Do you Ambush because that's what you were used to? Because you like using the big, expensive (weighted) weapon? Do you plan to change your skill path/way of hunting?

If your question about Lores gets answers, are you open to changing your skill path/way of hunting? :)

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It looks like roughly every three (3) ranks of Ambush (at 4p/4m for a Bard) will turn into one (1) second-rank (you are already fully singled) of CM (double-train cost is 16p/8m). So you could get roughly +23AS from converting all of your Ambush into additional ranks of CM.
(Note that this could also give you a bunch more CMan points, or CMan ranks, or added combat capabilities. [Like TrueHand or an AS booster or...])

Giving up Ambush means that you don't need the Stalk/Hide... there's 492p/328m saved, as well.

Now, you're suddenly a straight-up, unhidden, melee swinger. (With a slightly higher AS, and no added RT (from the 'hide' command) slowing you down.)

(All of that said, I will grant that if you cast-and-then-hide-during-the-castRT, there is little actual time lost. It didn't occur to me until later, since my Ambusher doesn't cast spells.)

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328m points == 41 ranks of Lore.
492p points == another 30 ranks (and 3/4s, but who's counting).
You already have 33 ranks of Lores out of a possible 136 (68 Mental, 68 Elemental).

Me, personally, for a melee build, I would put every bit that I could into EL:Air ranks, possibly pick up some more Songs (to increase the AS of the Sonic Weapon), and then go to town with either a dagger (when I do not have Tonis running) or a short sword (when I do have it running). You could be at 33% chance of second-flare on the Sonic Weapon (happens at 66 Lore ranks), and they already flare really well.

Any points I have left--if I choose to gain no more Songs--I would put into ML:Telepathy ranks, to increase my medley duration and to increase my AS (from Kai's Song/1007).

Basically, this would totally change how you hunt, though.
- You already Lullabye, so that is unchanged.
- You would no longer spend the RT to hide.
- You would immediately start blasting away at speed, maximizing your flares.
- You would NOT be aiming swings, because all the 'ambush' command does for you is to add RT, and you would be about flares from wimpy-weapon swings, not massive crushing damage from a big hefty weapon swing.
- The other advantage to using Sonic Weapon is that it cannot be CMan Disarmed. This is less helpful if you are in areas where that maneuver is uncommon.

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Sonic Weapons are among the best flares in the game, often doing back-to-back swings with flares; the only other weapons I ever saw doing this were the 13-form Auction weapons.

BardA(mbush) will take about 8-11 seconds to, hopefully, dish out his ton of hurt. 3s to cast, during which time you incur 3s to hide, and then you have the actual 5s weapon swing (up to 7s if you aim, possibly mitigated by stats) with an additional +1s of possible fudge-factor.

BardB(attleswarm) will take the same 3s to cast Lullabye.
In the next 5 seconds you can get three swings of a dagger (at 4s, 6s, and 8s) meaning the possibility of six (6) flares, some of which can go as high as 70hp and outright death results. You should generally expect to see two (2) of them, one from the weapon and one-of-the-three second chances from Lore (assuming 68 ranks of EL:Air == 66 ranks == 11 Lore steps @ 3% each).
If you happen to be running Tonis at the time you can step it up to a shortsword and do more base-HP damage as well, but cut the RT down by -2s (and you would be only seven (7) ranks away from yet another -1s reduction, at 75 ranks) which should let you swing once per second.

That's a potential for ten (10) flares, added to the base damage from the weapon, in the same amount of time your Ambushing-self gets to swing... once.

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I guess really it boils down to, how fixated are you on continuing with your current gear? Do you want/are you willing to totally change everything? Do you care about having that One Really Big Showy Deathstrike, or are you willing to whittle them down?

It's a paradigm shift, granted. Bardic Lores are--just because of EL:Air's benefits--geared toward small(-ish) fast weapons that you swing as many times as possible to put out as many flares as possible. The question is whether you're willing to play that way. :)

(Note that ML:Manipulation Lore works differently, because it adds (the most) to a warding-based spell, which encourages hunting from Guarded, and can be used either single- or multi-target.)

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If you plan to stay with the same equipment & hunting style--the 'One Big Lethal Hit' from hiding--then I would suggest dropping Air completely and switching over to ML:Telepathy for:
- added AS from Kai's Song;
- longer duration == less mana spent on the hunt;
- longer duration also == less likely to be revealed from hiding upon renew.

You're unlikely to be casting many spells that benefit from (minimal) ranks of Air. Odds are you're going to have Kai's running constantly. Lullabye is your most reliable spell, and it's non-Lore affected (crank up the INFluence enhancives, instead).

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Enjoy the plane flight! <evil grin>

>Q1) Does the verb 'mstrike' (either open-room/one hit per creature or single-target/multiple taps on just one beastie) stop Song of Tonis/1035 as it does Haste/506?

Mstrike does not break tonis. It's just godly and the more hunting partners you have..the more benefit you get out of each cast of tonis.

Lochiven

Very interesting thoughts. (I had completely glossed over the possibility of the Haste effect; I guess you can tell I don't have anything like that on my own Ambusher, eh?) Thanks for the analysis!

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Given everything that you said, though, about ambushing... which do you think would be the more powerful effect in combat? Air Lore smaller weapon non-hiding flares, or Ambushing?

(Yes, at this point I'm asking for an opinion. :)

>>* But if he keeps those skills, then why get Air Lore at all?

Because 3 seconds off your RT is superior to anything else in the game because it is defensive and offensive.

Ambushing is a potent attack. You are a bit too focused on air flares and are not taking in the bigger picture. Most of your focus for a bard has been about the speed flare build. There are other effective builds that do take air lore to accomplish. Lance swing every 2 seconds can be/likely is better than 1 second short sword swings. Even if you manage to get a flare on every other swing, the average flare isn't killing something.

Regardless, the OP wants to ambush. 3 seconds off every step of ambushing makes it a pretty speedy method to one shot kill. What if your speed flare bard isn't lucky and swings 5 times and doesn't even accomplish a stun? Meanwhile he's hanging out in the proverbial wind. In turn this other guy has his enemy on the ground and dead in 5 seconds. It's a trade off. Maybe the DS pushdown is just that worth it. I don't know. Just guess since I never went with a hiding build.

I can say after using an ohe/shield open ambush build that I enjoyed it more than just speed hacking. For me it was cman sweep instead of 1105, no hide, ambush neck with an axe. To each their own. I'd never suggest someone not use their sonic weapon, because they are that good. However, if you happened to have a masterfully (anything over very heavily) weighted whatever, I can see the desire to swing it. Thing is rogues show that crit-weighting is unnecessary with ambushing, so one would think the same would apply to a bard coming from hiding. I just wanted to work within the OP's requested style. Air lore for the max 3 second effect is what I would get and once I got to that plateau, I would switch to Telepathy if not sooner.

Boils down to ambushing is a slow deliberate process. Tonis just speeds it up to a rate that makes it exciting.

~Galenok