Only having returned since last December or so, I was happy as a clam to see monks and the new UAC system out. Couldn't wait to try it, as in the past I had made a monk out of my Voln rogue to satisfy my need for monk-like character, and had no intention of converting him either.
Since I took the obvious route of both tackling a new profession and an entirely new combat system, I made a monk straight away and started. For nearly 10 levels I needed no gear whatsoever. No UAC gear, as using his bare hands were more than deadly enough for anything close to his level. It tickled me to no end that I needed no additional weapon or armor to make him effective. Straight from the character mangler to the hunting ground (after the level 1 short-cut around town of course!)
Once I got to 10th level, I located and got a hold of the 4x footwraps and handwraps and that is all I have beside the 2x robes Zizzle made for him (currently working on a second set to 4x for him now). Now I managed in that time to get the monk to level 17, fast approaching 18. I haven't until now given much thought to his overall training plan, as this started out as a test character initially to see if I would even like UAC and/or like playing a monk. I am sure I could have moved some stats around (too late for that now, 30-day period over now) but all in all I balanced him fairly well for what I imagine him to be.
I took the obvious society choice for him and he is in Voln. So undead hunting will forever be his primary goal until he masters and beyond. His training has been heavily in the physical skills, with only about 4 ranks in spells (Minor Mental only). He is maxxed out in brawling, CM, 2x dodge and PF. 1x in TWC for defense mainly, though I am thinking of giving up that modicum of DS for something more useful since I wished it would have help in gaining TWO attacks per round instead of just one... <hint-hint>
Now I am getting to the point with having quite a few CM points to play with. Currently (I am going from memory here) he has surge of strength (rank 2 I think), all 3 masteries at least one rank (maybe 2 each) with punch at least 2 or 3, and Krynch at least 2 ranks. I probably have the passive DS and TD CMANs too like combat focus, and movement. I don't normally use my CMANs (I still need to figure out which would be useful) so tend to stick with mostly passive ones.
However, I was studying up the CMAN list, and discovered Perfect Self. That sounds really good on paper, a lot of permanent increases to base stats equals better UAF, with a prerequisite adding more to ones AGI and DEX. Surge of strength is also a required at rank 3, which is never a bad thing. I am just wondering of that is a good plan to try? I would of course have to get rid of much of what I now know, such as the punch, kick and grapple mastery to switch it. With a FIXSKILL coming up, I would be willing to try it out and see if it seems better than my current hodge-podge of CMANs. Any insight on that I would appreciate. I am quite happy with my monk up until now, and hope that continues in the next 10-20+ levels! I am just hesitant in radically changing his CMANs for fear it would make it not fun to play him.
--Zizzle
ZIZZLE-ZEARL
ALUVIUS
Re: I like monks and UAC in general
03/18/2013 06:55 PM CDT
I'd drop the grapple and kick masteries.
Perfect Self is quite attractive and I went with it early because it helped with encumbrance and agidex. My 28 monk has rank 4 of it, but will probably hold off on getting rank 5 (unless I have a agidex cutoff near, I'll have to check). I'm not saying I'd recommend it to everyone early, but I think its one that most every monk should pick up. 10 to all stats is just ... addictive.
I'd drop the TWC down to .5x for sure or even 1 rank if you need the points for something else. At .5x you'll lose maybe 3 offensive ds compared to 1x.
Only 4 spell ranks? Where are you spending all of your points? :)
WOLFFC3
Re: I like monks and UAC in general
03/18/2013 07:20 PM CDT
You'll be fine with perfect self. Right now all of my cman points have gone into 2 ranks of it.
The +2 per rank from Perfect Self goes to the stat so you're stat bonus is going to be about 1/2 of that. The formula for UAF includes {trunc(STR bonus ÷ 2) + trunc(AGI bonus ÷ 2)}. You probably already know this but I'm pointing it out because your punches are going to get weaker. Basically that +2 bonus per rank gets cut in half twice before it ends up on the chin of whoever your hitting. It isn't going to hurt you now and at your current training plan you'll have all the cman points you need for the masteries and perfect self pretty quickly.
As long as you are 2x brawling and do something for Armor (1202 or armor ranks) you can't screw up your UCS monk. Everything else is just for flavor. Minor Mental has some great spells. Defintely work towards 1220 at a minimum, and IMHO, do that sooner than later.
When it comes to gear you hit the nail on the head. Monks don't need much of it. Put some thought into flares. You can get 4x flaring wraps for non-undead, and something small like a flaring knuckle blade will stack those flares. The Knuckle blade will drop your MM by 10, but at 4x it will boost your UAF by 10 and has a DF bonus of .05. It's a pretty good trade. Not necessary at all, but it is fun.
The +2 per rank from Perfect Self goes to the stat so you're stat bonus is going to be about 1/2 of that. The formula for UAF includes {trunc(STR bonus ÷ 2) + trunc(AGI bonus ÷ 2)}. You probably already know this but I'm pointing it out because your punches are going to get weaker. Basically that +2 bonus per rank gets cut in half twice before it ends up on the chin of whoever your hitting. It isn't going to hurt you now and at your current training plan you'll have all the cman points you need for the masteries and perfect self pretty quickly.
As long as you are 2x brawling and do something for Armor (1202 or armor ranks) you can't screw up your UCS monk. Everything else is just for flavor. Minor Mental has some great spells. Defintely work towards 1220 at a minimum, and IMHO, do that sooner than later.
When it comes to gear you hit the nail on the head. Monks don't need much of it. Put some thought into flares. You can get 4x flaring wraps for non-undead, and something small like a flaring knuckle blade will stack those flares. The Knuckle blade will drop your MM by 10, but at 4x it will boost your UAF by 10 and has a DF bonus of .05. It's a pretty good trade. Not necessary at all, but it is fun.
RATHBONER
Re: I like monks and UAC in general
03/19/2013 06:23 AM CDT
You can't have punchmastery (or any of the other masteries or krynch) at rank 3 until level 23.
I reckon you should have it at rank 3 then.
Krynch you should have 2 ranks or none. The third is expensive and doesn't add much, but just one isn't worth having.
A rank or two of Perfect Self might be worth it, but there is no way I am paying 22 CMan points at 22 TPs a time on worthless pre-requisites in order to get them until I have run out of CMans I positively want. A halfling might see surge differently, but 1 rank of surge is all that has value to me, and burst is worthless.
In effect, the points others have put into Perfect Self and its pre-requisites, I have in feint 5 (its worth about 60 on the endroll getting a turtled caster into offensive as opposed to about 3 from having Perfect Self and its pre-requisites running) and focus 3 (worth more to my TD than Perfect Self). Stancing critters is huge and there aren't that many stancing options available to monks. If there was something else that could do the job that feint does on a turtled tree spirit, I might well have gone for that instead and my most used stancing technique is 1207 and let them stand up, but non-corp undead tend to be immune to 1207. Some will use a weapon and fewer feint ranks, but the penalties for holding a weapon are not ones I am willing to take and you will want all the ranks for the better endroll anyway by the time you are into the 40s.
I reckon you should have it at rank 3 then.
Krynch you should have 2 ranks or none. The third is expensive and doesn't add much, but just one isn't worth having.
A rank or two of Perfect Self might be worth it, but there is no way I am paying 22 CMan points at 22 TPs a time on worthless pre-requisites in order to get them until I have run out of CMans I positively want. A halfling might see surge differently, but 1 rank of surge is all that has value to me, and burst is worthless.
In effect, the points others have put into Perfect Self and its pre-requisites, I have in feint 5 (its worth about 60 on the endroll getting a turtled caster into offensive as opposed to about 3 from having Perfect Self and its pre-requisites running) and focus 3 (worth more to my TD than Perfect Self). Stancing critters is huge and there aren't that many stancing options available to monks. If there was something else that could do the job that feint does on a turtled tree spirit, I might well have gone for that instead and my most used stancing technique is 1207 and let them stand up, but non-corp undead tend to be immune to 1207. Some will use a weapon and fewer feint ranks, but the penalties for holding a weapon are not ones I am willing to take and you will want all the ranks for the better endroll anyway by the time you are into the 40s.
ALUVIUS
Re: I like monks and UAC in general
03/19/2013 11:08 AM CDT
Yeah I'll second the importance of Feint for a monk. Mine has done it a bit differently though its still quite effective, at level 28 he has rank 4 Perfect Self (for encumbrance/agidex, although the UAF/ds/td/cs/exp(logic)/spirit(aura)/phantom weighting(dex) side effects are a nice bonus) and rank 3 Feint. He now has enough cman's for a rank of krynch or punch mastery or slippery mind/inner harmony but I'm agonizing on what to spend them on or whether to save up for rank 5 Perfect self (least likely) or up to rank 5 Feint (more likely).
It means he has to use a weapon in order to feint, but as was stated he gets flares and increased UAF/df for a small hit to MM. His ratio isn't capped often so its a decent trade off (its only -5 to MM for 1 of the small class UAC friendly weapons). I'm using a 4x paingrip with fire flares and a 4x cestus for blessing, but only 1 held at a time with a free off hand. I have earth/ice/fire flared/non flared/fusion versions of every UAC weapon size class but so far the small ones seem the best to use.
As a dwarf I keep surge up constantly and burst for emergencies but still have the stamina to feint constantly, in fact I usually 1207 then feint everything just to speed up hunting instead of waiting for critters to drop stance by standing/attacking. Of course it helps that he's COL so his stamina is reserved solely for cman's.
