If this has been posted already I am sorry for reapeating it.


I read the things about multi languages IG and believe no matter the price it would be worth it to learn one or so. Nothing worse than someone talking in their own language and snickering at you :snickers: But tis their right. But if the gms decide to add this to game and think its worth the time. Perhaps some more books are needed ones that can only be read if you are that race or have learned that language. Perhaps the history of different Elven clans and why Dragonspine is pretty much empty save the elf that takes you there. Would love to see ancient elven text telling more of the elf way of life and the thought of only elves being truly able to tell it to someone not of their race. Would make for some more chances to better roleplaying. Just a thought anyway

Two things. First, I don't know if you've ever tried to learn another RL language. But when I listen to two native speakers speaking a different language than English, I'm extremely hardpressed to understand what they're saying, as they talk so rapidly. Second, I don't think that having an automatic translation from the English you type to the language you want to speak in is feasible. If you really want to do that you can learn the language yourself.

And there is a way to understand any language in the game. Become a Bard, and use the Aura of Tongues enchante. It's nice to be able to hear what those Elves are snickering about. Usually it's about how they wish they were Prydaen. ::hums cheerfully::

Kaedan.

<<Acodamoon exclaims in illithic "bir otso!"
Elves would see
Acodamoon exclaims in illithic "a wolf!">>

Reason that wouldn't work: The in-game languages aren't all inclusive. If an Elf said, "Holy grapefruit, Solomon!" the game would be at a loss, since there is no Ilithic word for 'grapefruit.' Just wait for Linguistics in DR2.


S.

Didn't know where else to post this, so...

I have always thought (and have posted this before in the past) that languages should be a learnable skill. I mean, we cal all learn another language, right? Some might be harder to learn given two key factors : Your native dialect and the dialect you are attempting to learn. For example, someone who speaks native Vietnamese may have a hard time with French as you go from a language with staccato beats to a more melodious tone.

~or~

A Got?Tog may have difficulties in learning Elven, but it can be done to a degree.

I think characters should be able to learn other languages. Period. It can be funny, actually, as you are just beginning to learn the dialect you may only catch a few words, misunderstand others?

ELF A says to ELF B in Ilithi, ?So I saw this big red balloon the other day?

HUMAN A (Ilithi 15% Learning) hears: ?So this <word> baboon in the sun?

Or something like that? however, unlike other skills, this one would be better to have a max cap of 100. Granted, even those non-native speakers at 100% will not have the correct accent or such, and races learning more difficult languages (see above example) may only be able to learn 80% max? who knows?

Personally I think it would be GREAT to learn other languages. And to teach languages to others. (this is a little half-baked right now, so forgive me if it is less eloquent than I would like)

Are there any other thoughts on this?

~The only good Swamp Troll is one that makes you breakfast in the morning. Other than that, it's a dead Swamp Troll~

~ Kaeson Avient'iel - bemused, confused, abused - Ranger at large ~

>Personally I think it would be GREAT to learn other languages. And to teach languages to others. (this is a little half-baked right now, so forgive me if it is less eloquent than I would like)

Unlike real life, everyone starts out being able to communicate (unless they choose to roleplay otherwise, but that's extremely uncommon). This makes the primary role of racial languages being to exclude other races from understanding you in roleplay situations. If languages were made learnable, they would either just take time, or they would take some sort of cost, like TDPs. If it was the former, everyone would eventualy learn all the languages, and generaly eliminate the entire purpose of having them at all. If it was the latter, almost nobody would learn a language, because it's not worth spending TDPs on something with such a tiny intrinsic value. I personaly like languages as a means of excluding other races, it gives you a more definite feeling of being part of a race, if that makes any sense. If that was undermined, I would find it rather annoying.


-Kitrinx & Riaka

ayup, wilstead'd love ta speech anudder langidge wit no accent jist like he speeches da commen tunge

Wilstead

It's a 'togs world after all

Why cost TDPs? Why not make it a skill just like anything else? You just have to go through the pains of sitting there for hours on end (SOME guilds would love this) and listen. The teacher can learn Language and Teaching, the student can learn Language and Scholarship, just like regular teaching. As far as having a cap, I don't really think there should be one. If you are around people long enough, why wouldn't you be fluent? I have never been to Mexico, and I am probably 80% fluent in Spanish... I live around Native Americans, and I am becoming fluent in their languages. I think the ability should be easier for certain racial groups (Maybe the Elf can learn easier from a human than a Gor'Tog, etc)... I think that would be a great idea.


--Raydell et al.

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"Well folks, you know what that means... now I'll do a dance."

I would if it were NOT a skill. Heaven forbid something in this game doesn't revolve around how many ranks you have in something. It would be nice if there was something else... I don't know what I'd call... knowledge maybe? I don't know. Things in this category would include: horses (how to take care, ride, etc... you don't have to have 5 ranks in horse grooming to groom the damn thing), smoking: you have to practice to learn images, but it's not like you have 100 ranks of smoking is it?, languages: you've listened on classes and histories of other races, you need to sit through a lot to learn a diff language (and yes I agree diff races should have easier/harder times to learn certain languages). Maybe the libraries could conduct extensive classes, etc for a price.

SOME people would rather spend time roleplaying and actually getting into the game than repeatedly doing smaller tasks in order to gain a rank. =/


~Vila

www.aldaren.com

not only languages but i want dialects too! i really do! and if dialects and accents are different since im uneducated and dont know, i want them too.

Verbal

that might be somewhat true and at the same time false. It would make sense that after a long period of time, that a person would develope an accent from a particular area, that would be easy to code and could be an addition to extended citizenship from a particular area.

say whatever its an example

John says in a Therengia accent "whatever its an example"

i like this idea, it is possible, and while people may put their own spin on their accents with the quirky spellings that is hard to read, to me milk is still milk, but if hear hear someone from new york vs cali vs georgia vs you get the point, the list goes on and on, they all sound a little different

I wasnt talking about programs for different speech patterns, i was trying to get a common speech patterns that develope in areas over time, that possibly would develope in the different provinces. Will such a thing ever happen, no probably not, but I still bring it up everyonce in a while cause i want an accent, not a speech program.

Have a nice day

verbal

I would love Maxx to learn to speak the various languages. Please put something in place!

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Lt. Maxxwel Lightish of the Zoluren Phoenix

The Zoluren Phoenix is recruiting. Contact me at MaxxwelDR to find out how to join us.

>>If you're comparing 1% to whole, sure. But if you're comparing goat to cow, to anything else, forget it.<<

i didnt mean different types of milk, i mean just how the one work is said. i was using a word that i know is one of the indicaters of location, pillow is another one, i mean theres a ton of them, but if you wanted to get all analytical and stuff the different races could compare to differnt types of milk yup.

so the wonderful Bambina brings up another great point in that if a person wanted to, why wouldnt they have an accent from their native language? maybe this is something that is picked up on after spending time with said race. have an option to have a elvish accent or a therengia accent, plus yes i want to speak like dwarfish "Huzzah"

verbal

Consent for speaking another language to someone...

Umm, please no. There are so many ways to gain consent now, lets not add too the list because someone does not like the human speaking Ilithic.

Granted, its all a pipedream at this point, but shesh....

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Lt. Maxxwel Lightish of the Zoluren Phoenix

The Zoluren Phoenix is recruiting. Contact me at MaxxwelDR to find out how to join us.

>>I would love Maxx to learn to speak the various languages. Please put something in place!<<

You mean slur the various languages :D

Anyone know where to find Language tanslators nowadays? been looking but the one site I knew seems to be gone now...


Stone Warrior Deagar,
Order of the Dragon Shield Council Leader

Concur with this. I've always wondered why this isn't an option, especially with people having legendary scholarship skills now...

<< What I mean by this European language is that in Europe while it isn't impossible for a person to know only one language it also is more frequent to know not just one language but multiple languages. >>

Well, all people in DR know at least two languages, right? (I dont know this for sure, I really have not played all the races). Yes many europeans know at least two languages, the dutch being amazing for knowing beyond two, but outside of them it isnt that common to be entirely fluent in more then two. But reality of course has no bearing in DR.

<< I think the amount of languages you can be learning at one time should be based on some type of Scholarship/Intelligence. Further I'd really like Lore Primaries to get a little nod, or a full nod in giving them a lowering of time taken, stats needed (they are the Lore Primes). >>

Learning more then one at a time should increase the learning time for each. Why not keep it simple, one at a time.

<< Personally I think you should have to go to some NPC or Library and Study Language Haakish or Gerenshuge or Ilithic or Gamgweth. Remote locations, make it cost to have a group of teachers teaching you and giving you attention, time in their library. >>

I like this idea over my study guide idea. What if, on a timer of once per month, you could go to X place (where language makes IC sense) to learn your next chunk of language. And after X months, you know it fully. I think the key to making it a fun idea and preventing it from turning into everybody knowing every language is a) make learning take time, a LOT of it and b) limit learning, I origonally said intel, but scholarship also makes sense, perhaps some combo of the two makes most sense. But it should NOT be tedious either, studying a book once per day, visiting a class once per month, etc.. not tedious, but still something to work for. I particularly like the idea of going to an a location that makes IC sense once a month because it encourages exploration (while at the same time wont tie you to staying there endlessly).

One of my main reasons for suggesting the long period of time is the fun that could be had in the learning process (understanding only a certain percentage of sentenes spoken). If you learned the whole language in a week, there is a fair chance no IC situation would come up where you ran into a language barrier and only partially understood someone (which sounds seriously fun to me). And really, languages are a purely IC thing, no one gets in game advantage from languages, so no reason not to make learning them realistic and a very long process. Lets face it, most all of us spend years and years in DR, one fun little perk taking a long yet reletively easy to do task could be a really fun thing.

<< Some suggest it should cost TDP, some don't. I think the big cost should be time spent in 'quest' for the language. >>

My main issue against TDP cost is how many will be willing to give up stats (or spells for those few who opt for that) for what is essentially a purely RP thing with no mechanics advantage? Sure there are plenty of players who lean far more heavily to RP and care little for any mechanics advantage, but they are less common I think. I think if the effort was put into such a system and TDP cost was involved, ultimately not many would take advantage of it and a lot of effort would go to little use.

<< if you're particularly enthusiastic about your language learning you can become fluent in half a year. >>

I do not want to derail the conversation, reality has no bearing after all in how language works in DR. But what?? That is simply not true (unless you have a very odd idea of what "fluent" means).

<< Have you actually taken foreign language classes? >>

Yes, and for what its worth I have spent the majority of the last 5 years in countries where english is not widely spoken.

<< I've had classmates who started language classes (Spanish and Japanese) knowing as much as I do (i.e. nothing) and their enthusiasm has allowed them to reach conversational within months. Beyond that, whether you want to consider it fluent I guess is up to debate. I'll admit individual talent i.e. "language receptors" for the neuroscience geeks are probably a strong contributor in these cases, as well. >>

Conversational != fluent, hence the different name for the level. Still that said, it is not very common for someone to reach even conversational in such a short period, does it happen? Perhaps, but commonly? No, not at all, I have only seen it in total immersion situations with simple languages like gilbertese (but I am not going to pretend my personal experience makes me an authority on the subject).

But again, reality has little to do with DR. Note no where in my proposal for the time to learn a language did I suggest it had to do with anything realistic, I simply thought and still do think that long term goals are fun.

Just make it cost TDPs, goodness.

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Rev. Reene

"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust