and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 08:08 PM CST
I like this one because its pure utility, and probably very useful to most clerics!

(320) Pastor's Promise

Duration: 120 minutes (not refreshable)

When cast on a fellow adventurer, upon their death, they will be preserved equal in duration to as if the cleric had cast the spell on them. Also, the casting cleric will be able to see the location of the fallen adventurer from Anywhere in the lands, regardless of the corpse's status.

A cleric may cast this spell on 1 adventurer and an adventurer may have only one cleric's promise at a time. A cleric may cast on 1 additional adventurer at 20, 50, 90, 140 and 200 ranks in religion lore and at 50 and 100 ranks in the cleric spell circle for a maximum of 8 adventurers at any given time.

Unlike most other spells, any adventurer may STOP this spell, regardless of their spell knowledge.

-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 08:38 PM CST
>(320) Pastor's Promise

This, I like. A lot.




-farmer

*
That's just what we want, criss-crossing furrows all over the town streets from someone wandering through with their animated plow super buddy.
-Strath

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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 08:59 PM CST
A 20th level spell slot for that? Sounds like an addition to 308 to me.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 09:24 PM CST
>A 20th level spell slot for that? Sounds like an addition to 308 to me.
E

I think it makes perfect sense as a stand alone spell since clerics are designed to assist with the dead and dying.


-farmer

*
That's just what we want, criss-crossing furrows all over the town streets from someone wandering through with their animated plow super buddy.
-Strath

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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 09:31 PM CST
For twenty mana, I'd say you clerics should get more bang for your buck.

Perhaps open it up to a group cast, with lores extending the duration of cast /LK.

Also, tie this in with chrism. Chrism raises keep a touch more exp with this.


Ack! Scarab!
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 10:30 PM CST
I don't know, I kind of like it. Though I like the idea of adding it to a chrism even more.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/19/2010 11:29 PM CST
yea I hear the "more bang for the buck" ... since this doesn't really help the cleric as much as other adventurers. but then again, there are a lot of spells like that simply to fit in the scheme of things with a certain profession.

I actually considered the group version for a moment, but realized that there could be problems with something like that...

I think it should remain targeted. However, I do like the idea of having to be in the cleric's group to receive this promise, and the cleric should also have to be the leader of the group or vice-versa (only works via cleric and leader of group or cleric may cast on anyone in their group if they happen to be leading)

Think of this as a watchful bond for your friends. After playing a cleric to level 35 in the current medium of Gemstone (playerbase, spells available, mechanics in hunting areas) and with clerics being the "save my butt" profession for all intents and purposes for the game, they need an ability like this.

Say my cleric's friends went hunting, but he didn't know exactly where they were going. He could simply cast this Promise on them, and if they happened to be buried while dead on the glacier, the cleric's watchful prayer would guide him to that friend without having to search the entire glacier over and failing attempts at using the Locate Person spell. But even if they went to the other side of the Dragonspine and were buried by a critter, you would know exactly where they died! It is a direct bond, unlike the Locate Person spell, which would be vastly inferior but useful to find people you did not or would not normally use a Promise on.

Not only is that a powerful feature to a spell, but this prayer also "life keeps" your friend, so you have time to run to them, search them out of necessary, grab them, and get out of harms way as quickly as possible without having to worry about them decaying while you deal with a Sanctuary, Fog, etc.

-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 12:51 AM CST
Group too much? What problems do you see with it?
I suppose it would blend better at a 15 min duration, stackable. Make it complement massies. Then that cleric knew odds were he would have a raise or two coming his way soon. This would help clerics push exp from raising as a primary in today's reduced population.

But that's not the concept put forth.

I've never played a cleric, so I have no idea how much of a pain doing a rescue is, or how this might cause people to call "dibs" on a corpse. I guess I should ask, why use that duration as opposed to stackable. Is that just to avoid costs of multiple casts?


Ack! Scarab!
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 05:37 AM CST
This spell would be really useful for mid-level clerics that RP.

Capped clerics, MA pocket clerics and Lich users don't need it, but they are all overpowered already.

The only real problem I see is the similarity to Voln. It would be giving clerics a power that is currently a society speciality. I am sure clerics would love a 320 that allowed them to turn spirit into mana too but the game design at the moment is that you get that power via a society. Seeing when your friends are in NEED and getting SIGHT of where they are, is a speciality of Voln.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 06:19 AM CST
The spell should create a bond between Cleric and target. If/when the target dies, the corpse is kept and the cleric is notified. The cleric can summon the corpse to him from gold ring range via a receptical gem, and the cleric's 308 delay timer is lessened significantly, though not for subsequent resurrections of that specific person. The countdown starts the second 320 is cast. If the time between the cooldown is exceeded by the spell's prior activation, there is no cooldown until the next resurrection attempt (though again, not with that same person).

TLDR: Cleric could pull the corpse to him, resurrect him, and could go resurrect someone else with no delay if the 308 timer was already long enough when activated by the 320 cast. You can't keep 320'ing the same person, though. Have the cooldown between 320 casts on the same person be the cooldown for a normal use of 308 at the time of resurrection.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 07:42 AM CST

>>TLDR: Cleric could pull the corpse to him, resurrect him, and could go resurrect someone else with no delay if the 308 timer was already long enough when activated by the 320 cast. You can't keep 320'ing the same person, though. Have the cooldown between 320 casts on the same person be the cooldown for a normal use of 308 at the time of resurrection.

That would be so amazing during invasions.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 08:03 AM CST
You couldn't chain resurrect the same person, but you could pick and choose people who you think are going to be in the thick of it. You'll still have to wait out the RT and spirit loss as well. You'd also have to use a receptical gem to summon the person, then another to resurrect if you want to keep his exp intact. Expensive process, but still, it gives the cleric options.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 09:45 AM CST
>>Expensive process, but still, it gives the cleric options.

Options are good, I like this idea a lot.


Vivaldi: You can't handle the Roh
Laphrael: no, roh-handler, i deny your roh-handling skills!


~~ 'o (the cleric formerly known as Rohomobo Fash'apos'troph'ilim'inzel Illistim or Rohomobo '''' for short)~~
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/20/2010 09:29 PM CST
Hmm, interesting with the 320 discussion.

>The spell should create a bond between Cleric and target. If/when the target dies, the corpse is kept and the cleric is notified.

Right, right... go on...

>The cleric can summon the corpse to him from gold ring range via a receptical gem.

I would prefer to not have this possible, but perhaps allow communications via WHISPER (like a ranger can whisper to folks but this would be a single direct link and communication with the now dead adventurer, only after they have died). Some people have boxes on the ground, or have had a weapon disarmed. Instantly teleporting them to you would not be a good thing for all intents and purposes of the spell.

Original design was to allow a cleric who is known in a certain community more time to get to a corpse and let them know where the dead corpse is anywhere in the lands, even if they had to travel from Solhaven to Pinefar, or Ta'Vaalor to somewhere near Zul Logoth. The lifekeep aspect is to give them the time to make the trip and exact location.

>the cleric's 308 delay timer is lessened significantly, though not for subsequent resurrections of that specific person.

I like this is a bonus gained via some sort of lore training. Blessings or Religion?

I think it still needs something...

Make it possible to self-cast it, but the self-cast version does this...

The cleric prayers to their deity and is granted a promise of their own. Besides being preserved upon death, the cleric's mana and health are filled. A cast of Miracle or a desperate field raise will have better chances of success. Also, any attempt to hide or otherwise make the body unable to be found by a critter will fail.

And I would also do this... a cleric cannot cast this spell upon another cleric.

-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/27/2010 10:52 PM CST
I like this idea...maybe it could even make the cleric have an easier time of dragging the person that they've promised. I don't know about the rest of you, but my cleric is usually weighed down by crap when someone dies, and dragging someone millions of miles with 10 second RT each room sucks.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/28/2010 08:45 PM CST
not to mention a halfling/gnome cleric trying to drag anything is a task in itself.


-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
Reply
Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/29/2010 12:13 AM CST
relieve burden should be castable at deaders.


-farmer

*
That's just what we want, criss-crossing furrows all over the town streets from someone wandering through with their animated plow super buddy.
-Strath

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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/29/2010 09:41 AM CST
Thisssss!
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/30/2010 09:57 PM CST
nice! I really like that idea farmer.


-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
Reply
Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/31/2010 05:55 AM CST
That was kicked around when the spell came out. I believe the GM said something to the effect of it doesn't fit the spell. Still sounds like a good idea to me. All the same, I would rather see the cleric gain the ability to summon the corpse to him. Limit it to a 130 droppoint to avoid abuse.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/31/2010 06:52 AM CST
>>All the same, I would rather see the cleric gain the ability to summon the corpse to him.

while I am sure clerics would like this, most corpses wouldn't... so it wouldn't really see much use if this was a "feature" of the spell.


-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
Reply
Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/31/2010 07:11 AM CST
The idea was that it was an add-on to the 320 idea. You cast the spell on someone while still alive. They would have the ability to break the connection at any point thereafter. Should they die, you use a nexus gem to summon them to you. The 308 timer starts the second you cast the spell, so if it has been long enough, you could resurrect the person and be able to perform a second resurrection as soon as your spirit would allow. Not on the same person, but on some other corpse. I believe there were other benefits, but the main idea was that 320 created a spiritual bond between you and the target. You could sense when he died, know the location, and be able to summon him to you if you had the needed component.

In terms of avoiding abuse, there are lots of steps that could be taken. As mentioned above, the target could UnSOMETHING (not unlink) and immediately sever the connection. At the time of death, the target would still have the ability to break the connection if they so chose. There would be a pause between the time of the beginning of the summoning, and the actual moving of the corpse. The target would sense the Cleric attempting to pull him away, and be able to block the Cleric's effort without any adverse effect to either party. Finally, the cleric could only pull him to a 130 drop point in the area. This will prevent abuse due to stuffing a corpse in a remote area.

The Relieve Burden idea was entirely separate.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 12/31/2010 10:56 PM CST
original concept never had teleporting of any kind, intentionally.

-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 01/01/2011 05:51 AM CST
If safeguards were in place why would you still be against the idea?
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 01/01/2011 08:36 PM CST
I think I understand what you are getting at... please allow me to suggest an alternative possibility.

the original concept of the spell was to lifekeep, thus extending the period until decay, and giving the cleric exact location of the fallen individual (even cross-realm), so they would have enough time to travel to another town if neccesary to fog to the victim and make the rescue before a decay.

I do understand that being able to teleport the corpse to you would be a HUGE bonus in some respects, since it would allow clerics to "rescue" a corpse without having to travel into an area they would not be able to survive in (ie: a level 25 cleric teleporting a corpse from Illoke Stronghold).

I am not saying it is a bad idea. In fact, it may work perfectly fine with such an addition, IF implemented properly. But there are definitely situations in higher level hunting areas where you don't want to be teleported out of the hunting area until certain other criteria are met (ie: recovering an item).

I would also see such an ability be an addition to the spell at a certain threshold in cleric spells ranks and/or lore training, not something able to do right off at the 20th spell rank. I think requiring a nexus gem would make it difficult to code as nexus gems already have an implemented function, and there is already enough demand for such gems in the game for a multitude of others tasks.

Something along the lines of this maybe,

At 20th spell rank, the "promise" will simply lifekeep the target and reveal their location to the cleric, regardless of realm.

At 40th spell rank, the Cleric may then recast this spell and it will Link the cleric and target as well as initiate a teleportation ritual along with the 15 seconds of round time. This is only possible IF the cleric is in the same realm as the target and they had already "promised" the target. The cleric must be in a minor sanctuary for this link/teleportation to be possible, or the effects of the second cast will fail.

Along with the normal 15 seconds of RT for Linking to a corpse, there is a 15 second period between the time the cleric casts and the teleport of the corpse actually happens, and the corpse may Unlink from the cleric to prevent any teleportation from occurring at all (mechanically, no Link = no teleport). Doing so will also result in the lifekeep aspect to drop as well, negating the entire promise. The corpse will get some messaging to know when their promised cleric is trying to teleport them.

And to restate, in case there was any confusion, the teleportation effects will not work if the corpse is cross-realm, the cleric will have to travel to within the same realm as the corpse.

I could see this being a very useful spell idea for clerics. It isn't combat oriented (in fact it is more pacifist then anything!) and has a huge utility effect with more training in the cleric spell circle.

-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
Reply
Re: and another 320 idea!!! 01/02/2011 09:50 AM CST
Note that some areas of the game cannot be teleported to, and I doubt highly spell 320 (if and when implemented) would be able to break those barriers. Hence, even if this suggestion is enacted, you still almost certainly won't be able to rescue a corpse from the Stronghold or the Bowels simply by waving your hands and chanting a spell.


"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"

"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville; we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 01/02/2011 10:02 AM CST
>you still almost certainly won't be able to rescue a corpse from the Stronghold or the Bowels simply by waving your hands and chanting a spell.

At least, not unless you had so much lore that you could probably waltz in/out of the place.
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Re: and another 320 idea!!! 01/02/2011 06:55 PM CST
right, the idea is that you only gain basic benefits with the base version. you gain additional benefits with more ranks in cleric spells and lores.

hashing out the details is for the GMs.

we, as players, can simply tell what we would like and wouldn't like on the forums.

-James-
player of Fremie

Mirayam says, "You are not a rogue, sir."

Mirayam exclaims, "You are noble!"
Reply