So anyway we will see the return of ball lighting. Or maybe another spell like it with a different look. Like a thunder cloud or something?
AURANAR
DR-RAESH
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 02:35 AM CDT
At some point I'd like to go through the spells that still haven't been converted (many guilds still have a couple) and see if we can salvage them. Not sure why Ball Lightning didn't make the cut offhand - though I have some guesses.
If those are right I think some of the work I'm doing on Crystal Spike right now would make it easier to bring Ball Lightning back. We'd still need to figure out a solid niche to make it an appealing spell, but it's something I could see happening.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
If those are right I think some of the work I'm doing on Crystal Spike right now would make it easier to bring Ball Lightning back. We'd still need to figure out a solid niche to make it an appealing spell, but it's something I could see happening.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
ROBERTDH
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 03:13 AM CDT
I was always pretty underwhelmed with ball lightning: mechanically slow and the messaging kind of silly. I'm not sure it would improve under the modern TM paradigm.
>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
DR-RAESH
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 08:35 AM CDT
I don't think it would work as a cyclic - WMs already have a number of TM cyclics fighting with each other.
Maybe some sort of pseudo pulse spell ala MAB? Not sure.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
Maybe some sort of pseudo pulse spell ala MAB? Not sure.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
RHODGES232
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 10:03 AM CDT
I would rather see the electricity book fixed before a new electric spell comes out. Or perhaps the electric book is not "broken" but needs something done to it, the damaging spells for electricity are terrible. LB is so inaccurate I will do more damage with a base+10 FS then I would with a base+10 LB over the course of 10 casts on at level targets just for the simple fact that LB is so inaccurate. Then there is CL, I do not even know where to begin on how to fix that spell.
LB: take away the DFA component, make the DFA meta from a scroll, add some nerve damage to it or whatever to make making a new meta worth it. But give it normal accuracy, and damage, it is lightning damage type after all and that's one of the elemental damage types.
CL: No clue...
LB: take away the DFA component, make the DFA meta from a scroll, add some nerve damage to it or whatever to make making a new meta worth it. But give it normal accuracy, and damage, it is lightning damage type after all and that's one of the elemental damage types.
CL: No clue...
RHODGES232
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 10:13 AM CDT
Double it up:
10 casts back to back with LB Base+10 harnessed mana full target.
You see a lava drake.
The lava drake has tiny hairline cracks along the head, tiny hairline cracks along the neck, a slightly cracked stone right leg, a slightly cracked stone left leg and tiny hairline cracks along the abdomen.
It is wearing nothing!
It is holding nothing!
R> appr drake
You are certain that the lava drake is battered.
You are certain that the lava drake is slightly fatigued.
You are certain that it is a little stronger than you are.
You are certain that it is about as agile as you are.
You think it is likely that it is somewhat less disciplined than you are.
You are certain that it is about as quick to react as you are.
You are certain that it is apparently as conditioned as you are.
Taking stock of its offensive abilities, and defending with a damite ceremonial shield and a kertig schiavona with an intricate basket hilt of polished silversteel, you are certain that the lava drake is definitely less skilled.
Taking stock of its defensive abilities, and attacking with a kertig schiavona with an intricate basket hilt of polished silversteel, you are certain that the lava drake is a relatively easy opponent.
[Roundtime: 5 seconds]
FS killed a new one on the 10th cast. it's damage looked close to the same, I am assuming it died from vitality loss due to the multiple shards.
10 casts back to back with LB Base+10 harnessed mana full target.
You see a lava drake.
The lava drake has tiny hairline cracks along the head, tiny hairline cracks along the neck, a slightly cracked stone right leg, a slightly cracked stone left leg and tiny hairline cracks along the abdomen.
It is wearing nothing!
It is holding nothing!
R> appr drake
You are certain that the lava drake is battered.
You are certain that the lava drake is slightly fatigued.
You are certain that it is a little stronger than you are.
You are certain that it is about as agile as you are.
You think it is likely that it is somewhat less disciplined than you are.
You are certain that it is about as quick to react as you are.
You are certain that it is apparently as conditioned as you are.
Taking stock of its offensive abilities, and defending with a damite ceremonial shield and a kertig schiavona with an intricate basket hilt of polished silversteel, you are certain that the lava drake is definitely less skilled.
Taking stock of its defensive abilities, and attacking with a kertig schiavona with an intricate basket hilt of polished silversteel, you are certain that the lava drake is a relatively easy opponent.
[Roundtime: 5 seconds]
FS killed a new one on the 10th cast. it's damage looked close to the same, I am assuming it died from vitality loss due to the multiple shards.
POWERHAUS
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 11:42 AM CDT
We didn't get Ball Lightning because that's what it was theorized our familiar attack would do at one point- run around the room attacking things
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
DR-RAESH
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 12:00 PM CDT
LB is DFA. DFA is less accurate in general since it has a niche function.
Is DFA properly balanced right now? Maybe yes, maybe no.
All that said, I'm not sure what the hate for the electricity book is all about.
All else being equal (IE: A target that has the same resistance to all damage types) gar zeng and fire shard are practically the same spell and use identical TM modes.
Chain Lightning is area single shot (Which is a somewhat weak template right now) but isn't in any meaningful way weaker than comparable spells. Maybe it should be multishot again? Or AoE DFA? Or is the role fine and it's just underwhelming compared to other AoE options?
Do note that WM electrical spells are kind of odd and do fire + electrical damage rather than having a physical component. This could be either good or bad depending on your target. I did notice that the balance between electrical and fire isn't the same from spell to spell which is something we could look into changing... though, again, the result of that would depend on how the resistances of your target were set up.
Overall we're looking into some TM improvements to try and allow greater flexibility between different types of TM spells.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
Is DFA properly balanced right now? Maybe yes, maybe no.
All that said, I'm not sure what the hate for the electricity book is all about.
All else being equal (IE: A target that has the same resistance to all damage types) gar zeng and fire shard are practically the same spell and use identical TM modes.
Chain Lightning is area single shot (Which is a somewhat weak template right now) but isn't in any meaningful way weaker than comparable spells. Maybe it should be multishot again? Or AoE DFA? Or is the role fine and it's just underwhelming compared to other AoE options?
Do note that WM electrical spells are kind of odd and do fire + electrical damage rather than having a physical component. This could be either good or bad depending on your target. I did notice that the balance between electrical and fire isn't the same from spell to spell which is something we could look into changing... though, again, the result of that would depend on how the resistances of your target were set up.
Overall we're looking into some TM improvements to try and allow greater flexibility between different types of TM spells.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
ROBERTDH
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 05:03 PM CDT
Electricity spells have no added value (unless arc light still lights naptha....sometimes...) very bad environmental restrictions, and have collectively been nerfed more than anything so we all remember when they were spells that felt good to cast.
Everytime I threw a CL out of habit during the preview I watched the results and thought, "well that was stupid, why did I do that?"
>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
Everytime I threw a CL out of habit during the preview I watched the results and thought, "well that was stupid, why did I do that?"
>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
REAVER1
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 05:44 PM CDT
>Everytime I threw a CL out of habit during the preview I watched the results and thought, "well that was stupid, why did I do that?"
This has pretty much been thoughts on CL each time I've cast it, recently.
Fire Rain, too, for that matter.
This has pretty much been thoughts on CL each time I've cast it, recently.
Fire Rain, too, for that matter.
POWERHAUS
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 08:47 PM CDT
AL works better about lightning naphtha than before - but only if it's on the head... it doesn't always work though.
It does minor (up to cuts and bruising!) head damage. Still more reliable than old AL's lighting effect though.
at least CL still works indoors?
Maybe if it hit multi times like old CL, but instead of LB's it was more like GZ and weaker, and just cap the #of targets or total bolts like they did before to prevent game crashing instances?
I'm guessing they do fire + electric so they'll light naphtha? I remember we went from 3 to 2 damage types per spell
I think we all miss nerve damage or at least the benefit that it added.
Otherwise in my mind FS equals GZ, Fireball totally owns LB, GZ probably owns LB, and Shockwave in either form are way better than CL(damage as well as debalance/knockback)
*Fire Rain's not so bad, It works wonders with MOA, and it's great in invasions or crowd control - downsides are it doesn't work indoors and if things are fire resistant. ex: Worked wonders on forest drakes, while Rimefang is preferred for lava drakes - as far as leaving a cyclic TM running.
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
It does minor (up to cuts and bruising!) head damage. Still more reliable than old AL's lighting effect though.
at least CL still works indoors?
Maybe if it hit multi times like old CL, but instead of LB's it was more like GZ and weaker, and just cap the #of targets or total bolts like they did before to prevent game crashing instances?
I'm guessing they do fire + electric so they'll light naphtha? I remember we went from 3 to 2 damage types per spell
I think we all miss nerve damage or at least the benefit that it added.
Otherwise in my mind FS equals GZ, Fireball totally owns LB, GZ probably owns LB, and Shockwave in either form are way better than CL(damage as well as debalance/knockback)
*Fire Rain's not so bad, It works wonders with MOA, and it's great in invasions or crowd control - downsides are it doesn't work indoors and if things are fire resistant. ex: Worked wonders on forest drakes, while Rimefang is preferred for lava drakes - as far as leaving a cyclic TM running.
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
ABSOLON
Re: Ball lightning
07/27/2014 09:08 PM CDT
Every time this discussion comes up I am reminded that entire Moon Mage TM suite is basically ALA plus the lightning spell book with slightly different restrictions and damage types (not counting SLS which might end up being comparable to ball lightning) and I have a good chuckle. ALA=DO/PD, GZ=TKT, LB=Burn, CL=TKS.
Elanthipedia - https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page
Elanthipedia - https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page
GREGORYN4
Re: Ball lightning
07/29/2014 07:05 PM CDT
Ball lightning was a very underwhelming spell.
The present iteration of chain lightning offends me.
Fireball does more multi-striking than chain lightning now.
Chain lightning should be multi-strike AOE. Right now it's shockwave minus the ability to push things back.
Spamming CL with original rimefang and fire rain was the best thing in the whole world. Now I feel like a shadow of my former self. A purposeless spirit roaming Mer'kresh. The children are like, "Mommy, why is that man so sad?" And before rushing their children off their mothers replie, "That's not a man.. that's a Gnome."
The present iteration of chain lightning offends me.
Fireball does more multi-striking than chain lightning now.
Chain lightning should be multi-strike AOE. Right now it's shockwave minus the ability to push things back.
Spamming CL with original rimefang and fire rain was the best thing in the whole world. Now I feel like a shadow of my former self. A purposeless spirit roaming Mer'kresh. The children are like, "Mommy, why is that man so sad?" And before rushing their children off their mothers replie, "That's not a man.. that's a Gnome."
CATHULU
Re: Ball lightning
12/17/2014 04:52 AM CST
>>At some point I'd like to go through the spells that still haven't been converted (many guilds still have a couple) and see if we can salvage them. Not sure why Ball Lightning didn't make the cut offhand >>- though I have some guesses.
>>If those are right I think some of the work I'm doing on Crystal Spike right now would make it easier to bring Ball Lightning back. We'd still need to figure out a solid niche to make it an appealing >>spell, but it's something I could see happening.
It would make for one hell of a cyclic spell. I'm pretty sure we are the only magic primary/secondary guild that doesn't have a ranged cyclic that can move rooms.
- Erixx
>>If those are right I think some of the work I'm doing on Crystal Spike right now would make it easier to bring Ball Lightning back. We'd still need to figure out a solid niche to make it an appealing >>spell, but it's something I could see happening.
It would make for one hell of a cyclic spell. I'm pretty sure we are the only magic primary/secondary guild that doesn't have a ranged cyclic that can move rooms.
- Erixx
