>> Synthetic Pre-Req Changes

Wow! Really awesome changes. It's like you were reading my mind.

Just earlier I was counting the circles I needed to get vivisection which was.....(4+3 spell slots), 14 circles until I could pick up VIVI. (I already had REI.) And then 6 more circles to get USOL. So I was looking at 20 circles and THEN i would maybe swap over to SRE. I was like damn... that's a long time.

My necromancer is 38 circle for the record.

But now I can just swap over and grab Vivi! I'm so stoked. I really don't need Viscous Solution right now. And moving USOL to 80 takes care of any slot issues since that's in like 40 circles.


Really excellent QOL changes.


>> ACID SPLASH: Damage type changed from (Absolute Random) to Piercing + (Rand. Element).

Erm. Holy smokes. Such a cool change! I always thought ACS was cool but random damage was hard to see. Now elemental? Amazing. I can't wait to see the damage messaging change per cast! (If it does!) Either way. Awesome.

The graphical spell tree on Elanthipedia has been updated to reflect all of these changes.

A few things that still need updating for those with access to the spells:
- Alkahest Edge is missing the actual DISCERN description. Currently it is just a cut and paste of the OOC description from the announcement posts. https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Alkahest_Edge
- Alkahest Edge could use some example messaging entered. If it doesn't message any different from a normal Vivisection then feel free to make a note of that in the example messaging section instead.

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I updated Alkahest Edge, but I have no idea how to actually use it. I thought for optional metaspells, you have to prep it after prepping the other spell.

Does it just forever make the spell half elemental?

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Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>>My TM at 46 is 136. Is that low?

TM being your best/quickest learning offensive skill that is a bit on the low side IMO. Everyone trains differently though.


>>Maybe the circle level requirement should be uped now that its more accessible?

My Necro is the same circle as your's and has the skill in TM to use Vivisection. I don't believe that my character should be locked out of a spell he can use because it upsets other players that they can get it before they have the skill.

This has come up a bit in the past over other guild's spell books, and the response has been working as intended.

>> TM being your best/quickest learning offensive skill that is a bit on the low side IMO. Everyone trains differently though.

This may be true, but I can't use TM unless my shield/parry is high enough to withstand the monsters.

>> VIVI is a pretty impressive spell if you think about it, definitely being one of the Necromancers signature uniques. I would also point out that it shouldn't take you to 60-70th circle to get a secondary skill up to ~200.

Hmm. I guess I stopped TM training for awhile when I was getting my shield/parry up to around 100. I'll have to reevaluate then, I didn't realize my skills were so low!

Technically my arcane magic is like 180ish so I suppose TM could be that high too! Ha. Maybe I'm not fighting enough.

I suppose I can also use ivory mask? Do you think like... 180 + IVM would get me in VIVI range?

>>TM Mastery might help too. But it's an 18 mana spell - you probably won't be using it very frequently in your range.

This. TM Mastery + IVM would probably allow you to cast the spell, but at that min prep you will be burning through mana quickly if you used it to train.

I could make a toggle for activating Alkahest Edge, but it struck me at the time as needlessly complex.

-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Italo Calvino

>> Well, evasion, really... But sure - use PHP and CH to survive in combat.

I'm not sure a lot of people appreciate training a new necromancer using the new spell slot costs. It's easy to assign spell slot costs looking at the overall picture, but much harder the pacing it places on characters training up.

Unless I 100% min max, or completely ignore vital spell lines, its virtually impossible to have both PHP, CH, Vivi by circle 46. This is also ignoring spiteful rebirth.

I'll walk you through the approach I took.

I view Consume Flesh, Rite Of Contrition, and Eyes of the Blind as must haves. So I took these lines first, the order was not as important.
I also had to grab Manifest Force for warding training and also picked up Gauge because we have no utility until Eyes of the Blind.

I then decided I need to start training sorcery so picked up the 3 sorcery talents. (I probably could have skipped the 2nd spell)

After that I decided to head for spiteful rebirth by grabbing PHP first. (At least PHP can be hit with ROG while CH cannot.)

So currently at circle 46:

OBF, PV, EOTB, ROC
ACS, Vivisection
HP, SV, CF
IVM, BUE, CHI, KS, PHP

3x sorcery feats
cyclic harness feat

MAF, GAUGE

And I have... 2 spell slots left. I could drop BUE / CHI which would put me 5 slots, or circle 44 for CH. However, that's an "extra spell" on the path to Spiteful.

So assuming I didn't pick up BUE/CHI, this would give me 5 slots at circle 46. I need 6 total for SB, so circle 48 for SR. And then I would circle back for CH which is 4 spell slots, or 8 circles. This puts me at... circle 56. Again, assuming I ignore everything and head straight to these spells.

And of course I didn't plan everything to the T and that's why I picked up BUE / CHI because I thought it was a cool spell.

>I suppose I can also use ivory mask? Do you think like... 180 + IVM would get me in VIVI range?

>> I dunno, I'd say yes, but I don't know what the rest of your magics are at. TM Mastery might help too. But it's an 18 mana spell - you probably won't be using it very frequently in your range.

I was hoping to pick VIVI up because you mentioned it was great for stealth training. My stealth is currently too high for what I'm fighting because of all my shop stealing. But I guess there is not only a skill barrier, but a mana barrier. And I think VIVI was dropped to 15.

I could pick up TM mastery but I feel like I need to head straight for Spiteful. I currently have 0 favors and doubt I'm rezzable. So I've got my fingers crossed that I don't die in the next 10 circles.

Reallocate.

Hrm. Like I said, I can add a temporary toggle (a permanent toggle would be more irritating). Would with or without Alkahest be a better default?

-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Italo Calvino

>> Hrm. Like I said, I can add a temporary toggle (a permanent toggle would be more irritating). Would with or without Alkahest be a better default?

Permanent with Alkahest. Toggle w/o alkahest.

Alkahest is probably going to do more damage 95% of the time. I can only see it being less effective by elemental barriers and also by creatures with elemental resistance. But, its also random elemental so if you were fighting fire drakes you wouldn't ALWAYs get fire damage.


Is it possible you could add it to the prep? Instead of a temp toggle?

prep vivi alkahest?

or maybe

prep alkahest
prep vivi?

>>>> prep alkahest

Novel. Off hand I'm concerned that due to Vivi's unique mechs it won't work, but I'll poke.

-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Italo Calvino

>But I do think some acceleration is necessary because Necromancers are in a somewhat precarious position in that they simply do not have access to various resources without getting all of the "signature" abilities. These spells aren't simply luxuries if you are comparing other spellbooks.

I disagree - you're making choices. One of those choices is to get SRE, which I would say is not requisite for Necromantic shinanigans. CF probably isn't at your range either, though I don't say that with a ton of confidence. RoC probably is, but is a single slot.

>Yar, I don't mind waiting til 80th. It's just the new VIVI spell slot change really accelerates the circle that necromancers can obtain the spell. (Since I doubt many people will get Viscious AND REI ahead of the must haves). I'm sure many more people will run into this issue.

Yup, choices! They are grand.

>Maybe it's best to remove all spell circle requirements and just force players to pay more attention to spell reqs, skill levels and mana requirements. (Because I do agree with the poster its not entirely fair to limit players if they actually have the skill level.)

I think this is a bad idea. Gating some abilities by circle is perfectly reasonable.

>prep alkahest

I also think this is the best way of doing it, though if it's a problem, I feel that permanent Alkahest on with toggle ability off is the way to go.

>A bit confusing lore wise since USOL is often called the Alkahest. We might need another name for it if its possible...

Well, sort of - they're ostensibly referring to the same thing, that is, the Universal Solvent, which for the non-chemistry familiar refers to a substance in which everything/anything will dissolve in (preeeeeeeety scary). USOL appears to be an application of it via spewing it all around, while Alkhest Edge is... I dunno, making the psychic blades actually physical, and made of the Universal Solvent?

FWIW - 'Alkahest' means 'Universal Solvent'. For some funtime historical chemistry/alchemy, look up Aqua Regia, which was one of the pursued chemical solvents by all these crazy alchemists.

Some of your vital importance spells I guess differ by person. If you are not raising zombies and SRE'ing and being sparing with your use of DO generating buffs, you can use empaths for healing until roughly 60th circle (unless that changed somewhat recently). You are right in you will be unable to get more favors most likely, so either prior preparation and stocking up to use them while you still could would have been helpful, or just depart and dig up your grave. If your dying to mobs your grave will probably be safe, if other people are killing you then you have other issues to worry about.

I would say priority spells for someone who is trying to not make life difficult early, would be CF, Eotb, and RoC. Those three are pretty much all that you need to stay low profile if you are vigilant. You will of course need to add other spells to flesh out hunting and training, the cost of MAF and GAF is high, which could have simply been GAF and researched warding/utility/sorcery all in one with that spell while circling and obtaining more slots.

I picked up the full zombie suite of spells rather quickly, which I regret because I've not used them at all, am almost circle 100 and have neither VIV, USOL, or CH. I've been a feat junkie though, that is for sure.

My initial thought that was in certain situations it would better to have punct/slice instead of punc/elemental, since i'm sure there's spells and new wards and such that will deal explicitly with elemental damages.

Therefor, casting the default punct/slice would be a better choice. Still armors depending and what not.

> Not that I can think of many situations like this now

Like say, a war mage running the ethereal shield meta after barrier redesign.

Alright, I'll make a toggle where PREP ALK turns off/on the damage mod, where the default is that ALK is on if it's known. ALK will only stay off for an hour at a time, but can easily be toggled again if necessary.

Fair?

-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Italo Calvino

>> Alright, I'll make a toggle where PREP ALK turns off/on the damage mod, where the default is that ALK is on if it's known. ALK will only stay off for an hour at a time, but can easily be toggled again if necessary.

Nice! Sounds awesome.

Could you possibly add a similar toggle to Flame Shockwave, or poke someone else to do so? Right now, PREP FLS turns it on for a minute or two but I would love if it defaulted on and could be turned off for an hour like this.

- Starlear, Warrior Mage and Lieutenant of Ilithi's Crystal Vanguard -

>>Like say, a war mage running the ethereal shield meta after barrier redesign.

Of course, moments after me writing that I decided to try fighting celps and...

"The celpeze appears immune to electricity, fire and cold."

Hah.

>>Alright, I'll make a toggle where PREP ALK turns off/on the damage mod, where the default is that ALK is on if it's known. ALK will only stay off for an hour at a time, but can easily be toggled again if necessary.

This is awesome. Thank you.

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Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>> FWIW, I think having to choose between physical and elemental damaging spells like this is an example of the system improving. I'm really excited for this change for general purposes, and want to thank you Armifer for giving us the toggle option. Choices! They are grand.

Well said.