Since you're GOS you can drop all first aid and still be able to munch herbs in 3 sec.

Double PT seems excessive as most cans use the newer smvr2 calculations and PT isn't the end all for defense it used to be. I'd drop this to 1x.

Bring survival down to 1x.

At this point, see if you have enough TPS to get enough CMAN ranks for 4 ranks of cunning defense which will do the most for maneuver defense in general. If not, trim back on lores.

As I gaze over the horizon, the wind tugs at my cloak and whispers, "Adventure" in my ear.

AIM: Kaight (Matt) GS4

<I've recently switched her from a sniper to an open archer because I found myself not hiding all that often, but now I've run into the cman problem>

ALLENM20 had some good ideas for how to get the CM training. If your DS is in good order compared to critters you hunt you can also get away with dropping Dodge below 1x since 618 adds phantom ranks of it (my ranger's only ever had .5x in Dodge and never had any problems). It won't help with critters that use SMR v2, but if they're using v1 it will.

I also wanted to point out that defense is one of the main reasons snipers are in the shadows. If what you're hunting can't find you, it can't use whatever cman is kicking your butt on you (or any other attack for that matter).

Unfortunately, without access to VANISH, rangers have to be more selective about when they fire then rogues, otherwise you'll find yourself stuck in the open when the critter attacks if you fall out of the shadows. 610 and keeping your RT as low a possible can help with this, but I'll admit that it can be a tedious way to hunt... which was the main reason I fixskilled my ranger into a dagger/shield build (that and my rogue discovering just how limited hunting options become for a sniper at near-cap levels).

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.

<Is stealth actually better than open firing for a ranger? I mean I know we have 608 which is great for getting into hiding and the added AS if you can stay hidden, but if they pull you out you are pretty vulnerable. If you dumped some points into cman on top of it would that make it more viable?>

Rangers should be able to be effective at either, it just depends on what you train in and what you intend to fight. Most archer rangers I've know have taken the sniper route, though I've known of some good open archers.

Snipers (rangers or rogues) are generally going to be "glass cannons", that is their attack is going to be strong and they're going to get a high percentage of one-shot kills but the trade-off is that if they get hit it's likely to take them out. To survive, ranger snipers stick to the shadows as much as possible, focus on reducing their RT as much as possible so they can get back into the shadows before a critter can attack, control critter movements as much as possible, and time their shots so it takes place right after a critter performs an action (so they have time to get back into the shadows if they fall out and fail to stun/kill).

617 and CMAN Shadow Mastery can aid in staying hidden when being searched for and when firing, as can keeping encumbrance to a minimum (606 and a disk help that). 610 is probably the most effective crowd control for a ranger, since it will keep what you're shooting at on the ground and encourages anything that wanders in to move on (the vine is more likely to make them leave if you're in the shadows from my experience). When sniping, the lowest RT you're going to see is 5 seconds (3 sec minimum from the bow + 1 for hiding + 1 for AIMing... 606 MIGHT be able to reduce it further if your STR bonus is high, but I don't know for sure), this is achievable with any bow (composite, short, or long) so just use the one with the highest DF you can still fire in 5 sec.

Open archers are able to survive/avoid hits better and fire off shots faster then snipers but they're not going to do as much per-shot damage and the number of one shot kills is going to be lower. Their RT will be lower because they're not hiding (and possibly not AIMing) their shots, but they don't get the stance pushdown snipers do. Their defenses will be better cause they'll usually be in heavier armor then a sniper and have more TPs to put into Dodge/CM then a sniper will, in addition to the 610, 607, 615, etc.

In the end, it mostly comes down to which style appeals more to you. With either, the tactics you develop will matter at least as much as your training to determine how viable each is.

Starchitin

PS I avoided being as specific about advice with open archers because I don't have the experience with them I do with snipers


A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.

My ranger, Radeek, is a career open archer, and he's been doing it since the first day ranged was rolled into the game. I picked up S&H during the Talador War to give him something else to do to fight the post-cap blues. He no longer has S&H, I found it too boring. He's not my only archer, I have others, both open and snipers, ranger, rogue, and warrior.

But back to the issue at hand. CMAN's are your issue. That will not change. CMAN's will always be a pain, all we can do is make them a bit less painful. Here's what I would do, in your situation. Oh, you didn't tell us your characters race. That makes a difference when it comes to deciding on open ranged, or sniping (at least to me it does).

1. Drop 2 ranger spell ranks and pick up 120, it's a great defensive spell
2. Drop survival to 1x, max
3. Here's where some other rangers might have a stroke. Drop ALL lores. Radeek does not, nor has he ever had, any lores and I have NEVER regretted it. Save them for a post cap goal if you want. Those TP's are better spent in generating offense and defense and as a properly trained open archer your eye shots will get better and better and a set-up spell will become unnecessary.
4. Here's where it gets a bit dicey. I did NOT follow this with Radeek, though I looked long and hard at it on a number of different occasions over the years (I always tried to make Radeek as offensively capable as I could). Drop all ambush; I've always been a believer in the adage...fully double in Ambush, or don't train in it at all. At this point it will cost you 13 to your AS (no guarantee on that calculation, but it should be close). 93 ranks of ambush is a LOT of TP's for the loss of only 13 AS points.

With these re-allocated points you can fully single in CMAN's and get quite a bit of armor training (I highly recommend getting up to augmented chain as soon as you can, it's a real life saver).

General Radeek Andoran
Drakes Vanguard
Defender of Wehnimer's Landing
Black Raider of the Mir'Sheq

Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato

http://radeekandoran.blogspot.ca/

http://thetehirchronicles.blogspot.ca/

<I wouldn't do this with a sniper, but but if you're going to be an open archer... go for it. Just remember to aim your shots for something other then the eyes if you do FIRE from the shadows since your ability to aim will be reduced.

This I would ONLY recommend for an open archer. A sniper should always fully double in ambush, in my opinion.

General Radeek Andoran
Drakes Vanguard
Defender of Wehnimer's Landing
Black Raider of the Mir'Sheq

Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato

http://radeekandoran.blogspot.ca/

http://thetehirchronicles.blogspot.ca/

<I have had zero issues with a 2x Perception and 1x Ambush route and have been able to successfully hunt by sniping or open ranged combat for virtually all levels.>

I stopped training my rogue in Perception a while ago because over 2x doesn't really do anything for ranged AS or locksmithing and he's been sitting at 207 ranks since (currently level 77). I'm almost curious enough about what would happen if I dumped his 2x ambush and pushed Perception up to a full 3x to actually try it before the next fixskills...

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.

120 is a must. 650 is great for foraging bounties but hunting it's a lot of manna for a small bonus. I also run 140 all the time though so I guess I shouldn't talk about manna hog spells...

Someone mentioned over training Brig to lower a penalty? What is this they speak of?

Daemon Ranger

Seems I completely missed that. When did that come out?

Daemon Ranger

So I only have been obvious for 9 years. Not bad at all.

Daemon Ranger