Blown many boxes with it on, never even seen it proc once. Does anyone ever get any benefit from this khri?
DERPTRON
NINEVAH1
Re: Does Secure even work?
12/31/2015 04:40 PM CST
It has saved me from blowing a trap plenty of times. If you blow a trap then it's not going to save you from that. You will get a message on a failed disarm about using your skill to avoid something bad. It will stop a trap from blowing, not avoid a trap that has been blown.
DERPTRON
Re: Does Secure even work?
12/31/2015 05:21 PM CST
Any idea what the messaging is when it does work?
NINEVAH1
Re: Does Secure even work?
12/31/2015 07:06 PM CST
I dug through some logs and couldn't find it quickly, but I know I have seen it trigger within the last 6 months.
BLUEFROG99
Re: Does Secure even work?
12/31/2015 08:42 PM CST
R> disarm quick
You quickly work at disarming the crate.
Thanks to an instinct provided by your sense of security, you barely avoid detonating the trap due to your fumbling efforts. You doubt you'll be this lucky every time.
Roundtime: 1 sec.
You quickly work at disarming the crate.
Thanks to an instinct provided by your sense of security, you barely avoid detonating the trap due to your fumbling efforts. You doubt you'll be this lucky every time.
Roundtime: 1 sec.
BENNETTJ13
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 09:12 AM CST
Lol
I've never seen that. And I cap the khri and have crap ranks for locks. Meaning my boost should "seem" much larger in respect to my skill. I mean, ideally I should be seeing that all the time if it's even remotely a skill (magic) based effect. I don't know. Seems kinda silly. Like, how many mages would be up in arms if when they cast 4 buff spells and the main effect worked 1 in 20 (50? 200?) times? The rest of the time they got a different buff. So you have to put up 4 khri to get a perc buff, and a chance at some help with a box? Meh.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
I've never seen that. And I cap the khri and have crap ranks for locks. Meaning my boost should "seem" much larger in respect to my skill. I mean, ideally I should be seeing that all the time if it's even remotely a skill (magic) based effect. I don't know. Seems kinda silly. Like, how many mages would be up in arms if when they cast 4 buff spells and the main effect worked 1 in 20 (50? 200?) times? The rest of the time they got a different buff. So you have to put up 4 khri to get a perc buff, and a chance at some help with a box? Meh.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
DERPTRON
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 09:32 AM CST
Pretty much my point. It should trigger at least 50% of the time when it's on to even be significant. Seems to be more like 5% and utterly pointless as a result.
BENNETTJ13
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 10:08 AM CST
You should complain to the Thief Guru and GM.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
NINEVAH1
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 01:40 PM CST
To be fair no other guild can put up a combination of spells/abilities and get an additional effect on top of what those spells/abilities already do. Thieves get a pretty ridiculous buff to Locksmithing in many ways. I've been popping Assassin boxes since 450 in the skill with the rare death and Secure has saved me from a few, also.
>>So you have to put up 4 khri to get a perc buff, and a chance at some help with a box? Meh.
I'm guessing you meant locks buffs and not perc, but either way you can buff both those skills with 1 Khri. The Secure combo uses 3 (not 4) Khri that all buff something that benefits opening boxes (+Locks, +Perc, and +Agility). You would be using all these anyways if you want a full buff. This isn't taking into account our confidence and urban bonuses. Giving us a chance to avoid a death on the odd chance we blow a trap is really just throwing us a bone at this point. Not only are we way better than any other guild at opening boxes but we can avoid a screw up. Raising the chance that Secure will stop a blown trap to 50% would take away pretty much all the risk of boxes IMO. I haven't blown a box in nearly a year and I'm training on boxes that are above at-level with Disarm ID. Do we really need to be invincible?
>>So you have to put up 4 khri to get a perc buff, and a chance at some help with a box? Meh.
I'm guessing you meant locks buffs and not perc, but either way you can buff both those skills with 1 Khri. The Secure combo uses 3 (not 4) Khri that all buff something that benefits opening boxes (+Locks, +Perc, and +Agility). You would be using all these anyways if you want a full buff. This isn't taking into account our confidence and urban bonuses. Giving us a chance to avoid a death on the odd chance we blow a trap is really just throwing us a bone at this point. Not only are we way better than any other guild at opening boxes but we can avoid a screw up. Raising the chance that Secure will stop a blown trap to 50% would take away pretty much all the risk of boxes IMO. I haven't blown a box in nearly a year and I'm training on boxes that are above at-level with Disarm ID. Do we really need to be invincible?
BENNETTJ13
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 01:57 PM CST
lol I was going off the top of my head. I get it, but why have the effect at all if it's hardly ever going to happen? What's the point?
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
NINEVAH1
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 02:10 PM CST
You are welcome to your opinion of course, but I've seen it happen quite a bit, and at the levels of boxes I pick it has saved me from quite a few deaths. The GM's are welcome to look at it and adjust it to their liking, but I'm just trying to reasonable in my view of the situation. We are hands down the best guild in this area of the game and the benefit isn't constant but has been useful for me.
BADGOPHER
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 03:13 PM CST
>To be fair no other guild can put up a combination of spells/abilities and get an additional effect on top of what those spells/abilities already do.
At the risk of getting into GvG arguments, that's because, comparatively, thieves do less and require more effort/ranks to do so, per ability. The khri combinations are akin to requiring you to fire off 4 buffs then sacrifice a large portion of your mana and concentration until one falls.
At the risk of getting into GvG arguments, that's because, comparatively, thieves do less and require more effort/ranks to do so, per ability. The khri combinations are akin to requiring you to fire off 4 buffs then sacrifice a large portion of your mana and concentration until one falls.
DERPTRON
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 03:42 PM CST
>>You are welcome to your opinion of course, but I've seen it happen quite a bit, and at the levels of boxes I pick it has saved me from quite a few deaths.
Weird because I use it all the time and I've blown about 3 boxes with it on in just the last few days. In fact, I've never seen it work. Prompting me to start this thread. Sometimes I wonder if our abilities even do anything at all.
>>Thieves get a pretty ridiculous buff to Locksmithing in many ways.
You find a series of openings on the front of the casket concealing the points of several crossbow bolts glistening with moisture.
Disarming the ironwood casket would be a longshot.
Roundtime: 8 sec.
R> khri start safe sight focus
Focusing intently, you mentally weave together three mantras, allowing the power contained within to slowly spread out from your core.
With but a quick thought, your hands steady and your mind gears itself to the purpose of getting into what others want you out of.
Darkness is no bar to a trained Thief. With careful focus, you adjust your eyes to see in shadow as they do in light.
With deep breaths, you recall your training and focus your mind to hone in on improving your physical dexterity.
The combined power of your mental focus seeps further throughout your body, granting you a comforting feeling of security in your dealings with objects others don't want you to get into.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the ironwood casket...
You find a series of openings on the front of the casket concealing the points of several crossbow bolts glistening with moisture.
Disarming the ironwood casket would be a longshot.
"Ridiculous boost" indeed.
ZETHIN01095
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 03:45 PM CST
>>Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the ironwood casket...
This is the key line in your log, once a box is ID'd I don't believe the odds line changes.
a much better test would be gather up 30 boxes from the same critter, ID them all, record all the values, open them without secure, then gather 30 more boxes, put up secure ID and record the values and compare in a neat little graph. 30 probably isn't a large enough sample size but you'll see a neat little shifted bell curve of the results. I bet it'll be pretty.
>>What a monster difference. We truly are the best at box popping.
Also this statement just seeps ignorance, try popping at level boxes with a thief and without a thief. It's nuts, a couple years ago I was doing Stomper boxes with 350-400 ranks where other guild need 500+. Lately I've found I can pop first tier Xala with 600 ranks where other guilds are needing 800ish ranks.
While I'm not in love with Secure as a combo (I'd rather see it be 100% dodge a trap every X minutes where X gets lower with skill) it's still a nice bonus stacked on top of 5 other bonuses that help opening boxes (Confidance, Urban, Khri, Khri, Khri)
This is the key line in your log, once a box is ID'd I don't believe the odds line changes.
a much better test would be gather up 30 boxes from the same critter, ID them all, record all the values, open them without secure, then gather 30 more boxes, put up secure ID and record the values and compare in a neat little graph. 30 probably isn't a large enough sample size but you'll see a neat little shifted bell curve of the results. I bet it'll be pretty.
>>What a monster difference. We truly are the best at box popping.
Also this statement just seeps ignorance, try popping at level boxes with a thief and without a thief. It's nuts, a couple years ago I was doing Stomper boxes with 350-400 ranks where other guild need 500+. Lately I've found I can pop first tier Xala with 600 ranks where other guilds are needing 800ish ranks.
While I'm not in love with Secure as a combo (I'd rather see it be 100% dodge a trap every X minutes where X gets lower with skill) it's still a nice bonus stacked on top of 5 other bonuses that help opening boxes (Confidance, Urban, Khri, Khri, Khri)
DERPTRON
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 03:51 PM CST
>>This is the key line in your log, once a box is ID'd I don't believe the odds line changes.
Nah, when I move to a room with town bonus the odds get better on the same box.
Thieves have confidence and town bonus that makes popping easier. Safe though apparently doesn't give me enough boost with 40 disc to even drop a level of difficulty.
Nah, when I move to a room with town bonus the odds get better on the same box.
Thieves have confidence and town bonus that makes popping easier. Safe though apparently doesn't give me enough boost with 40 disc to even drop a level of difficulty.
DEFOL
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 03:57 PM CST
<< This is the key line in your log, once a box is ID'd I don't believe the odds line changes.
It does.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
The iron casket will be a simple matter for you to disarm.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
You can disarm the iron casket with only minor troubles.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
The iron casket's trap is a trivially constructed gadget which you can take down any time.
>khri safe
With but a quick thought, your hands steady and your mind gears itself to the purpose of getting into what others want you out of.
Roundtime: 3 sec.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
The iron casket's trap is a trivially constructed gadget which you can take down any time.
It does.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
The iron casket will be a simple matter for you to disarm.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
You can disarm the iron casket with only minor troubles.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
The iron casket's trap is a trivially constructed gadget which you can take down any time.
>khri safe
With but a quick thought, your hands steady and your mind gears itself to the purpose of getting into what others want you out of.
Roundtime: 3 sec.
>disarm cask ident
Somebody has already located and identified the current trap on the iron casket...
Right above the lock inside the keyhole, you see a tiny metal tube just poking out of a small wad of brown clay.
The iron casket's trap is a trivially constructed gadget which you can take down any time.
DEFOL
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/01/2016 04:18 PM CST
While i agree that we have it easy i'm still not a big fan of RNG mechanics used in this type life and death system. If it was up to me i would like to see something else entirely but that ship has already sailed i guess.
<< I haven't blown a box in nearly a year and I'm training on boxes that are above at-level with Disarm ID.
Same here and for me it's so many years that i can't even recall exactly but probably for other reasons, as i only disarm my boxes carefully even when ID might suggest quick or blind. IMO disarming at higher level never justifies the risk with all the training options available these days.
<< I haven't blown a box in nearly a year and I'm training on boxes that are above at-level with Disarm ID.
Same here and for me it's so many years that i can't even recall exactly but probably for other reasons, as i only disarm my boxes carefully even when ID might suggest quick or blind. IMO disarming at higher level never justifies the risk with all the training options available these days.
BLUEFROG99
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/02/2016 12:16 AM CST
Secure is a massive skill boost and--my absolute favorite part--a roundtime reduction. With an easter egg that sometimes you might dodge traps you set off. Stop thinking of that as the main feature and maybe you'll feel better. I hate opening boxes without secure up, because I open so very many at once, and I want to be done with it as fast as possible.
BENNETTJ13
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/02/2016 12:41 AM CST
The very point of a combo is an additional feature.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
BLUEFROG99
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/02/2016 03:20 AM CST
> an additional feature.
>> a roundtime reduction
I realize it's not the sexiest of additional features, but it improves my life.
>> a roundtime reduction
I realize it's not the sexiest of additional features, but it improves my life.
ABSOLON
Re: Does Secure even work?
01/02/2016 04:15 AM CST
> an additional feature.
>> a roundtime reduction
<<I realize it's not the sexiest of additional features, but it improves my life.
For my Bard, it makes the top 5 list of most missed features for him. Fast locksmithing is a good thing.
Elanthipedia - https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page
Epedia Admins - https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Elanthipedia:Administrators
>> a roundtime reduction
<<I realize it's not the sexiest of additional features, but it improves my life.
For my Bard, it makes the top 5 list of most missed features for him. Fast locksmithing is a good thing.
Elanthipedia - https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page
Epedia Admins - https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Elanthipedia:Administrators
