i know no uncommon runes. every attempt to interact with a GM for one (and I've done it numerous times, including during the whole summoners' storyline) has been ignored. so it pisses me off that some players are getting multiple ones with what seems like minimal effort, or 'buying' them from other sorcerers. i dropped my 2x demonology because of this.

and whatever happened to the idea nilven considered that people with x ranks get to pick an uncommon rune?


~Moredin

I have no teaches.

Moredin, I haven't bought any of mine and I never join quests as a matter of principle. I wouldn't think that'd be the way to get it either. Those are typically run by CE GMs, and lets face it, for a long time there hasn't been that many staff members who know about sorcery, I wouldn't expect them to know of this.

Anyways, for years I had none as well, then suddenly I got 5.

I got one showing up for the guild meeting after the arashan release, everyone who showed got one (though, not arashan, they kept it limited at that point). I believe I traded teaches with someone so we both ended up with two.

Then wonders of elanthia, there was a preannounced raffle I think, 10 winners (not many entered really, good odds), won that, traded teaches again for sure that time. So there is 4.

Then I think I must have won one at EG or something.

Though, if you ask me, the whole uncommon rune system is dumb and should be changed. The spell is limited enough as is, why must we invent this relatively OOC rune rationing system? In fact lets toss the runestone requirement altogether. Make it so you can just prep cast to summon the demon, let having a runestone merely give you a success bonus. Or if that'd really break game balance, make the runestone required for existing success rates, and give a 25 rank penalty off of current rates without it. Or have it modify duration in some way. Summoning without a runestone is short duration and you cannot renew. Something like that.

I think a major reason the spell is sparsely used, aside from the annoyance of illusions, the justice problems, and the summoning cost, is that you can't get the demon you want all the time, each is different, and the cooldown period makes it a long process sometimes. If you're going to put all those restrictions on it at least we should be able to summon the demon that has the specific ability we require without having to wait 30 minutes. "Sorry, your chance for RP has passed, you took too long. "

For me there are a couple of issues.

Having to train in illusions, If i forget and the demon follows me i have to go through the justice system and waste time.

As is its not a really usefull spells. It holds mana, but not enough to make or break a hunt, it holds some coins and objects, but same as mana. The only real useful ability is guarding against theft, but a cursed gem, using notes and closing your containers gets rid of that problem.

Honestly outside of how it will add to Balefire if this spell went away I dont think i would really care besides the RP of Mal being a demonologist. It takes too much time and has too many restrictions for a spell thats worthless.

Player of Malisai

>Moredin, I haven't bought any of mine and I never join quests as a matter of principle.

yeah I know not everyone buys their but on the other hand I have seen a lot of this happen.

~Moredin

How do we check how many teaches we have? I know shien'tyr-shien, and would be willing to pass on the knowledge.

Des

i think it is under the RUNE verb.

hmmmm, what would i need to do to convince you to teach Mal?

Player of Malisai

I'm pretty sure I have a teaching left, but the rune verb didn't tell me anything about number of teachings. Didn't it used to say even when you have no teachings?

~Allereli

Generally you get two "teaches" when you learn an uncommon rune. However - and unfortunately - the person to whom you teach that rune does not also get two "teaches"; they get none. Julesia does know one uncommon rune, but the one she'd really like to know is the lorae'tyr-verlok rune, which not many people appear to have. It's very frustrating for me, as a player, because I feel the demons are an excellent part of her RP, but not every demon meets the roleplay needs.

>>Just tossin this out, plain and simple. The whole idea behind these uncommon (how bout extremely rare?) runes being rare sucks. For a spell that offers fairly little, it's pretty crazy that these runes are so hard to learn. WTB "uncommon" runes being a bit more on the common side.

Agreed wholeheartedly, and this coming from someone who hasn't even decided if,how, when my sorcerer might use a demon. A setup I'd kinda like to see would be the following

Player A wins a raffle for X rune, they can teach it twice. They teach player B and C.
Every month (or full moon, or alignment of moons, whatever) Player A may teach 2 more people. Player B and C couldn't teach anyone except maybe if player A was present in which case they could teach once. Something like this might promote monthly gatherings, heh Player A could even have fun choosing when/where to host this gathering that most of the game's law enforcement frowns upon.

Might be more complicated then it's worth, but demons are cool enough that I know i'd hate to be able to just login, learn every demon rune and log back out, all in a night's work. Least this way there'd be something to look forward to.

Uhlume

I have two runes and I agree with you, it should be a guild reward for mastering illusions or awarded at a certain demonology rank. Sad to come back and see that demons are less popular than ever.

Allereli

>>Using a runestone should be a bonus, not the baseline.

Or at least make it 'designate-able' similar to the wizard familiar runestone.

Doug

If someone has a shien'tyr-shien or a lorae'tyr-Igaesha teach they'd be willing to share, I'd like to learn one or both. None of the others would be a suitable minion for my sorcerer.

I can be found at play.net or near Illistim.

Uhlume

>Aren't the abyran'ra considered major demons? So, technically sorcerers wouldn't be able to learn that rune until they were able to summon major demons from their resident valences.

So, how this works:

Two broad classifications of demons. Major demons and lesser demons. Everything we've ever seen in game is pretty much a lesser demon. Major demons include things on par with the Ur-Daemons, basically, equivalent in power to an Arkati or Drake. Lesser demons are then further defined into another classification of lesser demons and minor demons. Minor demons are the little guys we get out of 725, ranging from small animal status (verlok and grantris) to lesser sentient being (abyran'a and grik).

But the point you were trying to get across is correct. Handing out Abyran'ra runes is pretty much out of the question. What I find interesting about the Abyran'ra situation is that variants of the same species are so vastly different in power that they are classified differently.

I guess its like this:
Abyran'a - Run of the mill civilian
Abyran'sa - Priest/shaman class, no real strength, but some access to mystical powers
Abyran'ra - Like a level 70-cap player. Knows what the heck they are doing. The "heroes" of the species.

>I love how that demonologist brain works! I'd like to officially put myself in the Elanth'tyr valence camp. It makes the most sense to me, but then again...I don't play a Faendryl character.

I've written in-game essays about this. Its been somewhat refuted by official word, but only vaguely. I remember 5-6 years ago, there was some half-hearted attempt to claim that Elanthia was not the same "classification" as the valences, but in my opinion, thats poor logic, and they didn't back it up. Since then, I've seen nothing on the subject.

My personally assessment of the situation is that demons are not inherently chaotic. They come from another universe, where the fabric of reality and laws of physics are different (Shien'tyr's evaporating light and Lorae'tyr's timeshifting). The demon is a "patch" of dissonant reality when brought into this world, and the "chaos" is simply the clash of one world's physics with another. With no true official documentation specifically stating so, I would suggest that within their native valences, demons have NO chaotic powers outside of their inherent abilities (I bet a Abyran'ra could break sancts because they are powerful, not chaotic). Along with this theory goes my claim that an Elanthian in a foreign valence would have chaotic powers, namely, sanct breaking.

I doubt we will ever see documenation stating such, and in the past, I've seen vague hints of NIR quotes implying that the chaotic nature IS inherent, in that all the other valences are chaotic realms, and Elanthia is the ONLY "stable" realm, and is in fact, NOT a valence at all. I'd rather chalk that up to Faendryl arrogance than truth.