In 2016, Raesh gave us a teaser of the rewrite of the Crystal Spike spell tentatively renamed Crystal Sorrow. In 2018, Grejuva replied to a post asking if it was still in the works and the answer was yes. Is anyone currently working on it?
Documentation is a love letter you write to your future self.
MOTHRA
AERATHOR
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/04/2020 01:10 PM CDT
Arbiters Stylus is basically it with new messages. My guess is they just moved it over and changed it slightly. Sadly its not even on a scroll and they get two signature cyclic tm spells they can use anytime once they have enough aura. Tertiary magic mind you. Also their basic early buffs cover Shield, Tactics and evasion. They can easily cover any gaps they miss with our scroll spells also.
When you measure the amount of spells moon mages lost from 2.0 to 3.0 ranging from Steelstar and Shadow Web to CRS and Ripple, and add in the ones that were nerfed or altered to function differently like TKS and Dazzle, the guild was gutted. Over the years some power was returned but it was mostly over shadowed by losing systems like enchanting and teleportation and seeing trader magic absorb some of our planned spells.
I personally feel trader magic out shines our magic due to its efficiency and their ability to cover any gaps with our scroll spells without being hindered in the way a moon mage is when he tries to cast blur or another spell that requires starlight. Even at night with three moons up I fail casting blur because of Snow falling, despite armifer saying we can cast fine with moons but struggle with star stuff in bad weather.
"An' I'm learnin' 'ere in London what the ten-year soldier tells; If you've 'eard the East a-callin', you won't never 'eed naught else. No! you won't 'eed nothin' else"
When you measure the amount of spells moon mages lost from 2.0 to 3.0 ranging from Steelstar and Shadow Web to CRS and Ripple, and add in the ones that were nerfed or altered to function differently like TKS and Dazzle, the guild was gutted. Over the years some power was returned but it was mostly over shadowed by losing systems like enchanting and teleportation and seeing trader magic absorb some of our planned spells.
I personally feel trader magic out shines our magic due to its efficiency and their ability to cover any gaps with our scroll spells without being hindered in the way a moon mage is when he tries to cast blur or another spell that requires starlight. Even at night with three moons up I fail casting blur because of Snow falling, despite armifer saying we can cast fine with moons but struggle with star stuff in bad weather.
"An' I'm learnin' 'ere in London what the ten-year soldier tells; If you've 'eard the East a-callin', you won't never 'eed naught else. No! you won't 'eed nothin' else"
SHIFT3
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/04/2020 09:01 PM CDT
> Arbiters Stylus is basically it with new messages.
It's really not. Here's Raesh's list: http://oneepicknight.com/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Moon%20Mages/The%20Lunar%20Magic%20Spell%20Books/thread/1763986
>> Sorrow - Created two delayed TM attacks. Chance for the first attack to be a feint (Crystal Spike Reskin).
Thematically, I don't know that crystal spike still fits the moon mage toolkit considering trader's niche, but it was still very different than crystal dart or Arbiter's stylus. A smart trader just uses dart for the first few ranks and then permanently swaps to strange arrow due to having no limitations or secondary resource requirements. ARS is good, but it's still a cyclic that requires direct moonlight or aura, and it's not delayed in any way or using the trader's primary skillset for damage.
The old Crystal spike was way, way, way more effective. It was a two-hit attack, and the first hit would effectively debuff the target before coming in with a massive hit.
> they get two signature cyclic tm spells
Only the one. Star crash is a pulsing AOE which also takes a hefty chunk of starlight. It's lackluster due to the high mana cost (even after the reduction), being magic tert, and due to the reduced AOE hit cap.
> the guild was gutted.
This is something I absolutely agree with. Not only did the guild lose identity to MTX (teleportation), but the limitations don't really make sense in today's DR. I strongly believe no spells other than focus moonbeam should require a moon. They should just have a modifier causing the spells to get stronger/weaker as moons are available, or require more skill to be successful. An "eclipse" mechanic of some sort. Shadow web should still be released, and they should get a usable high sorcery.
> it was mostly over shadowed by losing systems like enchanting
Moment of silence for enchanting. I wish the guild crafts stayed guild, remained in a usable state, and lores got something else or maybe a way to "cheat" and learn another guild's crafts. But that ship has sailed.
> without being hindered in the way a moon mage is when he tries to cast blur or another spell that requires starlight.
This is a grass is greener situation. Let me explain why no moonie really cares about trader spells, at least not the ones you mentioned.
- Blur? Just use seer's sense. It's blur without the penalties.
- Fluoresce? It's pretty good, but you have better debuffs in your toolkit using your primary skillset. MB, sleep, or pick up DR/Sick/Halt via holy sorcery.
- LGV? It doesn't require starlight.
- MEG? Moonies have the outdoorsmanship buff, and it doesn't require starlight.
- CRD? Traders don't even use this spell. It's a pre-req.
- Finesse? Doesn't require starlight, and moonies have a better (if unreliable) stat booster.
- PHK? Doesn't require starlight.
- Regalia? This is a cantrip in the world of lumium gear.
- Trabe Chalice? Maybe, if MAF + COL isn't cutting it, but traders are armor secondary. I think it's fair that they get this one 20% more often than others.
- Turmar? You have CV and a better stat booster.
- Avren? The thievery buff is not even useful for B&E, and a lot of traders prefer shadow as an always-up stealth booster. Evasion secondary, weapons/tm tert means you don't really care about debuffing your target's stealth outside of PvP, and a moonie probably has better options with an AOE cast TKS.
Traders would love to have so many spells as a moon mage, which don't require moons/secondary resources, or give buffs to areas they suffer in (ie: attunment).
AERATHOR
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/05/2020 10:22 AM CDT
>>Traders would love to have so many spells as a moon mage, which don't require moons/secondary resources, or give buffs to areas they suffer in (ie: attunment).
Thanks for a great response first off. Many great points. I haven't got around to testing starcrash yet I totally assumed it was cyclic some reason, my Trader is just circle 50 so far but already I find him incredibly efficient in combat despite what people usually say about traders.
As far as the resource limitations, I've noticed on my trader most of their spells do not require a moon up. And even by circle 50 hes already able to cast with his aura without worrying. I did focus my wisdom ahead a bit on him and I use Noumena but I can spam ARS without worry even in adverse conditions and maintain buffs on evasion, shield and tactics.
On my moon mage I actually have a full tome of just trader spells and I really enjoy Finesse, Last gift(even at 50% power its nice), Blur(Tactics and Evasion + coolest hazy after images), Trabe Chalice and Nonchalance to cover gaps we have in our own book. If you are overlooking those spells when they can be used so easily with Unleash then I'd say try them more. You can Use IOTS for Reflex, and still cover your mentals if you use Turmars, Divine guidance and Tranquility(I use the limb wand for this). I tend to like to stack wards and barriers too, so having nonchalance is nice added bonus for stat contests.
I tend to look at the glass half full on most of their spells, and really enjoy the thematic feel and look of them. I haven't even begun testing Luck yet but I imagine its just another system I will love as well.
>>It's really not. Here's Raesh's list:
I remember seeing a message of the spell being cast on Test, anyone have that link? I thought it was essentially avtalia crystals but I could be wrong. I know its not functionally the same but I felt it was thematically similar.
>>The old Crystal spike was way, way, way more effective.
Oh heck ya. I always said it was far better than PD. Especially if you consider the fact it would Auto Complete its prep if you just attempted to target it, and you could easily have 4-5 spikes in a room at once firing on same target. Aside from Steelstar it was the coolest spell we ever had.
>>Thematically, I don't know that crystal spike still fits the moon mage toolkit considering trader's niche
Perhaps but it doesn't stop Traders from utilizing spells that require moons up and visa versa. When you consider they are a Tertiary magic guild and have a leg up by being able to cast with moons just as well with spells like mask of the moons, and also being able to cast with starlight from their own auras, it to me feels like moon mages should be able to get back what was taken from them. And I mean, heck, it was already said twice we would get it. So there is nothing wrong with us expecting it back at this point.
"An' I'm learnin' 'ere in London what the ten-year soldier tells; If you've 'eard the East a-callin', you won't never 'eed naught else. No! you won't 'eed nothin' else"
Thanks for a great response first off. Many great points. I haven't got around to testing starcrash yet I totally assumed it was cyclic some reason, my Trader is just circle 50 so far but already I find him incredibly efficient in combat despite what people usually say about traders.
As far as the resource limitations, I've noticed on my trader most of their spells do not require a moon up. And even by circle 50 hes already able to cast with his aura without worrying. I did focus my wisdom ahead a bit on him and I use Noumena but I can spam ARS without worry even in adverse conditions and maintain buffs on evasion, shield and tactics.
On my moon mage I actually have a full tome of just trader spells and I really enjoy Finesse, Last gift(even at 50% power its nice), Blur(Tactics and Evasion + coolest hazy after images), Trabe Chalice and Nonchalance to cover gaps we have in our own book. If you are overlooking those spells when they can be used so easily with Unleash then I'd say try them more. You can Use IOTS for Reflex, and still cover your mentals if you use Turmars, Divine guidance and Tranquility(I use the limb wand for this). I tend to like to stack wards and barriers too, so having nonchalance is nice added bonus for stat contests.
I tend to look at the glass half full on most of their spells, and really enjoy the thematic feel and look of them. I haven't even begun testing Luck yet but I imagine its just another system I will love as well.
>>It's really not. Here's Raesh's list:
I remember seeing a message of the spell being cast on Test, anyone have that link? I thought it was essentially avtalia crystals but I could be wrong. I know its not functionally the same but I felt it was thematically similar.
>>The old Crystal spike was way, way, way more effective.
Oh heck ya. I always said it was far better than PD. Especially if you consider the fact it would Auto Complete its prep if you just attempted to target it, and you could easily have 4-5 spikes in a room at once firing on same target. Aside from Steelstar it was the coolest spell we ever had.
>>Thematically, I don't know that crystal spike still fits the moon mage toolkit considering trader's niche
Perhaps but it doesn't stop Traders from utilizing spells that require moons up and visa versa. When you consider they are a Tertiary magic guild and have a leg up by being able to cast with moons just as well with spells like mask of the moons, and also being able to cast with starlight from their own auras, it to me feels like moon mages should be able to get back what was taken from them. And I mean, heck, it was already said twice we would get it. So there is nothing wrong with us expecting it back at this point.
"An' I'm learnin' 'ere in London what the ten-year soldier tells; If you've 'eard the East a-callin', you won't never 'eed naught else. No! you won't 'eed nothin' else"
FLINT-TIPPED
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/05/2020 03:25 PM CDT
> I remember seeing a message of the spell being cast on Test, anyone have that link?
https://elanthipedia.play.net/Talk:Crystal_Spike
If anyone on staff has time to finish up that spell the Moon Mage guild would lionize you.
https://elanthipedia.play.net/Main_Page
https://elanthipedia.play.net/Talk:Crystal_Spike
If anyone on staff has time to finish up that spell the Moon Mage guild would lionize you.
https://elanthipedia.play.net/Main_Page
SHIFT3
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/05/2020 06:00 PM CDT
> my Trader is just circle 50 so far but already I find him incredibly efficient in combat despite what people usually say about traders.
They're good enough. I also prefer starlight to the moon requirement. It's still no warrior mage or cleric or barbarian in terms of flexibility, but they can hold their own one-on-one with above average survivability.
> And even by circle 50 hes already able to cast with his aura without worrying.
My trader is in the 700s now with magics, and I still struggle with starlight if I'm hunting in-doors. Outdoors is fine. It averages over time and you'll see dips and rises. especially with STC, so long as I don't use enrichment and very sparingly dump aura into the tessera for a few mindstates of trading.
> I can spam ARS without worry even in adverse conditions
I don't know about that. If you're hunting indoors, you will run out of starlight. ARS isn't the biggest offender. Starcrash during the day takes me down most of a full state (I currently have access to 8). Enrichment will be 1-2 every 10 minutes, moons or not. Blur and TRC another 1-2 at full cast if indoors or in bad conditions. More mana = more starlight. I still think starlight is superior to the moon mage systems, but it's nothing compared to the warrior mage, cleric, paladin, or even ranger systems.
> Blur(Tactics and Evasion + coolest hazy after images)
Do you use tactics in PvP? I don't know that I've ever been in a position of needing a buff for PvE even on my lore terts. Same with a charm defense.
> and really enjoy the thematic feel and look of them
They definitely nailed the theme.
> I haven't even begun testing Luck yet but I imagine its just another system I will love as well
Eh. Luck just boosts hiding, makes spells a little easier to cast, and gives you a chance at increasing mining/lumberjacking outputs. I don't think it's tied into sigil harvesting. There were a lot of plans to expand it, but I don't know that those plans ever saw the light of day.
> When you consider they are a Tertiary magic guild and have a leg up by being able to cast with moons just as well with spells like mask of the moons, and also being able to cast with starlight from their own auras, it to me feels like moon mages should be able to get back what was taken from them.
I still agree. Moon mages should have an option, with enough skill, to cast all combat / moon related spells without a moon being physically in the sky. Maybe it's a ritual spell. Maybe it's a sorcery spell, but the guild should have the option.
ELWYNN
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/05/2020 07:43 PM CDT
Crystal Spike/Sorrow fits thematically with traders, but it also fits thematically with Nomads of the Arid Steppe.
LENAEA
Re: Rewritten Crystal Spike/Sorrow - still planned?
04/14/2020 05:49 PM CDT
>Crystal Spike/Sorrow fits thematically with traders, but it also fits thematically with Nomads of the Arid Steppe.
To expand on this, the Trabe (a nomad tribe) "tamed the crystal" and created the crystal spire on the Arid Steppe where Cherulisa presides as guildmaster. Indeed, the Trader spell "Trabe's Chalice" draws its name from that very same tribe. So, absolutely, crystal spike fits thematically with traders, but it fit thematically with Moon Mages first.
