Goblins, in Haven or Crossing, should still teach well for 6-7 ranks. The proble might not be that you have the wrong critter but that you're using the wrong method of training TM. Gar Zeng works well from a very early point. What spell(s) are you using? Are you snap-casting, full target and prep, or what?

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

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Frogs to boars to eels/shamen/rams seems like a good progression for somewhere that's not Crossing (Riverhaven).

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Fuquois

<<What spell(s) are you using? Are you snap-casting, full target and prep, or what?>>

I'm using GZ as my primary TM spell and toy around with AEL every now and then to see how much AEL's damage has increased.

I've been using prep spell, target right away, and then waiting for the fully targeted messaging. I've also been timing how long he can wait between target and full target messaging before he backfires his casts. I'll try doing snap casts and see what that does to his learning rate.

<<Do not listen to BRFUQUOIS>>

Actually, the progression he mentioned is the one I've been thinking off taking. He started off in frogs and I recently took him to boars. He can dance with 2 boars using block stop and not get hit. The only time he'll get hit in boars is if a third one or a boobrie walks in. If boars had mana above hazy I'd keep him there.

As for weapons, I'll be making HE his secondary. When ME and HE are above 50, I'll pick up 2HE.

Looks like I'm headed to crossings to try out some of the hunting grounds Ahmir listed. Again, thanks for the responses.

Balshan

P.S. I've got plans to put him on a multi armor set up.

The single most important thing you can do is ensure that you soak every single bit of Multi-opponent from each critter you tackle.

Go to goblins and sit in the unarmed (southern area) until they don't train.. then the armed.. you should cap at around 42 ranks or so.

After that, head down to shard for a little boggle/kobold/jackal action. same thing.. soak that Multi up.

You'll have a little gap between them and rock trolls, spend your nights in Grendels/Wood Trolls, and your days in non-combats..

After that, you should be ready for Beissiwurms.. work them until you can handle Rock Trolls..

Rock Trolls will teach you for a little bit, until about 80ish ranks or so.. (again, focusing on Multi)

When you're done with those, head to Ratha, and savor the critter that is Sand Sprites...

This should get you going well enough to figure out what to do from there..

I trained (no scripts) 100+ Ranks in defenses in about 4 months with this method.

Sadly, I got suckered into power circling for a little while and now I've got to backtrain my multi.. ::Grunt::

Multi is the single most important skill in this game for combats.. more multi = more critters = better training.. Period.

<<<Sadly, I got suckered into power circling for a little while and now I've got to backtrain my multi.. ::Grunt:>>>

::chuckles:: You sound like me when I was between 35th and 40th with Balshan. I put him on a power trip to get his TM to 200 by 40th and before the TM changes went in. I got it to 210 by 40th. Only problem is that I put all his defenses and weapons way behind. He's now 51st and I've decided that after a ton of backtraining, its time to start a new character.

So yeah. I've learned a few things from my mistakes with my Balshan.

<<<Multi is the single most important skill in this game for combats>>>

Agreed. I've been a nag to friends that have sluffed off on their multi training in the past and told them how to work it effectively. They've thanked me once they started seeing it fly up and their deaths go down.


Balshan

sorry should say WMs with 1000+ TM.

>I don't think the barbs in TF with 1000+ bow or WMs with 1000+ hiding or thieves with 1000+ evasion are huge MO fans.

This may be attributable to the fact that TF started before the combat change that made MO much more important and useful. Backtraining 400 ranks of MO would not be such a desirable task, and trying to train it when its way below level is quite dangerous. It is possible to get by without good multi, but having it makes things exceedingly easier.

-Tropicalo

<<<wouldn't it be more beneficial to spend the few months getting Balshan back on course instead of spending the several more months just to get the new WM up to the same level Balshan is?>>

If I had the time like I had when I was in college to play DR, it would've taken me a couple of months to close the gaps listed below. But I don't anymore.

Here's the defensive gaps I've been working on closing since I started the backtraining a couple years ago (I took a 10 month break during this time.):

I'll start by saying his TM is currently 220.

He picked up 116 ranks of leather while closing his evasion gap. His evasion was 100 behind his TM when I started. It's now 60 behind. That's still to much of a gap for me if he runs out of harness and his buffs fall when training TM.

Multi was 100 behind. It's now 84 behind.
HP used to be 95 behind. Like multi, it's currently 84 behind.
Because he's HP prime, parry hasn't needed to be backtrained. It's 35 behind.

With the exception of parry, those are some ugly gaps. But I wouldn't have them if I didn't take advantage of the TM plinking system to get 210 in TM by 40th before it got changed. Well, we reap what we sow. And I sowed Balshan a defensive problem by being ambitious in TM training. ::chuckles::

Between getting sick of the backtraining and not seeing much to look forward to after I reached 51st (for the spell slot), except for more training and spell slots, I didn't see the point in putting more time into training him. Give us the sentinels, the new fams, and/or our part of the creation system and I'll start training Balshan on a regular basis again. In other words, something to make me want to keep playing him.

<<In other words, picking up the first # ranks in a skill will be a lot faster for Balshan than it will be for the new guy.>>

Agreed. Balshan does have the advantage in this area. What I said above about his picking up leather to move evasion proves your point.

Yeah, it might seem a little crazy to train up a new character in the same guild when I've already got a 51st level character in it. But I'm enjoying doing it because of the following reasons. 1.) It's gotten me readdicted to DR, 2.) The challenge of training a new character, and 3.) Seeing what happens when I take this one down a different spell path than the one I took with Balshan.


Nathan - Balshan's and Uflen's driver

P.S. I apologize if part of this post looked like a rant. I had no intention of making it look like one.

P.P.S. Again, thanks for the input you guys on the hunting grounds. Looks like Pothanits (sp?) are going to do a good job of moving my newbies TM.