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So, I am doing LFM reps, and Deluca tells me to "make some good locks". Which means what? A lock in the range that I can pick? With what type of lockpick? With or without lores?
Totally a poor way of phrasing this task.
I tried making a -1100 lock and was told the cost would be something ridiculous, like 45,000 silvers or so. Now, I understand that I can sell the lock assemblies back when finished, but still, this seems a bit absurd.
THROGG
RATHBONER
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
09/26/2017 05:59 AM CDT
It wasn't all that high as I recall. Have you tried a -5? If that doesn't work try something just above what lm sense says is pretty easy with any old lockpick. (75% of copper maxlock)
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
09/26/2017 08:10 AM CDT
Pretty sure something super simple worked fine (like -5 or -25).
-- Robert
The Power of Bacon:
You accept Kirryk's offer and are now holding a maple and bacon bar.
>
You are now level 24!
-- Robert
The Power of Bacon:
You accept Kirryk's offer and are now holding a maple and bacon bar.
>
You are now level 24!
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
09/30/2017 12:53 AM CDT
I have yet to make a "good" lock. I have made any number of crude, average, superior and superb locks ... but apparently exceeding the specified quality doesn't count.
WHY DOESN'T IT???
This is really starting to tick me off.
WHY DOESN'T IT???
This is really starting to tick me off.
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
09/30/2017 08:47 AM CDT
I'm trying to wrap up another project this morning but I'll dig through my logs after that and see what I made. I'm still pretty sure the ones I made were really awful (less than -100 for sure).
And... maybe they are looking for a specific 'good' lock quality (though I don't remember that) which would imply (from what you have posted) that you have missed the mark on the low end and the high end and should focus somewhere in the middle of what you've been doing... but it has been so long I just don't remember that aspect of the task.
And the "F" in LFM doesn't stand for Fun (although I actually have enjoyed lock mastery quite a lot). :p
-- Robert
The Power of Bacon:
You accept Kirryk's offer and are now holding a maple and bacon bar.
>
You are now level 24!
And... maybe they are looking for a specific 'good' lock quality (though I don't remember that) which would imply (from what you have posted) that you have missed the mark on the low end and the high end and should focus somewhere in the middle of what you've been doing... but it has been so long I just don't remember that aspect of the task.
And the "F" in LFM doesn't stand for Fun (although I actually have enjoyed lock mastery quite a lot). :p
-- Robert
The Power of Bacon:
You accept Kirryk's offer and are now holding a maple and bacon bar.
>
You are now level 24!
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
09/30/2017 08:47 AM CDT
>> This is really starting to tick me off.
Might want to take a week off and re-approach it with a fresh perspective or something.
-- Robert
The Power of Bacon:
You accept Kirryk's offer and are now holding a maple and bacon bar.
>
You are now level 24!
Might want to take a week off and re-approach it with a fresh perspective or something.
-- Robert
The Power of Bacon:
You accept Kirryk's offer and are now holding a maple and bacon bar.
>
You are now level 24!
RATHBONER
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
09/30/2017 09:30 AM CDT
>And... maybe they are looking for a specific 'good' lock quality (though I don't remember that)
I'm pretty sure its the lock size that counts, and the quality just tells you how close you came to making the size you were trying to make (its important not to mess this up if you are trying to make duplicates, but I don't think its relevant to the task unless you made an awful effort that knocked the lock size below the requirement).
A log clip or two might help show what the issue is if you continue have problems.
I'm pretty sure its the lock size that counts, and the quality just tells you how close you came to making the size you were trying to make (its important not to mess this up if you are trying to make duplicates, but I don't think its relevant to the task unless you made an awful effort that knocked the lock size below the requirement).
A log clip or two might help show what the issue is if you continue have problems.
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/02/2017 02:11 AM CDT
Here is my latest attempt at making a "good" lock. I am starting to think that the category "good" quality does not exist. For purposes of brevity, I will
omit everything except the final sentence of each attempt. The end result was that after 30 minutes and spending a bunch of cash, I once more failed to make
a single "good" quality lock. As you can see, I tried all different sizes of lock.
If you find this boring to read, imagine actually sitting down and doing it. This is the fourth such session I have done, all without creating a single "good" quality lock.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -60 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 52 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -80 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a primitive lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 58 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -100 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 50 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -130 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 58 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -155 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a superior single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the superior lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 51 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -145 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a superior single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the superior lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 47 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -140 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a superior single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the superior lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 60 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -125 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 45 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -130 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 51 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -50 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a primitive lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 46 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -400 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average four tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 46 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -500 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average five tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside
Roundtime:46 seconds
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -600 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average six tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 54 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -10 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 58 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -20 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 52 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -55 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 51 sec.
R>
omit everything except the final sentence of each attempt. The end result was that after 30 minutes and spending a bunch of cash, I once more failed to make
a single "good" quality lock. As you can see, I tried all different sizes of lock.
If you find this boring to read, imagine actually sitting down and doing it. This is the fourth such session I have done, all without creating a single "good" quality lock.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -60 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 52 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -80 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a primitive lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 58 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -100 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 50 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -130 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 58 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -155 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a superior single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the superior lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 51 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -145 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a superior single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the superior lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 47 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -140 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a superior single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the superior lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 60 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -125 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 45 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -130 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average single tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 51 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -50 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a primitive lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 46 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -400 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average four tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 46 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -500 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average five tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside
Roundtime:46 seconds
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -600 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with an average six tumbler lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the average lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 54 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -10 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 58 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -20 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 52 sec.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -55 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 51 sec.
R>
RATHBONER
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/02/2017 05:28 AM CDT
Don't you have to show it to someone to get the rep? Check the wording of what you are required to do.
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/02/2017 08:09 AM CDT
Good call. My recollection is that you make the lock(s) and then show them to one of the trainers.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/02/2017 09:25 PM CDT
Well hell! If that's the case, it should be mentioned in the instructions!
OK, will try that then.
OK, will try that then.
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/02/2017 09:27 PM CDT
These are my instructions:
>>You have 36 ranks in the Lock Mastery skill.
You need 33 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
You have 3 repetitions remaining to complete this task.<<
>>You have 36 ranks in the Lock Mastery skill.
You need 33 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
You have 3 repetitions remaining to complete this task.<<
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/02/2017 09:46 PM CDT
I get your point. It is probably covered by your instructor when you are assigned the task.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 01:31 AM CDT
I tried giving away the assemblies I made. Neither Deluca nor Bean (nor any of the Masters) want anything to do with my locks.
Nor does superior or superb quality count for anything. Only the apparently non-existant "good" lock will do.
Nor does superior or superb quality count for anything. Only the apparently non-existant "good" lock will do.
RATHBONER
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 05:32 AM CDT
Sounds like something is broken. I think you need to ASSIST. Based on my memory of what it took, you've made some locks that are easily good enough to meet those instructions but its too long ago for me to be sure and there's no documentation to check against for that task.
JGALT22
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 07:02 AM CDT
Did you try to hand it to the masters where they hang out or did you ask them about training -> get taken to private room thing -> listen to their speech -> then hand it to them. That's how it works for making wedges/repairing picks.
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 04:55 PM CDT
>>Did you try to hand it to the masters where they hang out or did you ask them about training -> get taken to private room thing -> listen to their speech -> then hand it to them. That's how it works for making wedges/repairing picks. <<
I asked the Masters about training and was told that I already had an assignment; I wasn't taken to a room at all. Unfortunately, I can't investigate further right now,
since I got totally frustrated and turned the task in.
I asked the Masters about training and was told that I already had an assignment; I wasn't taken to a room at all. Unfortunately, I can't investigate further right now,
since I got totally frustrated and turned the task in.
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 06:54 PM CDT
I wrapped up some things. I'll search through my logs this evening.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 07:27 PM CDT
Here you go...
>LMASTER LOCK CREATE -5
You call in a workshop attendant and ask for enough material to create a -5 lock. The attendant smiles at you and says, "Certainly madam, that will be 200 silvers. Let me know if that is acceptable." before wandering out again.
If this price is acceptable, just attempt to create the lock again.
>LMASTER LOCK CREATE -5
You call in a workshop attendant and offer him enough to cover the materials for a -5 lock. A workshop attendant accepts your silvers.
The workshop attendant quickly retrieves a small block of steel and hands it to you before returning to his counter.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -5 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 56 sec.
<Movement back to the trainers.>
[Rogue Guild, Court]
Several crates stacked against the north wall serve as low tables for the short folk that work here. A group of dwarves stand about a box, holding the hand of a lone elf down on one of the crates. Given the worried expression the elf is wearing and the flashing blade held by one of the dwarves, it is easy to guess that a game of mumbletypeg is going on. You also see Master Footpad Jimik, Master Footpad Gludac, Master Footpad Lagick, Master Footpad Herit, Master Footpad Zardak and Master Footpad Faldes.
Obvious exits: east, south, northwest
>ask jimi about training lock
You ask Jimik about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Jimik pulls you aside for some instruction.
[A Dark Corner]
This dark corner is far enough away from the bustle of the courtyard to provide a little peace and quiet...perfect for reflection and training. You also see Master Footpad Jimik.
Obvious exits: out
>Jimik says, "Locksmithin' ain't all about breakin' inta things. There's also an honest livin' to be made keepin' people from doin' just that. O' course, if just anyone was able to do that, it'd be... disorganized. So, we like to make sure there're enough freelance lockmakers around to keep the system running smoothly." He points meaningfully at you. "That's where you come in."
"Making locks isn't all about altruism, though. If you were brighter, you might recognize there's a certain profitability in being familiar with the locks that are in use around town. It's even better to have spare keys for them on hand. In case one of your customers locks himself out of his house, for instance. Or goes on vacation."
Jimik says, "Got some lock assemblies for me? Hand 'em over, if ya do."
>give assemb to jimi
Master Footpad Jimik accepts the lock assembly with a nod before looking over your handiwork.
Jimik inspects the assembly closely before saying, "It's pretty lousy, but I guess I should have expected that. In any case, it'll do." He tosses the lock assembly back to you.
[You have 3 repetitions remaining.]
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
>LMASTER LOCK CREATE -5
You call in a workshop attendant and ask for enough material to create a -5 lock. The attendant smiles at you and says, "Certainly madam, that will be 200 silvers. Let me know if that is acceptable." before wandering out again.
If this price is acceptable, just attempt to create the lock again.
>LMASTER LOCK CREATE -5
You call in a workshop attendant and offer him enough to cover the materials for a -5 lock. A workshop attendant accepts your silvers.
The workshop attendant quickly retrieves a small block of steel and hands it to you before returning to his counter.
Materials in hand, you concentrate on the task of molding a -5 lock. After a short time, you find yourself with a simple lock assembly in your hand. You select a lock housing from the workbench and slide the lock assembly inside.
Roundtime: 56 sec.
<Movement back to the trainers.>
[Rogue Guild, Court]
Several crates stacked against the north wall serve as low tables for the short folk that work here. A group of dwarves stand about a box, holding the hand of a lone elf down on one of the crates. Given the worried expression the elf is wearing and the flashing blade held by one of the dwarves, it is easy to guess that a game of mumbletypeg is going on. You also see Master Footpad Jimik, Master Footpad Gludac, Master Footpad Lagick, Master Footpad Herit, Master Footpad Zardak and Master Footpad Faldes.
Obvious exits: east, south, northwest
>ask jimi about training lock
You ask Jimik about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Jimik pulls you aside for some instruction.
[A Dark Corner]
This dark corner is far enough away from the bustle of the courtyard to provide a little peace and quiet...perfect for reflection and training. You also see Master Footpad Jimik.
Obvious exits: out
>Jimik says, "Locksmithin' ain't all about breakin' inta things. There's also an honest livin' to be made keepin' people from doin' just that. O' course, if just anyone was able to do that, it'd be... disorganized. So, we like to make sure there're enough freelance lockmakers around to keep the system running smoothly." He points meaningfully at you. "That's where you come in."
"Making locks isn't all about altruism, though. If you were brighter, you might recognize there's a certain profitability in being familiar with the locks that are in use around town. It's even better to have spare keys for them on hand. In case one of your customers locks himself out of his house, for instance. Or goes on vacation."
Jimik says, "Got some lock assemblies for me? Hand 'em over, if ya do."
>give assemb to jimi
Master Footpad Jimik accepts the lock assembly with a nod before looking over your handiwork.
Jimik inspects the assembly closely before saying, "It's pretty lousy, but I guess I should have expected that. In any case, it'll do." He tosses the lock assembly back to you.
[You have 3 repetitions remaining.]
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 09:46 PM CDT
Hmm; didn't work for me. I'll see what happens next time I get that task.
What quality lock were you assigned? I had no trouble making simple locks; I never made one that was termed "good".
What quality lock were you assigned? I had no trouble making simple locks; I never made one that was termed "good".
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 10:59 PM CDT
>> What quality lock were you assigned? I had no trouble making simple locks; I never made one that was termed "good".
I'm not seeing where a quality is being specified... where are you seeing that?
>ask fald about training lock
You ask Faldes about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Faldes pulls you aside for some instruction.
[A Dark Corner]
This dark corner is far enough away from the bustle of the courtyard to provide a little peace and quiet...perfect for reflection and training. You also see Master Footpad Faldes.
Obvious exits: out
>Faldes says, "Locksmithin' ain't all about breakin' inta things. There's also an honest livin' to be made keepin' people from doin' just that. O' course, if just anyone was able to do that, it'd be... disorganized. So, we like to make sure there're enough freelance lockmakers around to keep the system running smoothly." He points meaningfully at you. "That's where you come in."
"Making locks isn't all about altruism, though. If you were brighter, you might recognize there's a certain profitability in being familiar with the locks that are in use around town. It's even better to have spare keys for them on hand. In case one of your customers locks himself out of his house, for instance. Or goes on vacation."
Faldes says, "So why don't you show me what you've got? Go make some lock assemblies in the workshops; the instructions for how to do it should be in there. I don't care if they're any good, the general public certainly doesn't know the difference. They'd better be new ones, though, nothin' dusty."
>gld
...
You have 37 ranks in the Lock Mastery skill.
You need 7 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to visit a master footpad for a talk.
You have 4 repetitions remaining to complete this task.
...
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
I'm not seeing where a quality is being specified... where are you seeing that?
>ask fald about training lock
You ask Faldes about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Faldes pulls you aside for some instruction.
[A Dark Corner]
This dark corner is far enough away from the bustle of the courtyard to provide a little peace and quiet...perfect for reflection and training. You also see Master Footpad Faldes.
Obvious exits: out
>Faldes says, "Locksmithin' ain't all about breakin' inta things. There's also an honest livin' to be made keepin' people from doin' just that. O' course, if just anyone was able to do that, it'd be... disorganized. So, we like to make sure there're enough freelance lockmakers around to keep the system running smoothly." He points meaningfully at you. "That's where you come in."
"Making locks isn't all about altruism, though. If you were brighter, you might recognize there's a certain profitability in being familiar with the locks that are in use around town. It's even better to have spare keys for them on hand. In case one of your customers locks himself out of his house, for instance. Or goes on vacation."
Faldes says, "So why don't you show me what you've got? Go make some lock assemblies in the workshops; the instructions for how to do it should be in there. I don't care if they're any good, the general public certainly doesn't know the difference. They'd better be new ones, though, nothin' dusty."
>gld
...
You have 37 ranks in the Lock Mastery skill.
You need 7 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to visit a master footpad for a talk.
You have 4 repetitions remaining to complete this task.
...
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
OM1E5GA
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/03/2017 11:17 PM CDT
I think this is where the confusion might be coming from about "good" locks: "I don't care if they're any good, the general public certainly doesn't know the difference."
All you should have to do is go make 4 lock assemblies, go back to Faldes and talk to him again, then hand him the assemblies. Doesn't matter how good or bad the assemblies are so long as you made them after talking to him.
Starchitin
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
All you should have to do is go make 4 lock assemblies, go back to Faldes and talk to him again, then hand him the assemblies. Doesn't matter how good or bad the assemblies are so long as you made them after talking to him.
Starchitin
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
THROGG
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/04/2017 01:43 AM CDT
Well, that's rather misleading if true. He specifically asked for good locks, which I assumed was a specific lock quality.
RATHBONER
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/04/2017 06:15 AM CDT
These are a different tasks.
...
You have 37 ranks in the Lock Mastery skill.
You need 7 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to visit a master footpad for a talk.
You have 4 repetitions remaining to complete this task.
...
You need 33 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
You have 3 repetitions remaining to complete this task.
...
The footpad talk one doesn't require anything, but I'm pretty sure there is a minimum lock difficulty that equates to "good" locks and I'm also pretty sure that if you make a lock thats as hard as you need for picking reps, that its good enough. My memory that it doesn't actually need to be that difficult might be from the footpad task and it may need to be at picking rep difficulty but having made locks that difficult, reps should have happened.
I suppose its possible that someone with less than 3x training could have issues with getting quality at the required difficulty and fail on the quality despite making one that was difficult enough, but I never had problems with quality except when I tried to make locks near or above my lored vaalin maxlock and my rep locks were far smaller than that. (I did once find I couldn't reliably make locks as difficult as I had boasted I could for a sorcerer but I never had quality issues on the LM reps)
...
You have 37 ranks in the Lock Mastery skill.
You need 7 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to visit a master footpad for a talk.
You have 4 repetitions remaining to complete this task.
...
You need 33 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
You have 3 repetitions remaining to complete this task.
...
The footpad talk one doesn't require anything, but I'm pretty sure there is a minimum lock difficulty that equates to "good" locks and I'm also pretty sure that if you make a lock thats as hard as you need for picking reps, that its good enough. My memory that it doesn't actually need to be that difficult might be from the footpad task and it may need to be at picking rep difficulty but having made locks that difficult, reps should have happened.
I suppose its possible that someone with less than 3x training could have issues with getting quality at the required difficulty and fail on the quality despite making one that was difficult enough, but I never had problems with quality except when I tried to make locks near or above my lored vaalin maxlock and my rep locks were far smaller than that. (I did once find I couldn't reliably make locks as difficult as I had boasted I could for a sorcerer but I never had quality issues on the LM reps)
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/04/2017 08:53 AM CDT
>> The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
Good catch on the task difference! I'm digging through logs from 5+ years ago so my memory definitely isn't contributing much to the search. :p I don't remember there being multiple versions of lock creation tasks!
If I ever got this specific task (and I'll search for the correct task string tonight) then it was only a couple of times at most. So... the good news is that you probably won't see this task very many times at any rate.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
Good catch on the task difference! I'm digging through logs from 5+ years ago so my memory definitely isn't contributing much to the search. :p I don't remember there being multiple versions of lock creation tasks!
If I ever got this specific task (and I'll search for the correct task string tonight) then it was only a couple of times at most. So... the good news is that you probably won't see this task very many times at any rate.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: What constitutes a "good" lock?
10/04/2017 09:39 AM CDT
So... going back through my logs it doesn't appear that I've ever been assigned this task. Lucky me I guess!
>> The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
>> The Training Administrator told you to make some good locks.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
THROGG
Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 05:55 PM CDT
Once again I have to make some locks. Again, I have no idea what they want. Is pretty good defined by how high I can pick? Just lock quality?
Here's exactly what Deluca said.
Deluca assays you with a critical eye and says, "Let's find you something to do to earn a rank in Lock Mastery." DeLuca rubs his chin thoughtfully, then continues, "Now that you know so much about locks, you should have no trouble making a few. Go make yerself some locks that are pretty good for what you can do." DeLuca also adds, "Repeat this 4 times."
OK, I made 2 locks. One of -300 which turned out average, and one of -350, which turned out superior. I got no credit for a rep from either of these.
I tried handing the locks in, and that didn't work either.
>>give ass to deluca
DeLuca glances at you and moves out of your reach.
>n
[Rogue Guild, Courtyard]
Under the shadows of the overhanging branches of the tree and the high stone wall of the building to the north, a few cracked flagstones give way to a packed dirt surface that continues east. Wooden boards and stacks of crates are lined up against the wall in a haphazard pattern. You also see some beautiful wildflowers.
Obvious paths: east, south, west
>e
[Rogue Guild, Courtyard]
Most of the weeds and stones have been cleared from the courtyard here, and the dirt surface is packed hard and scuffed with the evidence of many footsteps and physical struggles. Wood panels rest against the walls, apparently to provide a small measure of padding over the rough stone. You also see Master Footpad Miller, Master Footpad Bean, a simple lock assembly, a primitive lock assembly, a simple lock assembly, a primitive lock assembly, Master Footpad Reilly, Master Footpad Murphy and Master Footpad Houlihan.
Obvious paths: south, southwest, west
>give ass to bean
Bean glances at you and moves out of your reach.
>ask bean about train lock
You ask Bean about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Bean says, "Da Trainin' Administrator must tell yas to work wit' me here, got it?"
Bean gives you a strange look.<<
OK so what do they want me to do? Make locks in a higher range of difficulty? More tumblers? I have NO clue!
Here's exactly what Deluca said.
Deluca assays you with a critical eye and says, "Let's find you something to do to earn a rank in Lock Mastery." DeLuca rubs his chin thoughtfully, then continues, "Now that you know so much about locks, you should have no trouble making a few. Go make yerself some locks that are pretty good for what you can do." DeLuca also adds, "Repeat this 4 times."
OK, I made 2 locks. One of -300 which turned out average, and one of -350, which turned out superior. I got no credit for a rep from either of these.
I tried handing the locks in, and that didn't work either.
>>give ass to deluca
DeLuca glances at you and moves out of your reach.
>n
[Rogue Guild, Courtyard]
Under the shadows of the overhanging branches of the tree and the high stone wall of the building to the north, a few cracked flagstones give way to a packed dirt surface that continues east. Wooden boards and stacks of crates are lined up against the wall in a haphazard pattern. You also see some beautiful wildflowers.
Obvious paths: east, south, west
>e
[Rogue Guild, Courtyard]
Most of the weeds and stones have been cleared from the courtyard here, and the dirt surface is packed hard and scuffed with the evidence of many footsteps and physical struggles. Wood panels rest against the walls, apparently to provide a small measure of padding over the rough stone. You also see Master Footpad Miller, Master Footpad Bean, a simple lock assembly, a primitive lock assembly, a simple lock assembly, a primitive lock assembly, Master Footpad Reilly, Master Footpad Murphy and Master Footpad Houlihan.
Obvious paths: south, southwest, west
>give ass to bean
Bean glances at you and moves out of your reach.
>ask bean about train lock
You ask Bean about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Bean says, "Da Trainin' Administrator must tell yas to work wit' me here, got it?"
Bean gives you a strange look.<<
OK so what do they want me to do? Make locks in a higher range of difficulty? More tumblers? I have NO clue!
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 07:43 PM CDT
>>give ass to deluca
>> DeLuca glances at you and moves out of your reach.
Before giving the lock assembly to one of the trainers first ASK <trainer> ABOUT TRAINING LOCK.
Then they will (hopefully) pull you into a training room and ask to see what you've made. Assuming they pull you in... wait for them to ask before handing them anything.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
>> DeLuca glances at you and moves out of your reach.
Before giving the lock assembly to one of the trainers first ASK <trainer> ABOUT TRAINING LOCK.
Then they will (hopefully) pull you into a training room and ask to see what you've made. Assuming they pull you in... wait for them to ask before handing them anything.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 07:45 PM CDT
Failing my prior post idea working...
What is (roughly) the max lock you can pick without self lore? Try making a lock that is within 20% of that value (e.g. -800 then try for -700 or so).
I'm hoping Plan A from the prior post works for you though.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
What is (roughly) the max lock you can pick without self lore? Try making a lock that is within 20% of that value (e.g. -800 then try for -700 or so).
I'm hoping Plan A from the prior post works for you though.
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
RATHBONER
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 07:59 PM CDT
Make a lock that would be large enough for a picking rep. (which for a 2x trained dark elf at cap should be about 560)
THROGG
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 10:08 PM CDT
I can get a -750 lock without lore, using a vaalin pick. I can get -400 or so using a copper.
The way DeLuca phrased it, I suspect that indeed I need to make bigger locks. I'll try something like -700 and see if that works.
The whole thing needs to be delineated more clearly.
The way DeLuca phrased it, I suspect that indeed I need to make bigger locks. I'll try something like -700 and see if that works.
The whole thing needs to be delineated more clearly.
THROGG
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 10:11 PM CDT
>>Before giving the lock assembly to one of the trainers first ASK <trainer> ABOUT TRAINING LOCK.<<
Peregrine, I did that.
>>ask bean about train lock
You ask Bean about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Bean says, "Da Trainin' Administrator must tell yas to work wit' me here, got it?"
Bean gives you a strange look.<<
Peregrine, I did that.
>>ask bean about train lock
You ask Bean about getting some training in Lock Mastery.
Bean says, "Da Trainin' Administrator must tell yas to work wit' me here, got it?"
Bean gives you a strange look.<<
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 10:13 PM CDT
Plan B it is then! I'm rooting for your -700 lock assembly!
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
-- Robert
Liia announces, "Funnel cakes will now be delivered door to door in your neighborhood!"
THROGG
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/05/2017 10:42 PM CDT
I made a -700 lock of average quality and got a rep. Yay.
Apparently lock size compared to picking ability is indeed a factor.
If I used a fixskills to drop my picking down to 1x, would the lock sized required for a rep go down?
The way these instructions are phrased is much too vague. Last time DeLuca asked for "good" locks; this time he
wanted "pretty good". Good sounds more exacting than pretty good; would "good" imply that a higher quality lock is needed for a rep?
The fact that even you folks who have gone through it before aren't totally sure what is going on is a telling indictment of
how poorly the tasks are delineated.
Apparently lock size compared to picking ability is indeed a factor.
If I used a fixskills to drop my picking down to 1x, would the lock sized required for a rep go down?
The way these instructions are phrased is much too vague. Last time DeLuca asked for "good" locks; this time he
wanted "pretty good". Good sounds more exacting than pretty good; would "good" imply that a higher quality lock is needed for a rep?
The fact that even you folks who have gone through it before aren't totally sure what is going on is a telling indictment of
how poorly the tasks are delineated.
RATHBONER
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/06/2017 06:22 AM CDT
>If I used a fixskills to drop my picking down to 1x, would the lock sized required for a rep go down?
Yes.
At high level required lock sizes drop as training drops. I'd expect a capped 1x dark elf to get a rep at -390.
The fraction of maxlock required goes up as training goes down, but if you were making -700 off 2x training, I don't think you'd have a problem with getting the quality at 1x. You might create problems for your picking reps though, because you might be getting too high a fraction of boxes from hunting that you couldn't pick at all.
>Good sounds more exacting than pretty good; would "good" imply that a higher quality lock is needed for a rep?
Check what it says in GLD. I suspect the phrasing is exactly the same there as it was last time and the difference is between there and DeLuca.
Yes.
At high level required lock sizes drop as training drops. I'd expect a capped 1x dark elf to get a rep at -390.
The fraction of maxlock required goes up as training goes down, but if you were making -700 off 2x training, I don't think you'd have a problem with getting the quality at 1x. You might create problems for your picking reps though, because you might be getting too high a fraction of boxes from hunting that you couldn't pick at all.
>Good sounds more exacting than pretty good; would "good" imply that a higher quality lock is needed for a rep?
Check what it says in GLD. I suspect the phrasing is exactly the same there as it was last time and the difference is between there and DeLuca.
JGALT22
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/06/2017 09:39 AM CDT
This task should definitely get cleaned up to provide more feedback to players. When they ask us to pick boxes, it's 'decent' or 'tough' locks. When they ask us to make locks, it's now 'pretty good' or, going from Throgg, 'good'. My 'tough' locks include down to -315, possibly lower, but when I created a -315 it didn't give a rep. Did I not succeed in making a -315 and it was actually a -300 or something? Or does 'pretty good' not exactly equal 'tough' but something within 10 or 15 difficulty? My -300, -315, and -330 created locks all gave me an 'average three tumbler lock assembly' which tells me exactly nothing.
I also shudder to think what it cost Throgg to create a -700 lock given it cost me 6.1k to make a -350 and it was rising faster than a linear rate. If I create as many locks from ranks 36-38 as I did clasps from ranks 33-35, I'll spend around 325k. Compared to my total clasp cost of around 15k, it's a bit of a shock. Unless the cost flattens out somewhere above -350, I'm guessing Throgg would be spending near a million to create all her locks (not counting all the failed attempts to get a rep because she was groping in the dark for what exactly was being demanded of her). Seems steep to me.
And, once more, the fact that she's considering fixskilling to get easier reps is yet another example of how basing ability to get reps on our picking skill/lockpick mod is a backwards system much like the picking experience system.
I also shudder to think what it cost Throgg to create a -700 lock given it cost me 6.1k to make a -350 and it was rising faster than a linear rate. If I create as many locks from ranks 36-38 as I did clasps from ranks 33-35, I'll spend around 325k. Compared to my total clasp cost of around 15k, it's a bit of a shock. Unless the cost flattens out somewhere above -350, I'm guessing Throgg would be spending near a million to create all her locks (not counting all the failed attempts to get a rep because she was groping in the dark for what exactly was being demanded of her). Seems steep to me.
And, once more, the fact that she's considering fixskilling to get easier reps is yet another example of how basing ability to get reps on our picking skill/lockpick mod is a backwards system much like the picking experience system.
RATHBONER
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/06/2017 10:26 AM CDT
>My 'tough' locks include down to -315, possibly lower, but when I created a -315 it didn't give a rep. Did I not succeed in making a -315 and it was actually a -300 or something?
I suspect you can squeeze the tough lock down a bit when picking in ways that you can't when making locks. e.g. When the baseline would have been about 370 for me under normal conditions with a fresh pick, I could actually rep off about 330 by using a degraded pick and being injured. While the minimum lock for a rep might be susceptible to being squeezed a little by not curing a couple of injuries, I doubt its capable of being squeezed because you own a degraded pick.
Making locks smaller than you intended can happen. I forget exactly how you tell its happened, but I remember it being obvious when I did it. (it wasn't a problem when doing reps, but I did find it happening after promising a sorcerer locks that were a little too tough)
I suspect you can squeeze the tough lock down a bit when picking in ways that you can't when making locks. e.g. When the baseline would have been about 370 for me under normal conditions with a fresh pick, I could actually rep off about 330 by using a degraded pick and being injured. While the minimum lock for a rep might be susceptible to being squeezed a little by not curing a couple of injuries, I doubt its capable of being squeezed because you own a degraded pick.
Making locks smaller than you intended can happen. I forget exactly how you tell its happened, but I remember it being obvious when I did it. (it wasn't a problem when doing reps, but I did find it happening after promising a sorcerer locks that were a little too tough)
OM1E5GA
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/06/2017 10:36 AM CDT
I don't recall near the level of expense or difficulty with making locks that's being reported. I also don't recall having to create very many locks (certainly not enough to consider fixskilling), though it's been several years, my rogue is 3x, and I was hunting in an area where I could make 1 mil in a day or two if I wanted...
The most difficulty I ever had with making locks was when I was trying to figure out how to make several locks that work with the same key for a sorcerer. That's not near as straight-forward as it seems like it should be.
Starchitin
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
The most difficulty I ever had with making locks was when I was trying to figure out how to make several locks that work with the same key for a sorcerer. That's not near as straight-forward as it seems like it should be.
Starchitin
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
THROGG
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/06/2017 11:59 AM CDT
The cost of making locks isn't as huge as you think, JGalt22. Once done with them, you can sell them back for about 75% of the cost of making them. It's still not cheap, but I have the silvers to do the job. It's more a matter of frustration at not being told exactly what is needed, combined with the time sink.
JGALT22
Re: Lockmaking woes continue
10/06/2017 12:20 PM CDT
It is possible the -315 tough rep vs -330 created rep is due to a modded down pick, I hadn't considered that.
Do you sell the assemblies to the attendant or the pawnshop or somewhere else, Throgg? That'll be a godsend.
Do you sell the assemblies to the attendant or the pawnshop or somewhere else, Throgg? That'll be a godsend.
