Previous
maybe because bones can be crafted by players and all the other tools can't?
anyway, even things written in "books" is subject to change depending upon gm-whim as well <the whole thing of kalag's memoirs vs GM-Cadaya's "official" timeline for example>, as things get "retro'ed" to reflect new game directions.
People are free though to have their characters "believe" the stories in one book and not another, depending on their feelings about the author, life-view, etc. That's what makes every character unique.
<<as I firmly believe that upstanding citizens have the inalienable right to strike down musicians whenever possible.>>
GERSTEINJ2
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/09/2012 11:55 PM CDT
And don't forget there's intentional ambiguity to a couple things; we aren't supposed to have a perfect picture of every historical event that's shaped our present world.
GERSTEINJ2
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 12:05 AM CDT
<<And don't forget there's intentional ambiguity to a couple things; we aren't supposed to have a perfect picture of every historical event that's shaped our present world>>
this. Our characters see things in different ways depending on guild/ sect/ upbringing, etc.
Case in point:
Look at a necromancer character under the influence of the Calcified Hide spell.
Another necromancer sees it one way. The necromancer himeself can look at himself and sees it another. A moon mage or an empath will look at the person in a totally different way.
It is all a matter of perspective, and there is no reason why each sect wouldn't have their own viewpoint proposed in their own sect halls, but the degree of observance of such is still up to each individual member of said sect.
<<as I firmly believe that upstanding citizens have the inalienable right to strike down musicians whenever possible.>>
this. Our characters see things in different ways depending on guild/ sect/ upbringing, etc.
Case in point:
Look at a necromancer character under the influence of the Calcified Hide spell.
Another necromancer sees it one way. The necromancer himeself can look at himself and sees it another. A moon mage or an empath will look at the person in a totally different way.
It is all a matter of perspective, and there is no reason why each sect wouldn't have their own viewpoint proposed in their own sect halls, but the degree of observance of such is still up to each individual member of said sect.
<<as I firmly believe that upstanding citizens have the inalienable right to strike down musicians whenever possible.>>
BRYCOLE83
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 02:32 AM CDT
>> In the vast majority of cases all* tools act essentially the same under the hood. I tell you this because the messaging really doesn't reflect it, and I rather people feel free to use what tool fits their RP vs avoiding a tool they would otherwise use because they feel it is mechanically "inferior" to others.
Cool. I'll go back to my Tokka deck then, love em. It just wasn't worth sacrificing a 1 hour prediction pool on RP or even "I like this better then that." :)
ILLIENA
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 05:40 AM CDT
> >Can you comment on whether Sects affect predictions?
> Yes.
Please comment.
> Yes.
Please comment.
DR-RAESH
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 07:03 AM CDT
>>Please comment.
I did.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
I did.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
ILLIENA
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 07:24 AM CDT
Ah. Well, can't fault me for thinking you were going for the mathematician's answer there.
NASTY3
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 08:36 AM CDT
>>Does anyone know which other prediction tools can change a bad prediction to good?
>>All. The messaging for some of the tools... leaves something to be desired.
>>In the vast majority of cases all* tools act essentially the same under the hood. I tell you this because the messaging really doesn't reflect it, and I rather people feel free to use what tool fits their RP vs avoiding a tool they would otherwise use because they feel it is mechanically "inferior" to others.
>>*Bones are... special and really do not act like the other tools in many ways. I'm at a loss to adequately explain why it was set up this way.
Thank you for the insight Raesh. This helps.
-Nasty
>>All. The messaging for some of the tools... leaves something to be desired.
>>In the vast majority of cases all* tools act essentially the same under the hood. I tell you this because the messaging really doesn't reflect it, and I rather people feel free to use what tool fits their RP vs avoiding a tool they would otherwise use because they feel it is mechanically "inferior" to others.
>>*Bones are... special and really do not act like the other tools in many ways. I'm at a loss to adequately explain why it was set up this way.
Thank you for the insight Raesh. This helps.
-Nasty
FALLENSHADOWS
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 08:38 AM CDT
>>Might just be because they came first. At least, I think they came first.
Bones pre-date other tools by a great deal, probably at least 7 years. Though in all honesty I'm not entirely sure. Their original incarnation behaved slightly different than the current one since it didn't use the align system.
Many of the messaging is exactly the same as it was back then, only thing that was added was some skills and the change to what PM shows on the sphere.
Many of the tools are sorta... half done... they don't all reflect the same properties, bones are the most complete of all the tools. Take that as you may.
As far as mirrors go, I've seen them flip a prediction but only once they tend not to do it very often and the messaging is vague its hard to tell it happened unless you know exactly what to look for since it doesn't create an additional message as much as alter one of the lines slightly.
I'm pretty sure mirrors can also flip a good prediction into a bad one, seeing as they got rid of my favorite use of mirrors a long time ago with a change. You use to be able to get a specifically rotten mirror and predict in an attempt to curse yourself. The mirror would always flip it to good and vice versa.
_______________________
It is impossible to strive for the heroic life. The title of hero is bestowed by the survivors upon the fallen, who themselves know nothing of heroism.
-Johan Huizinga
FALLENSHADOWS
Mirrors and Tingly
04/10/2012 08:51 AM CDT
This was brought up a long time ago, but if theres a chance a GM can dig through the code.
Mirrors are the only tool that doesn't display the tingling message, according to the GM at the time the message is there but doesn't display this has always steered me away from mirrors in general since I'm old and have the moon mage superstition of yonder that you should predict on a tingling sensation. A gm at the time said it didn't do much. But its hard to break habits that are induced by years of tradition.
Anyway we can get the message to display I would show a lot more love towards my mirrors, especially being a Tezirite, if I could do this.
_______________________
It is impossible to strive for the heroic life. The title of hero is bestowed by the survivors upon the fallen, who themselves know nothing of heroism.
-Johan Huizinga
The Light is Crimson through the Darkness.
Mirrors are the only tool that doesn't display the tingling message, according to the GM at the time the message is there but doesn't display this has always steered me away from mirrors in general since I'm old and have the moon mage superstition of yonder that you should predict on a tingling sensation. A gm at the time said it didn't do much. But its hard to break habits that are induced by years of tradition.
Anyway we can get the message to display I would show a lot more love towards my mirrors, especially being a Tezirite, if I could do this.
_______________________
It is impossible to strive for the heroic life. The title of hero is bestowed by the survivors upon the fallen, who themselves know nothing of heroism.
-Johan Huizinga
The Light is Crimson through the Darkness.
LEEJ82
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 02:05 PM CDT
<<I did.
Yes but did you mean past sect advantages in viewing constellations/planets?
That's what I want to know.
Yes but did you mean past sect advantages in viewing constellations/planets?
That's what I want to know.
DR-RAESH
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
04/10/2012 03:57 PM CDT
>>Bones pre-date other tools by a great deal, probably at least 7 years.
They were the first tool and were rewritten when the new system came out. They served as a template for all the others (Trust me, you can tell. There's actually code for bones messaging floating around in the bowls code that was never removed...) which makes it all the more baffling that they're the odd tool out.
>>Many of the tools are sorta... half done... they don't all reflect the same properties, bones are the most complete of all the tools.
I wouldn't say they're half done. All the bugs (that I'm aware of) have been fixed by now, but there are certainly some design decisions I question that make the system far less intuitive than it could be.
>>As far as mirrors go, I've seen them flip a prediction but only once they tend not to do it very often and the messaging is vague its hard to tell it happened unless you know exactly what to look for since it doesn't create an additional message as much as alter one of the lines slightly.
Actually there is no message change. This is why it's hard to tell when it's happening.
>>Mirrors are the only tool that doesn't display the tingling message, according to the GM at the time the message is there but doesn't display this has always steered me away from mirrors in general since I'm old and have the moon mage superstition of yonder that you should predict on a tingling sensation. A gm at the time said it didn't do much. But its hard to break habits that are induced by years of tradition.
I see no code there to support it, bugged or otherwise. If you need that tingling sensation, I suggest a Warrior Mage.
>>sect advantages in viewing constellations/planets
I said nothing about this.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
They were the first tool and were rewritten when the new system came out. They served as a template for all the others (Trust me, you can tell. There's actually code for bones messaging floating around in the bowls code that was never removed...) which makes it all the more baffling that they're the odd tool out.
>>Many of the tools are sorta... half done... they don't all reflect the same properties, bones are the most complete of all the tools.
I wouldn't say they're half done. All the bugs (that I'm aware of) have been fixed by now, but there are certainly some design decisions I question that make the system far less intuitive than it could be.
>>As far as mirrors go, I've seen them flip a prediction but only once they tend not to do it very often and the messaging is vague its hard to tell it happened unless you know exactly what to look for since it doesn't create an additional message as much as alter one of the lines slightly.
Actually there is no message change. This is why it's hard to tell when it's happening.
>>Mirrors are the only tool that doesn't display the tingling message, according to the GM at the time the message is there but doesn't display this has always steered me away from mirrors in general since I'm old and have the moon mage superstition of yonder that you should predict on a tingling sensation. A gm at the time said it didn't do much. But its hard to break habits that are induced by years of tradition.
I see no code there to support it, bugged or otherwise. If you need that tingling sensation, I suggest a Warrior Mage.
>>sect advantages in viewing constellations/planets
I said nothing about this.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
THEREALM
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/20/2012 07:16 PM CDT
Maybe Armifer or Raesh can answer this, since there's no way I can think of to PAFO due to messaging.
You mentioned that sect affiliation effects prediction tools.
Is there a bonus for using your sect's chosen tool?
Conversely, is there a penalty to using a different tool?
You mentioned that sect affiliation effects prediction tools.
Is there a bonus for using your sect's chosen tool?
Conversely, is there a penalty to using a different tool?
DR-RAESH
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/20/2012 09:17 PM CDT
>>Is there a bonus for using your sect's chosen tool? Conversely, is there a penalty to using a different tool?
Is there a practical difference between the two?
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
Is there a practical difference between the two?
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
THEREALM
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/20/2012 10:38 PM CDT
>>Is there a practical difference between the two?
I suppose not. I was imagining an un-sected Moon Mage as a baseline. Then a sected Moon Mage using a non-affinity tool could either return to the baseline or be penalized even further.
It's a difference between 'oh you're a G'nar Pethian but love the Tokka card messaging, that's cool you just won't get your bonus' and 'How dare a Pethian divine with anything but a bowl!'
I suppose not. I was imagining an un-sected Moon Mage as a baseline. Then a sected Moon Mage using a non-affinity tool could either return to the baseline or be penalized even further.
It's a difference between 'oh you're a G'nar Pethian but love the Tokka card messaging, that's cool you just won't get your bonus' and 'How dare a Pethian divine with anything but a bowl!'
DR-RAESH
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/20/2012 11:26 PM CDT
Technically it's structured as a penalty, but for the most part that's semantics and it may change during the 3.0 updates. We'll see.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
GERSTEINJ2
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/21/2012 02:49 AM CDT
what would be the preferable method for heritage house, as they don't have their own sect tool?
/---
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
/---
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
THEREALM
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/21/2012 08:52 AM CDT
Thanks for the info Raesh.
Quick secondary question then, akin to what the gonif asked. If a Moon Mage is unsected, or a member of HH, are they still receiving a penalty?
Quick secondary question then, akin to what the gonif asked. If a Moon Mage is unsected, or a member of HH, are they still receiving a penalty?
DR-RAESH
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/21/2012 10:06 AM CDT
>>If a Moon Mage is unsected are they still receiving a penalty?
Yes. That's why I said the question of bonus vs penalty really is a matter of semantics.
>>If a Moon Mage is a member of HH are they still receiving a penalty?
That's slightly trickier. For what you're asking, even if it's not what you realize you're asking, the answer is "Yes". Technically there's a few minor places where they're actually neutral (And it's the only way to count as neutral... so you can think of it as a mild bonus vs the wrong sect, or a mild penalty vs the right sect) but the vast majority of the time that's going to be washed out by other factors.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
Yes. That's why I said the question of bonus vs penalty really is a matter of semantics.
>>If a Moon Mage is a member of HH are they still receiving a penalty?
That's slightly trickier. For what you're asking, even if it's not what you realize you're asking, the answer is "Yes". Technically there's a few minor places where they're actually neutral (And it's the only way to count as neutral... so you can think of it as a mild bonus vs the wrong sect, or a mild penalty vs the right sect) but the vast majority of the time that's going to be washed out by other factors.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
ELWYNN
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/26/2012 10:17 PM CDT
All members of Fortune's paths are not drunken gypsies. If I recall right, they can have a very deep philosophical view as well as indicated in one of Armifer's posts.
DR-RAESH
Re: Choosing The Right Sect
07/26/2012 11:36 PM CDT
>>All members of Fortune's paths are not drunken gypsies. If I recall right, they can have a very deep philosophical view as well as indicated in one of Armifer's posts.
Correct. Though amusingly enough for awhile there most of the high profile PC members of FP I'm aware of weren't even gypsies, let alone drunken. Of course playing one as drunken gypsies isn't Doing It Wrong at all.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
Correct. Though amusingly enough for awhile there most of the high profile PC members of FP I'm aware of weren't even gypsies, let alone drunken. Of course playing one as drunken gypsies isn't Doing It Wrong at all.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
