First, as per my Reports & Bugs last night, Estild I confirm that Unravel/1013 is absolutely NOT giving runestaff flares.
Can you check and see whether it was ever supposed to?
Given the concerns about smoking one of our own party members, could you see if it were possible to add a "no flare on my groupmembers" to it, if it is supposed to?
.
Moving on:
Why is it that Unravel/1013 has to have a random component built into it (to determine "how much mana you pull from the target"), when there is already a random component built in (how badly it fails warding) as well as a success reduction component (how much of the pull you actually receive, base on Mana Control)?
I've gotten more mana (like 12-16) on a renewal at 180 net result than I have (like 6-10) on a 250 net result; some times I can literally Ping-Pong up and down the warding scale and see [warding:mana] high:low low:high high:high low:low on consecutive renewals.
Why can it not be satisfied with degree of warding to make up the random component, and then limit the transfer by Mana Control as now?
KRAKII
KRAKII
Re: Speaking of looking into spells...
09/22/2015 12:32 PM CDT
"Why is it that Unravel/1013 has to have a random component built into it (to determine "how much mana you pull from the target"), when there is already a random component built in (how badly it fails warding) as well as a success reduction component (how much of the pull you actually receive, base on Mana Control)?
I've gotten more mana (like 12-16) on a renewal at 180 net result than I have (like 6-10) on a 250 net result; some times I can literally Ping-Pong up and down the warding scale and see [warding:mana] high:low low:high high:high low:low on consecutive renewals.
Why can it not be satisfied with degree of warding to make up the random component, and then limit the transfer by Mana Control as now?" -- Me, message #516
.
Actual log from last night, when I was still 47th. (Yaay, me; made a level.) Note that his CS is artificially heightened by a heavy orb/Mystic Focus, but even without it: 100% chance/cannot fail, except for d100==1 FUMBLE results.
You weave another verse into your harmony, directing the sound of your voice at a stone troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +145 + CvA: +20 + d100: +13 == +139
Warding failed!
You feel your song resonate around the stone troll, pulling at the threads of mana within.
You gain 16 mana!
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
(Forcing stance down to guarded)
Your disk arrives, following you dutifully.
>You change your tune slightly, adding the element for Song of Depression to your song...
Your spellsong is ready.
>
You weave another verse into your harmony.
You begin singing a harmony of depression and lethargy.
A stone troll appears to be struggling with the debilitating force!
CS: +251 - TD: +165 + CvA: +20 + d100: +88 == +194
Warding failed!
A stone troll appears slower and looks depressed.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
A stone troll swings a war hammer at you!
AS: +306 vs DS: +276 with AvD: +28 + d100 roll: +28 = +86
A clean miss.
>You sing with renewed vigor!
You maintain the harmonics of your song, continuing to focus on the threads of mana from the troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +115 + CvA: +20 + d100: +16 == +172
Warding failed!
The silvery tendril continues to wend its way away from the troll.
You gain 8 mana!
Renewing "Song of Unravelling" for 4 mana.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
You sing with renewed vigor!
You maintain the harmonics of your song, continuing to focus on the threads of mana from the troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +115 + CvA: +20 + d100: +4 == +160
Warding failed!
The silvery tendril continues to wend its way away from the troll.
You gain 11 mana!
Renewing "Song of Unravelling" for 4 mana.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
You sing with renewed vigor!
You maintain the harmonics of your song, continuing to focus on the threads of mana from the troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +115 + CvA: +20 + d100: +92 == +248
Warding failed!
The silvery tendril continues to wend its way away from the troll.
You gain 13 mana!
Renewing "Song of Unravelling" for 4 mana.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
I've gotten more mana (like 12-16) on a renewal at 180 net result than I have (like 6-10) on a 250 net result; some times I can literally Ping-Pong up and down the warding scale and see [warding:mana] high:low low:high high:high low:low on consecutive renewals.
Why can it not be satisfied with degree of warding to make up the random component, and then limit the transfer by Mana Control as now?" -- Me, message #516
.
Actual log from last night, when I was still 47th. (Yaay, me; made a level.) Note that his CS is artificially heightened by a heavy orb/Mystic Focus, but even without it: 100% chance/cannot fail, except for d100==1 FUMBLE results.
You weave another verse into your harmony, directing the sound of your voice at a stone troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +145 + CvA: +20 + d100: +13 == +139
Warding failed!
You feel your song resonate around the stone troll, pulling at the threads of mana within.
You gain 16 mana!
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
(Forcing stance down to guarded)
| +39 result, 16 mana |
Your disk arrives, following you dutifully.
>You change your tune slightly, adding the element for Song of Depression to your song...
Your spellsong is ready.
>
You weave another verse into your harmony.
You begin singing a harmony of depression and lethargy.
A stone troll appears to be struggling with the debilitating force!
CS: +251 - TD: +165 + CvA: +20 + d100: +88 == +194
Warding failed!
A stone troll appears slower and looks depressed.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
| Good chance to add the RT, a la Slow and Pious Trial... |
A stone troll swings a war hammer at you!
AS: +306 vs DS: +276 with AvD: +28 + d100 roll: +28 = +86
A clean miss.
| Yeah... I had forgotten to 'swap' my runestaff back over to the right hand, as I discovered when I ran into a giant, later. <cough> |
>You sing with renewed vigor!
You maintain the harmonics of your song, continuing to focus on the threads of mana from the troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +115 + CvA: +20 + d100: +16 == +172
Warding failed!
The silvery tendril continues to wend its way away from the troll.
You gain 8 mana!
Renewing "Song of Unravelling" for 4 mana.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
| +72 result... 8 returned |
You sing with renewed vigor!
You maintain the harmonics of your song, continuing to focus on the threads of mana from the troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +115 + CvA: +20 + d100: +4 == +160
Warding failed!
The silvery tendril continues to wend its way away from the troll.
You gain 11 mana!
Renewing "Song of Unravelling" for 4 mana.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
| +60 result, 11 returned |
You sing with renewed vigor!
You maintain the harmonics of your song, continuing to focus on the threads of mana from the troll.
CS: +251 - TD: +115 + CvA: +20 + d100: +92 == +248
Warding failed!
The silvery tendril continues to wend its way away from the troll.
You gain 13 mana!
Renewing "Song of Unravelling" for 4 mana.
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
| +148 result, 13 returned |
CMNABRIT
Re: Speaking of looking into spells...
09/22/2015 07:16 PM CDT
Yeah seems like a lot of randomness in result is built into a lot of our songs.
Your results remind me of my really unpredictable results with song of rage. Having 55 ranks of telepathy lets me potentially unlock up to 4 levels of rage at once, but last time I tested I couldn't even get a forest troll on the ground with out 3 or 4 renews.
I would love, for song of unravelling and songs of rage to be more reliable/useful given the mana costs, perhaps lore could give 100% chance for increased mana returns/rage levels, or reduce the mana cost of renewals. I also think it would be great if either the vulnerability to impact removed from sonic armor, or lore providing some small amount of damage or critical padding on sonic armor rather than improving durability. Since we're brainstorming, with all those lovely new weapon variant nouns released during HSN any chance I could sing a sonic version of some of them? I know a guy who really wants to sing a sonic yari.
I really hope there are plans to look at song lore implementation, and/or lore training costs for bards in the future.
Archales
Your results remind me of my really unpredictable results with song of rage. Having 55 ranks of telepathy lets me potentially unlock up to 4 levels of rage at once, but last time I tested I couldn't even get a forest troll on the ground with out 3 or 4 renews.
I would love, for song of unravelling and songs of rage to be more reliable/useful given the mana costs, perhaps lore could give 100% chance for increased mana returns/rage levels, or reduce the mana cost of renewals. I also think it would be great if either the vulnerability to impact removed from sonic armor, or lore providing some small amount of damage or critical padding on sonic armor rather than improving durability. Since we're brainstorming, with all those lovely new weapon variant nouns released during HSN any chance I could sing a sonic version of some of them? I know a guy who really wants to sing a sonic yari.
I really hope there are plans to look at song lore implementation, and/or lore training costs for bards in the future.
Archales
KRAKII
Re: Speaking of looking into spells...
12/08/2017 03:31 PM CST
As a 'bump' to my own message #516 in this thread...
...why is it that Unravel remains a mystery?
Konacon posted the exact details for Mana Leech/516 two years ago already, for the Wizards:
http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Wizards/Major%20Elemental%20Circle/view/682
No post of mine would be complete without a reminder about "Krakii's Big Long Laundry List":
http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Bards/Bard%20Magic,%20Spells,%20and%20Spellsongs/view/546
...why is it that Unravel remains a mystery?
Konacon posted the exact details for Mana Leech/516 two years ago already, for the Wizards:
http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Wizards/Major%20Elemental%20Circle/view/682
No post of mine would be complete without a reminder about "Krakii's Big Long Laundry List":
http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Bards/Bard%20Magic,%20Spells,%20and%20Spellsongs/view/546
