be here arguing for that to change on the basis of realism? I seriously doubt it. You folks are probably just bored and looking for something to talk about, huh?
~Taverkin
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 06:18 PM CDT
>> Is it too much to just admit that you don't really care one way or another what happens on this issue?
I do care. I'd rather not see the system start determining for me which bounties I am and am not eligible for (outside of reasonable level restrictions). I already have the ability to make that determination for myself through accepting or declining the proposed assignment.
That said, I also offered a suggestion as to how people could expedite the option to decline a bounty they don't want through the use of Bounty Points. A solution along those lines is consistent with my viewpoint that 1) everyone should have an opportunity for all bounties 2) understanding that some people don't like certain bounties (regardless of the reasons which will number in the hundreds if not thousands) there should be ways to avoid them, for a price. (time, Simucoins, Bounty Points, etc).
We have Time and Simucoin costs in place, Bounty Points seem like a reasonable addition. If the game had more of a bribery skill/system in place I would be in favor of being able to use silvers as a means to expedite the decline process for a different bounty as well.
>> You folks are probably just bored and looking for something to talk about, huh?
I literally stopped and laughed out loud for nearly a full minute when I read this coming from you. Pot meet kettle?
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
I do care. I'd rather not see the system start determining for me which bounties I am and am not eligible for (outside of reasonable level restrictions). I already have the ability to make that determination for myself through accepting or declining the proposed assignment.
That said, I also offered a suggestion as to how people could expedite the option to decline a bounty they don't want through the use of Bounty Points. A solution along those lines is consistent with my viewpoint that 1) everyone should have an opportunity for all bounties 2) understanding that some people don't like certain bounties (regardless of the reasons which will number in the hundreds if not thousands) there should be ways to avoid them, for a price. (time, Simucoins, Bounty Points, etc).
We have Time and Simucoin costs in place, Bounty Points seem like a reasonable addition. If the game had more of a bribery skill/system in place I would be in favor of being able to use silvers as a means to expedite the decline process for a different bounty as well.
>> You folks are probably just bored and looking for something to talk about, huh?
I literally stopped and laughed out loud for nearly a full minute when I read this coming from you. Pot meet kettle?
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/15/2015 08:59 PM CDT
<I do care. I'd rather not see the system start determining for me which bounties I am and am not eligible for (outside of reasonable level restrictions). I already have the ability to make <that determination for myself through accepting or declining the proposed assignment.
This is not a choice being taken away from you as you are incapable of completing the task without the requisite skill. With skinning tasks at least you can buy the skins from others! But we still block those tasks automatically until you have at least .5x in combined first aid/survival skill because most players (I expect yourself included!) find receiving tasks for which they lack the requisite skills annoying.
<I literally stopped and laughed out loud for nearly a full minute when I read this coming from you. Pot meet kettle?
What? Did I exclude myself? I recognize the signs in others. Trust me. I don't often spend time on these forums unless I'm killing time!
~Taverkin
This is not a choice being taken away from you as you are incapable of completing the task without the requisite skill. With skinning tasks at least you can buy the skins from others! But we still block those tasks automatically until you have at least .5x in combined first aid/survival skill because most players (I expect yourself included!) find receiving tasks for which they lack the requisite skills annoying.
<I literally stopped and laughed out loud for nearly a full minute when I read this coming from you. Pot meet kettle?
What? Did I exclude myself? I recognize the signs in others. Trust me. I don't often spend time on these forums unless I'm killing time!
~Taverkin
DOUG
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/16/2015 02:41 AM CDT
I like groups! So, what's the deal? Wizard gets destroyer bounty - and asks someone (maybe even another wizard!) along to 'help', and in exchange, when that bounty's done, they'll work on whatever the 'other' gets as a bounty.
No muss, no waiting, Adventurer's Guild is happy, everyone's busy (perhaps only lending an 'assist') and. . . nothing 'needs' to change.
Well, almost nothing. . .
Doug
No muss, no waiting, Adventurer's Guild is happy, everyone's busy (perhaps only lending an 'assist') and. . . nothing 'needs' to change.
Well, almost nothing. . .
Doug
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/16/2015 09:25 AM CDT
It doesn't "need" to change, Doug. It would be nice if it did. And if it did, then we can still share whatever alternative task we received. Everyone's happy in that scenario, no? But let's keep up the resistance to something so very minor! It's so GS! I love it!
~Taverkin
~Taverkin
DOUG
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/16/2015 11:26 AM CDT
>>But let's keep up the resistance to something so very minor!
You really need to stop putting words in my mouth. I suspect you'll feel far better about yourself when you do.
I have no qualms seeing it change. I have no skin in the game with leaving it the same. Whether this is minor, or this is major in any single person's views, the pros and cons have been relatively fairly laid out. Besides being someone's pet peeve (which bespeaks of prejudicial understanding and probably should be very cautiously entertained) it seems to present as a fairly balanced scenario. So I'm not surprised at the responses, personally. If viewed from the perspective of the soloist. . .
I felt it necessary to add that there's a grouping component, as well. Like me or don't like me, but at least ascribe the proper motivations to me. Get the accusation straight! The pros and cons differ slightly, which just might tilt this thing one direction or the other. Instead of raging at others, and telling others to stop raging against you, you might try working to understand.
Oh, and. . . be happy. This is a happy place. Happy readings change how the happy posters' ideas the other side of the electron storm are understood. Smile happily.
It works. For a while. . .
Doug
You really need to stop putting words in my mouth. I suspect you'll feel far better about yourself when you do.
I have no qualms seeing it change. I have no skin in the game with leaving it the same. Whether this is minor, or this is major in any single person's views, the pros and cons have been relatively fairly laid out. Besides being someone's pet peeve (which bespeaks of prejudicial understanding and probably should be very cautiously entertained) it seems to present as a fairly balanced scenario. So I'm not surprised at the responses, personally. If viewed from the perspective of the soloist. . .
I felt it necessary to add that there's a grouping component, as well. Like me or don't like me, but at least ascribe the proper motivations to me. Get the accusation straight! The pros and cons differ slightly, which just might tilt this thing one direction or the other. Instead of raging at others, and telling others to stop raging against you, you might try working to understand.
Oh, and. . . be happy. This is a happy place. Happy readings change how the happy posters' ideas the other side of the electron storm are understood. Smile happily.
It works. For a while. . .
Doug
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/16/2015 08:56 PM CDT
<You really need to stop putting words in my mouth. I suspect you'll feel far better about yourself when you do.
And you need to stop applying your emotions to my posts. ;)
I'm not surprised by the responses either. As I said, it's SO GS! Make a suggestion to change something - ANYTHING! - and you will receive a bunch of unasked for suggestions on what you can do instead so that we don't have to change anything. Putting words in your mouth? I suppose you can choose to view it that way if you wish, but I'm really having trouble discerning the relevance of the suggestion to group up? It sure seems like the reaction I expected.
Personally, I think it would just be easier to stop giving those few magic immune tasks to characters without at least .5x in a weapon skill, just like we do for skinning tasks. Did you have an alternative resolution besides just dealing with it as we always have?
~Taverkin
And you need to stop applying your emotions to my posts. ;)
I'm not surprised by the responses either. As I said, it's SO GS! Make a suggestion to change something - ANYTHING! - and you will receive a bunch of unasked for suggestions on what you can do instead so that we don't have to change anything. Putting words in your mouth? I suppose you can choose to view it that way if you wish, but I'm really having trouble discerning the relevance of the suggestion to group up? It sure seems like the reaction I expected.
Personally, I think it would just be easier to stop giving those few magic immune tasks to characters without at least .5x in a weapon skill, just like we do for skinning tasks. Did you have an alternative resolution besides just dealing with it as we always have?
~Taverkin
DOUG
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 12:42 AM CDT
>>And you need to stop applying your emotions to my posts. ;)
Hmm. . . I'm not sure that's fair, but I'll take it and see what I can do with it.
>>I think it would just be easier to stop giving those few magic immune tasks to characters without at least .5x in a weapon skill
I think you're exactly right. My biggest personal hang up with this line of thinking is that this (meaning the game) isn't about 'being easy'. I suspect you mean ease of fixing, as opposed to ease of gaming - but I hope you'll pardon the observation that the thread started with the (my words) damage 15 minutes of waiting, two or more times in a row, caused to one's enjoyment. In that regard, I can see why some of the responses came out the way they did - there are some who like convenience in the game, and some who don't feel convenience is a prerequisite to the struggle.
I'd choose 'possible' versus 'easy' - with the same intent, skinning tasks quickly become nearly impossible to complete without the training, just as hunting magic immune creatures is without some requisite weapon skill. I'd also suggest, though, that 'two or three times in a row' doesn't seem to be present in any but one poster's view.
An alternate suggestion might be to simply force the last task completed / turned in being retained, and not offer it again immediately. No more 'two or three times' for any task. Of course, for those who luck out into the gem task two or three times in a row - that suggestion sounds offensive because it affects their game enjoyment.
The grouping suggestion should be explored a bit more, in my view, because of some of the differing pros. But, I'm not trying to drive this change - so that conversation will happen (or not!) as it will.
>>It sure seems like the reaction I expected.
I'm sorry it's so disappointing that I suggest group hunts as a cure for a lot of the ailments we feel we face. Some of my fondest memories are of group hunts, even within the last 6 months. I think I have a perspective on that. ;)
Doug
Hmm. . . I'm not sure that's fair, but I'll take it and see what I can do with it.
>>I think it would just be easier to stop giving those few magic immune tasks to characters without at least .5x in a weapon skill
I think you're exactly right. My biggest personal hang up with this line of thinking is that this (meaning the game) isn't about 'being easy'. I suspect you mean ease of fixing, as opposed to ease of gaming - but I hope you'll pardon the observation that the thread started with the (my words) damage 15 minutes of waiting, two or more times in a row, caused to one's enjoyment. In that regard, I can see why some of the responses came out the way they did - there are some who like convenience in the game, and some who don't feel convenience is a prerequisite to the struggle.
I'd choose 'possible' versus 'easy' - with the same intent, skinning tasks quickly become nearly impossible to complete without the training, just as hunting magic immune creatures is without some requisite weapon skill. I'd also suggest, though, that 'two or three times in a row' doesn't seem to be present in any but one poster's view.
An alternate suggestion might be to simply force the last task completed / turned in being retained, and not offer it again immediately. No more 'two or three times' for any task. Of course, for those who luck out into the gem task two or three times in a row - that suggestion sounds offensive because it affects their game enjoyment.
The grouping suggestion should be explored a bit more, in my view, because of some of the differing pros. But, I'm not trying to drive this change - so that conversation will happen (or not!) as it will.
>>It sure seems like the reaction I expected.
I'm sorry it's so disappointing that I suggest group hunts as a cure for a lot of the ailments we feel we face. Some of my fondest memories are of group hunts, even within the last 6 months. I think I have a perspective on that. ;)
Doug
FREEPLAY1
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 02:48 AM CDT
<<The grouping suggestion should be explored a bit more, in my view, because of some of the differing pros. But, I'm not trying to drive this change - so that conversation will happen (or not!) as it will.>>
You also run a group of post-cap characters. Not everyone wants to do that, or can do it. The game shouldn't be based upon your MAing, it should be based upon a solo perspective like the majority of people play.
DAID
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 04:32 AM CDT
I agree with both the concepts that this proposed change would be nice, and that it's a slippery slope.
Why should sorcerers (and wizards...except they have haste) be assigned foraging bounties in theory? We have worse penalties than any other profession.
I think this would make more sense as a component to a comprehensive proposal to update the guild, in the guild folder. Making one tweak here or there makes it difficult for me to get on board when there are other issues lurking which aren't too different, as pointed out in various posts.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>Daid: Pretty sure you have a whole big bucket as your penny jar. You never have only two cents. :p
Why should sorcerers (and wizards...except they have haste) be assigned foraging bounties in theory? We have worse penalties than any other profession.
I think this would make more sense as a component to a comprehensive proposal to update the guild, in the guild folder. Making one tweak here or there makes it difficult for me to get on board when there are other issues lurking which aren't too different, as pointed out in various posts.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>Daid: Pretty sure you have a whole big bucket as your penny jar. You never have only two cents. :p
DOUG
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 08:47 AM CDT
>>You also run a group of post-cap characters. Not everyone wants to do that, or can do it. The game shouldn't be based upon your MAing, it should be based upon a solo perspective like the majority of people play.
This is rather amazing. There are 5 incorrect premises in your three short sentences. I'm quite sure that's a new record.
1) I have several post cap characters (and many more not chapped) - that are rarely in the game, let alone in the same game room at the same time together.
2) Everyone can do what I've done - but I agree that very few would want to spend the time and resources to do so.
3) Thus, unless you have some definition to which I need to be introduced - I do not MA, and certainly not in the sense that would help this discussion.
4) This game, and games like it, should never be based on a solo expectation. Even today's hottest games that I enjoy - like Destiny - are not based on a solo perspective.
5) I am a member of the 'majority' of the lands, despite what I interpret as your attempts to label me otherwise. Where I definitely would not define myself as 'majority' is that I understand this game includes elements of strife and struggle - not ease of attaining goals.
If you'd care to make your point with a bit more accuracy, I'll be happy to consider it.
Doug
This is rather amazing. There are 5 incorrect premises in your three short sentences. I'm quite sure that's a new record.
1) I have several post cap characters (and many more not chapped) - that are rarely in the game, let alone in the same game room at the same time together.
2) Everyone can do what I've done - but I agree that very few would want to spend the time and resources to do so.
3) Thus, unless you have some definition to which I need to be introduced - I do not MA, and certainly not in the sense that would help this discussion.
4) This game, and games like it, should never be based on a solo expectation. Even today's hottest games that I enjoy - like Destiny - are not based on a solo perspective.
5) I am a member of the 'majority' of the lands, despite what I interpret as your attempts to label me otherwise. Where I definitely would not define myself as 'majority' is that I understand this game includes elements of strife and struggle - not ease of attaining goals.
If you'd care to make your point with a bit more accuracy, I'll be happy to consider it.
Doug
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 09:18 AM CDT
Again, Doug, I really don't see the relevance here. But we're talking in circles again. Suffice it to say that everyone is aware that sharing tasks and grouping up are options. What that has to do with fixing a small oversight in the original coding of the bounty system escapes me.
~Taverkin
~Taverkin
DOUG
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 09:30 AM CDT
>>What that has to do with fixing a small oversight in the original coding of the bounty system escapes me.
I find your response interesting, Tav. Some points:
1) I'm fairly confident this is no oversight, but a purposefully placed design feature. You don't like it - I get that.
2) Of course, my suggestion doesn't 'fix' this, it simply improves the customer experience. But that's not what you want, is it?
3) So you simply ignore it and attempt to deflect. Classic, Tav. Break the circle and response to the suggestion that you demanded.
4) Everyone is not 'aware', as Terrance points out. This game is apparently of the soloist, by the soloist, for the soloist, and some are apparently here to ensure these great truths get protected.
Doug
I find your response interesting, Tav. Some points:
1) I'm fairly confident this is no oversight, but a purposefully placed design feature. You don't like it - I get that.
2) Of course, my suggestion doesn't 'fix' this, it simply improves the customer experience. But that's not what you want, is it?
3) So you simply ignore it and attempt to deflect. Classic, Tav. Break the circle and response to the suggestion that you demanded.
4) Everyone is not 'aware', as Terrance points out. This game is apparently of the soloist, by the soloist, for the soloist, and some are apparently here to ensure these great truths get protected.
Doug
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 09:40 AM CDT
>> What that has to do with fixing a small oversight in the original coding of the bounty system escapes me.
Hard as this might be to imagine Taverkin, possibly not everyone shares the opinion that this was a small oversight in the original coding? Sometimes actual design and intent go into the design of this game (despite many of your posts on these forums suggesting otherwise).
I've stated my opinion and suggestions as they relate to this topic so I'm done with this thread with this post. It's certainly not a large issue for me either way but I definitely don't like the trend of applying the 'Easy button' to games in general these days. It's why many of today's games aren't very interesting to play and why I still continue to play and support Gemstone after many, many years of play.
I'm all for convenience, but this isn't just a convenience issue even though you like to paint it with that brush. Is it a reasonable request to bring up for discussion? Of course it is. Is it an obvious, no brainer, bug fix? I don't think so. Maybe it should be changed and maybe it shouldn't, and maybe the change shouldn't be the first knee-jerk suggestion that is posted. Hence, the discussion.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
Hard as this might be to imagine Taverkin, possibly not everyone shares the opinion that this was a small oversight in the original coding? Sometimes actual design and intent go into the design of this game (despite many of your posts on these forums suggesting otherwise).
I've stated my opinion and suggestions as they relate to this topic so I'm done with this thread with this post. It's certainly not a large issue for me either way but I definitely don't like the trend of applying the 'Easy button' to games in general these days. It's why many of today's games aren't very interesting to play and why I still continue to play and support Gemstone after many, many years of play.
I'm all for convenience, but this isn't just a convenience issue even though you like to paint it with that brush. Is it a reasonable request to bring up for discussion? Of course it is. Is it an obvious, no brainer, bug fix? I don't think so. Maybe it should be changed and maybe it shouldn't, and maybe the change shouldn't be the first knee-jerk suggestion that is posted. Hence, the discussion.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
LEDBETTERM
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 11:24 AM CDT
I find equating "possible to complete alone" and "easy button" to be fairly absurd.
It simply makes no sense that the Adventurer's Guild would send an all powerful magic user of doooooom - who doesn't know enough about weapons to hit a rolton with a stick - to kill magic immune creatures.
It simply makes no sense that the Adventurer's Guild would send an all powerful magic user of doooooom - who doesn't know enough about weapons to hit a rolton with a stick - to kill magic immune creatures.
DOUG
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 11:41 AM CDT
>>I find equating "possible to complete alone" and "easy button" to be fairly absurd.
In a game where group hunting is a part of the desired game design outcome (I know we the players mayn't feel it should be that way, but let's pretend, for a moment), this isn't quite the bridge too far category that 'fairly absurd' may imply.
>>It simply makes no sense that the Adventurer's Guild would send an all powerful magic user of doooooom - who doesn't know enough about weapons to hit a rolton with a stick - to kill magic immune creatures.
But this -- yes, this. It is very hard to 'believe' with the intel the Adventurer's Guild seems to command that they wouldn't know a bit about their local hero / adventurer types. The avenue for 'deciding' whether or not a hero is 'worthy' of a task certainly makes sense, and already exists as we point out with skinning.
I still return to the opening issue as described, though: It's not that this happens - it's that it can happen more than one time in a row. While we may disagree on whether or not that 15-minute 'min-max shattering' inconvenience has a place logically, aesthetically or based on 'playability' in our world - I think we'd all start falling in line at the 30-minute, 45-minute and beyond category.
Perhaps that experience, rather than the absolute avoidance of the undesirable task, is what needs to be addressed. I'd even go so far as to suggest skinning could be recast and retrofitted to the same concept.
Doug
In a game where group hunting is a part of the desired game design outcome (I know we the players mayn't feel it should be that way, but let's pretend, for a moment), this isn't quite the bridge too far category that 'fairly absurd' may imply.
>>It simply makes no sense that the Adventurer's Guild would send an all powerful magic user of doooooom - who doesn't know enough about weapons to hit a rolton with a stick - to kill magic immune creatures.
But this -- yes, this. It is very hard to 'believe' with the intel the Adventurer's Guild seems to command that they wouldn't know a bit about their local hero / adventurer types. The avenue for 'deciding' whether or not a hero is 'worthy' of a task certainly makes sense, and already exists as we point out with skinning.
I still return to the opening issue as described, though: It's not that this happens - it's that it can happen more than one time in a row. While we may disagree on whether or not that 15-minute 'min-max shattering' inconvenience has a place logically, aesthetically or based on 'playability' in our world - I think we'd all start falling in line at the 30-minute, 45-minute and beyond category.
Perhaps that experience, rather than the absolute avoidance of the undesirable task, is what needs to be addressed. I'd even go so far as to suggest skinning could be recast and retrofitted to the same concept.
Doug
DAID
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 11:57 AM CDT
I'd be pretty generally okay with "you can't be assigned the same task in a row."
However, the example, as written, provided in the OP, would not be affected:
>IE: the guild has tasked you to kill 17 warlocks, the guild has tasked you to find a grizzled warlock, the guild has tasked you to kill 22 warlocks
There are no tasks directly in a row that are the same. They are for the same creature, but not the same task. (I would count the killing 17 and killing 22 as the same task just not an identical assignment.)
It's pretty unclear to me exactly how this would work. As I already stated, I find heirloom looting on creatures like tree spirits annoying for characters that cannot loot quickly. I am aware there are ways around this, and I'm only saying I find them annoying. If I turn down looting bog wraiths, should they assume I don't want to kill a dangerous one? That assumption is wrong! Should they assume I don't want to loot a greater moor wight for an heirloom? That assumption is wrong! Should they not assign me bog wraith looting immediately after I just turned it down? Maybe not, but it doesn't apply to the OP's example, and statistically is already very unlikely.
If I turn down a foraging task in the Marsh Keep because they want 10 items that grows in only 1 room which is dangerous, it doesn't mean I will turn down the next bounty which may be foraging in Aeia's Garden near the Citadel.
There's also the huge realism factor here. The more people that dislike a task, the more it should be assigned from a practical in-game standpoint. Maybe the guild is hinting that a capped wizard learn how to use Haste, because the sorcerers, clerics, and empaths are already turning these down and even more poorly equipped. (I'm not trying to insist this is necessary for training, just musing.)
The only real Adv Guild change suggestion I can recall making recently was that heirloom looting for creatures that are tricky to loot simply be converted to heirloom searching bounties.
Magic immunity is a larger can of worms than it appears. What if I'm a character trained for using fire spells (111, 906, 908); it doesn't seem fair to send me into the Bowels. Although Krag dwellers are partially magic immune, I found them fairly easy pickings with my sorcerer because Pain worked fine, even if lots of other options (especially for wizards), might not work well.
It's basically why I think the interest behind this discussion makes sense, but I am arguing it is much much much more complicated than some "simple" fix.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>Daid: Pretty sure you have a whole big bucket as your penny jar. You never have only two cents. :p
However, the example, as written, provided in the OP, would not be affected:
>IE: the guild has tasked you to kill 17 warlocks, the guild has tasked you to find a grizzled warlock, the guild has tasked you to kill 22 warlocks
There are no tasks directly in a row that are the same. They are for the same creature, but not the same task. (I would count the killing 17 and killing 22 as the same task just not an identical assignment.)
It's pretty unclear to me exactly how this would work. As I already stated, I find heirloom looting on creatures like tree spirits annoying for characters that cannot loot quickly. I am aware there are ways around this, and I'm only saying I find them annoying. If I turn down looting bog wraiths, should they assume I don't want to kill a dangerous one? That assumption is wrong! Should they assume I don't want to loot a greater moor wight for an heirloom? That assumption is wrong! Should they not assign me bog wraith looting immediately after I just turned it down? Maybe not, but it doesn't apply to the OP's example, and statistically is already very unlikely.
If I turn down a foraging task in the Marsh Keep because they want 10 items that grows in only 1 room which is dangerous, it doesn't mean I will turn down the next bounty which may be foraging in Aeia's Garden near the Citadel.
There's also the huge realism factor here. The more people that dislike a task, the more it should be assigned from a practical in-game standpoint. Maybe the guild is hinting that a capped wizard learn how to use Haste, because the sorcerers, clerics, and empaths are already turning these down and even more poorly equipped. (I'm not trying to insist this is necessary for training, just musing.)
The only real Adv Guild change suggestion I can recall making recently was that heirloom looting for creatures that are tricky to loot simply be converted to heirloom searching bounties.
Magic immunity is a larger can of worms than it appears. What if I'm a character trained for using fire spells (111, 906, 908); it doesn't seem fair to send me into the Bowels. Although Krag dwellers are partially magic immune, I found them fairly easy pickings with my sorcerer because Pain worked fine, even if lots of other options (especially for wizards), might not work well.
It's basically why I think the interest behind this discussion makes sense, but I am arguing it is much much much more complicated than some "simple" fix.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>Daid: Pretty sure you have a whole big bucket as your penny jar. You never have only two cents. :p
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Magic immune and the guild
05/17/2015 11:59 AM CDT
>> Perhaps that experience, rather than the absolute avoidance of the undesirable task, is what needs to be addressed. I'd even go so far as to suggest skinning could be recast and retrofitted to the same concept.
You have succeeded at the Procure Skins task 92 times.
I've probably done my own skinning for these tasks less than 20% of the time.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
You have succeeded at the Procure Skins task 92 times.
I've probably done my own skinning for these tasks less than 20% of the time.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
