First off, my apologies for not getting stuff posted here sooner. I expected to be posting here weeks ago, it just hasn't worked out that way.
Although there have been several questions posted, I thought it might be clearest to provide the information by subject rather than as individual answers. So this post is just about the Crafting Skill Use computation.
There's a fair amount of detail imbedded in it, so I believe it will answer several of the questions, and the relative affects of the different pieces should be apparent. Also, I couldn't bring myself to reveal every number, but I think ranges of values will provide enough information to work from and should make some skill-use and character design decisions easier.
Grinder success chance is based on:
300 [Current crafting skill] (300 is just an example)
- 0 [aggregate wound pentalties](Just don't work with wounds or without full HPs!)
+25 [(Enhanced DEX Bonus + Enhanced DIS Bonus + Enhanced ST Bonus) / 3] (again, just an example value)
-100 [magical penalty (x * magical+)] (This example is an unspecified high+ material.)
- 5 [professional handicap (ranges from 0 to 40)] Think, "Does this profession require nimble hands?" "Best" professions have a 0 handicap. This example is for a Warrior.
+50 [racial bonus (ranges from -20 to +50)] - Think, "Is this race stereotypically considered to be good at crafting weapons?"
......
270 Net success chance (1 - 500) of using Crafting skill on this particular piece of material.
NOTE: While it may be argued that Elves are the finest at crafting anything and everything, the system, as it currently exists, is set up with a bias towards Dwarves as the best at crafting weapons, with Burghal Gnomes running a close second.
And yes, Gift of Eonake does affect one's chance of success when using the grinder, but it's a new enough wrinkle that without specific permission from Coase I won't be providing any details on how or to what degree.
At this point my plan is to post a similar layout in the near future for Forging Skill Use unless folks feel a different approach would work better.
- Mikos
GS4-MIKOS
DAID
Re: Catch-up forging info
12/16/2015 04:06 AM CST
Thanks!
I have saved it now: https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Forging_(saved_posts)#Crafting
We can consider to update the information in-line to the gswiki article as well, but putting it somewhere for future reference is the first step.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>Daid: Pretty sure you have a whole big bucket as your penny jar. You never have only two cents. :p
I have saved it now: https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Forging_(saved_posts)#Crafting
We can consider to update the information in-line to the gswiki article as well, but putting it somewhere for future reference is the first step.
Check out who's dying any time! https://twitter.com/GSIVDeathLog
>Daid: Pretty sure you have a whole big bucket as your penny jar. You never have only two cents. :p
SKNOX
Re: Catch-up forging info
12/16/2015 07:57 AM CST
Thank you so much for the information! I look forward to the information for the forging half of things. I suppose I never considered that crafting/forging might work in different ways. You might get to it with the info you will be providing but there is one question that fundamentally matters the most for me at least. Does the success chance also include the chance for a best piece within the same check/roll or is it an additional property determine after success/failure? Put simply, do enhancives and bonuses increase your chance of making an item or do they also effect your chance for a best piece in some way other than just shortening the time interval between successes? Thanks again!
Vhorg Emberskald
Vhorg Emberskald
LORD-FRORIN
Re: Catch-up forging info
12/17/2015 07:22 AM CST
Mikos, Just a follow up question, in the example you provided what determines if you make a superior product "best piece" or is that a completely separate calculation?
-Frorin
-Frorin
LORD-FRORIN
Re: Catch-up forging info
12/17/2015 11:01 AM CST
Another follow up question does Gift of Eonak have any impact on making a best part?
LORD-FRORIN
What goes into making a best part and why I care
12/17/2015 11:13 AM CST
I figured I'd explain my motives a little.
So recently I took on commissions to make two perfect weapons. A steel dagger and a mithril maul.
I averaged about 1 best part in 20 while using the grinder
I averaged about 1 best part in 15 while forging
I averaged about 1 in 10 perfect weapons while combining at the vise which is odd because it is nearly double that of grinding and they use the same skill checks.
The time investment was substantial about 40 hours of real time for each weapon.
I don't mind the time investment the only reason I want to better understand the math behind creating a best part is so that I can do everything in my power to improve my success rates with rare materials which I have a limited supply of.
So recently I took on commissions to make two perfect weapons. A steel dagger and a mithril maul.
I averaged about 1 best part in 20 while using the grinder
I averaged about 1 best part in 15 while forging
I averaged about 1 in 10 perfect weapons while combining at the vise which is odd because it is nearly double that of grinding and they use the same skill checks.
The time investment was substantial about 40 hours of real time for each weapon.
I don't mind the time investment the only reason I want to better understand the math behind creating a best part is so that I can do everything in my power to improve my success rates with rare materials which I have a limited supply of.
PFLATS
Re: Catch-up forging info
04/22/2016 10:40 PM CDT
I just saw this post, and it does not at all jive with my experience.
I'm seeing over a 15% minor failure rate (rescribe and try again, but oh wait you measured and cut your material so no dice) on my first 30ish handaxe hafts. On over 150 dagger hilts, I saw a 3.5% failure rate. Even if the racial bonus was a 0, I'd have a >500 net success chance, and according to the formula, I shouldn't be failing.
So, uh, what gives? An open roll would account for the daggers, which would make sense, and some ridiculously bad luck with open rolls could account for my handaxe luck since the sample size is small, but that doesn't sound right. Thoughts?
| Grinder success chance is based on: |
| 300 [Current crafting skill] (300 is just an example) |
| - 0 [aggregate wound pentalties](Just don't work with wounds or without full HPs!) |
| +25 [(Enhanced DEX Bonus + Enhanced DIS Bonus + Enhanced ST Bonus) / 3] (again, just an example value) |
| -100 [magical penalty (x * magical+)] (This example is an unspecified high+ material.) |
| - 5 [professional handicap (ranges from 0 to 40)] Think, "Does this profession require nimble hands?" "Best" professions have a 0 handicap. This example is for a Warrior. |
| +50 [racial bonus (ranges from -20 to +50)] - Think, "Is this race stereotypically considered to be good at crafting weapons?" |
| ...... |
| 270 Net success chance (1 - 500) of using Crafting skill on this particular piece of material. |
| 500 [Current crafting skill] Master |
| - 0 [aggregate wound pentalties] Perfect health |
| +21 [(28 DEX Bonus + 10 DIS Bonus + 25 ST Bonus) / 3] |
| - 0 [magical penalty (x * magical+)] Plain monir wood |
| - 5 [professional handicap (ranges from 0 to 40)] Warrior |
| +25? [racial bonus (ranges from -20 to +50)] Elf (listed as "bonus" on wiki, same as dwarf. Conservative estimate) |
| ...... |
| 541 Net success chance (1 - 500) of using Crafting skill on this particular piece of material. |
I'm seeing over a 15% minor failure rate (rescribe and try again, but oh wait you measured and cut your material so no dice) on my first 30ish handaxe hafts. On over 150 dagger hilts, I saw a 3.5% failure rate. Even if the racial bonus was a 0, I'd have a >500 net success chance, and according to the formula, I shouldn't be failing.
So, uh, what gives? An open roll would account for the daggers, which would make sense, and some ridiculously bad luck with open rolls could account for my handaxe luck since the sample size is small, but that doesn't sound right. Thoughts?
BRANDTJRT
Re: Catch-up forging info
04/23/2016 02:03 AM CDT
>So, uh, what gives? An open roll would account for the daggers, which would make sense, and some ridiculously bad luck with open rolls could account for my handaxe luck since the sample size is small, but that doesn't sound right. Thoughts?
I didn't see it mentioned originally, but does each weapon type have a penalty like different metals do? That could make sense for why you have more failures on handaxes than daggers.
I didn't see it mentioned originally, but does each weapon type have a penalty like different metals do? That could make sense for why you have more failures on handaxes than daggers.
PFLATS
Re: Catch-up forging info
04/23/2016 07:09 PM CDT
>I didn't see it mentioned originally, but does each weapon type have a penalty like different metals do? That could make sense for why you have more failures on handaxes than daggers.
That would make some sense (you need a certain skill level to even use the higher-level glyphs) and was my assumption up until now, but it wasn't included in Mikos post, so I discounted it.
That would make some sense (you need a certain skill level to even use the higher-level glyphs) and was my assumption up until now, but it wasn't included in Mikos post, so I discounted it.
