For my own amusement, and in the spirit of Reene's gweth blotter, I present, the crappy payment blotter.

Avandar.

Szrael was clean before this guy, so all of these are just from him.

The wounds:

Your body feels at full strength.
Your spirit feels full of life.
You are strangely full of extra energy.
You have some tiny scratches to the head, a few nearly invisible scars along the head, minor swelling and bruising around the neck, an occasional twitching in the neck, a severely swollen and deeply bruised right arm compounded by cuts and bruises about the right arm, a constant twitching in the right arm, a severely swollen and deeply bruised left arm compounded by deep slashes across the left arm, a severely swollen and deeply bruised right leg with odd protrusions under the skin compounded by deep slashes across the right leg, a severely swollen and deeply bruised left leg compounded by deep cuts across the left leg, minor swelling and bruising around the right hand, an occasional twitching in the right hand, some tiny scratches to the left hand, an occasional twitching in the left hand, minor swelling and bruising in the chest area compounded by cuts and bruises about the chest area, a constant twitching in the chest area, deep slashes across the abdomen, cuts and bruises about the back, some minor abrasions to the right eye, a few nearly invisible scars along the right eye, some minor abrasions to the left eye, a few nearly invisible scars along the left eye.

Bleeding
Area Rate

---

left arm light
right leg light
left leg slight
abdomen moderate
inside r. arm slight
inside l. arm light
inside r. leg moderate
inside l. leg slight

The payment: a small red-green bloodstone

You say, "This is insultingly small payment, considering how wrecked you were. I will not heal you again."

Avandar shrugs.


And we're off!

>>First of all, if you consider it "payment" then you should post a fee schedule before you heal anyone. You're an empath. If you require proper "payment" then I suggest you get it up front, which I think would be lame in the extreme.

Szrael has a "one strike and you're out" policy. If you pay poorly then she simply doesn't heal you again, but she does you the service of letting you know that your payment was abysmal. This way everyone benefits. If Avandar needs healing from Szrael again she will ask for payment up front. She has done this with great success in the past with other lousy clients, and they've all either improved their payment or avoided Szrael.

Szrael will happilly watch people on her "bad client" list bleed to death at her feet, if they're unable to come up with decent payment. She has to pay for the hisan somehow you know.

I look forward to updating this blotter in the future.

Three comments:

I always try to give a minimum of a plat to empaths for heals (I only find an empath if I really need it).
My cleric doesn't accept tips.
My empath regularly asks for a plat befor he touches someone usually (exceptions are dead/dying people).

My own choices.

>You gain experience from healing in the form of empathy, perception, first aid if you choose to tend those bleeders, and depending on how you heal yourself up, you will gain exp in PM, harness, MD, Power Perception. You don't need to heal anyone to train any of those skills, so I don't really understand your complaint.

Absolutely agreed. Compendiums, magical devices, health walking. Easy to work these without healing people, I don't have to heal anyone who doesn't want to pay.

>>Get off your high horse. No one said you had to play the same way Szrael's player does, but you sure as hell don't have to undercut the rest of us either. Thnx. :-)<<

Undercut? Laughable. I'll be sure to refuse any and all tips from now on and to set up shop wherever Szrael and/or Severa are located. Now THAT would be great fun! I've never lacked for coin because I can't stop people from giving me the coin or slipping it to me, and frankly I don't really care if a thief steals it all from me. I didn't ask for payment and I don't expect it. It's healing. It's what I do. I don't need to be paid for it.

Those are my choices for rp. Severa and Szrael may not like it, but there isn't much you can do about how I choose to play. I haven't completed the shifting quest yet, though I'm long past due for it, but I'm sure I won't be charging for shifts either. Mainly because I've seen some of the prices that other empaths charge and I think they're outrageous.

You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar, which means people will remember who treated them well and fairly, and those who were overbearing and demanding.


Life is too short to drink cheap beer.

>>I'll be sure to refuse any and all tips from now on and to set up shop wherever Szrael and/or Severa are located.

This statement doesn't make sense if you actually know the characters Szrael and Severa.

Szrael views her supernatural ability to heal people as something not to be used lightly, and thus only heals corpses or those who are mortally wounded. She makes exceptions for her friends, with a bit of muttering and tail-lashing. If you're not dying, use herbs.

Severa would rather dissect people alive than heal them. Pesky shock.

Szrael only heals people if they more or less beg her to, so if you beg her to stop what she's doing, come to where you are, heal you, then spend half an hour healing herself afterwards you better believe she expects to be paid handsomely for that, especially if you look like you just came from an exciting trip to the greater fist mine carts.

Please come to where Severa and Szrael have "set up shop" so that we can do our thing without being harassed by people who are too lazy to use herbs.

<<Severa would rather dissect people alive than heal them. Pesky shock.

hahaha so true!


Drevid

---

http://www.phiiskeep.homestead.com/Barbarian.html

Cylons... why debugging matters.

I imagine even poor noobs can have pretty bad wounds, right? I'd judge the tip by the giver as much or more than by the wounds. Penny from the pauper vs dime from the merchant, right? I have to give my pre-necro gold from my main character so that he can tip well.

-Gheist

I've been way too lazy + busy IRL to do the blotter lately. Maybe I'll get someone else to post updates for me.

This is great though and has potential.

P.S.

>> Severa and Szrael may not like it, but there isn't much you can do about how I choose to play.

Pretty sure there is something they and their loyal friends can do about it, at least until the first SEND from on high comes.

---

Rev. Reene

"Even if you are a 1,000 year old Necrolord who is so steeped in blasphemy that your words cause the ground to shake and the sky to darken, you do not tick off Kssarh." - Armifer

>>And that somehow it's unseemly to want proper compensation for helping hunters drastically decrease their turnaround time between combat sessions and thus increase their kronar/hour return rate. That is a service with a measurable monetary impact on the hunter's income and it should be properly compensated.<<

The healing system is set up wrong for this incentive to opeerate. Unless people are hunting in some utopian area that I don't know about, no one is going to recoupe what empaths seem to think is a good tip in the time you've saved them over using the autopath.

Tipping well really is an act of charity unless the healing is happening in some crazy out-of-the-way place without any other options. Sometimes empaths seem to forget that.



- Mazrian

Well it appears that there are people trying to educate the masses on what is an acceptable tip, both in game and on the forums. Oh happy day. I still hold to the belief that the tip is voluntary on the part of the tipper, leaving the empath the option to either accept the tip or decline it. To heal... or not to heal... that is the question.


Life is too short to drink cheap beer.

"Tipping well really is an act of charity"

Actually, the healing is really the act of charity.

Not an empath, but a cleric, and last night I chose to respond to a request to assist a corpse. I was fully spelled up and ready to go to hunt Dobeks. In the time I spent resurrecting the deader I could have earned probably a plat. The corpse 'tipped' me about a gold- and that is fine. But I almost always lose out on both coin and experience if I travel to a corpse. That is my charitable act.

Empaths don't need to heal anyone, no one 'needs' to pay a PC empath. Paying empaths well is a good way to encourage them to offer their services to you and others in the future.

But again, I really want to encourage more postings of super cheap ingrates. Come on, I want to see folks who are coming out of Gryphons and tipping with a small diopside- I know they are out there!


"militantly enforcing the overly rigid standards of you and your small collection of friends"

>Actually, the healing is really the act of charity.

Well, yes except:

- it is the main focus of the empath guild
- the wound system was designed around the assumption that empaths would heal
- the broken/crappy autopaths aren't fixed because of PC empaths
- herbs aren't really developed because of PC empaths as well.
- it does teach the empath a key skill (although the exp really needs to be upped)

I think there's frustration on both sides, because empaths don't have other systems that are well developed (undead healing??), and PCs don't have other good options for healing certain wounds.

Coming out of gryphons and tipping a couple of diopsides is the equivalent of eating out at a reasonably nice restaurant and leaving a couple of quarters as a tip.

At that point it isn't a tip, it's an insult. I honestly would prefer that people just say thank you and not tip instead of trying to foist off a handful of junk gems off on me, because the latter just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Fortunately I only really heal people I know anymore with Miki so I don't even have to deal with it.

---

Rev. Reene

"Even if you are a 1,000 year old Necrolord who is so steeped in blasphemy that your words cause the ground to shake and the sky to darken, you do not tick off Kssarh." - Armifer

"Well, yes except:

- it is the main focus of the empath guild
- the wound system was designed around the assumption that empaths would heal
- the broken/crappy autopaths aren't fixed because of PC empaths
- herbs aren't really developed because of PC empaths as well.
- it does teach the empath a key skill (although the exp really needs to be upped)"

I am not sure how this changes the act from anything but charity. Without looking up the technical definition of charity, mine is "assisting others who are in need, at the sacrifice of my own time and fortune". The fact that the guild may have been developed around healing others doesn't make it less of a charitable act, unless the empath requires payment up front.

"I think there's frustration on both sides, because empaths don't have other systems that are well developed (undead healing??), and PCs don't have other good options for healing certain wounds."

Certainly- hey I can relate to being in remote places with no empaths around. Even so, I think there can be huge amusement in showcasing those who don't know how to show appreciation to an empath who charitably decided to help them. Hey occasionally I screw up- go ahead and post a log of Flavius not paying if I forget!



"militantly enforcing the overly rigid standards of you and your small collection of friends"

People need to stop derailing the blotter and start humiliating cheapskates. Moar logs, go!


-Sephos

I have to agree that if I've just become a limbless empath due to someone's lack of prowess in snow goblins or some such, then yes, I do expect an offer of more than a small diopside as a tip. I am now unable to do much of anything until I heal myself. I can't even hold a compendium to study quietly at this stage.

However, I sometimes graciously refuse tips, especially if I've only healed a little bit, if you're a good friend, or if I'm just not in the mood. It is one of my pet peeves when someone just drops coins on me and runs. Or worse, drops a pouch or gems in front of me to scrounge for like an animal. The offer is greatly appreciated and lets me know that the person I healed was appreciative. But, if someone doesn't want to take a tip, they likely have a reason.

So point is...tip like you actually appreciate the help of a live person who is generally faster, more responsive, and more likely to keep you alive than an autopath. But don't insult them by forcing tips on them if they've declined.

I would be very interested to see what people (who don't have empath characters) think about tipping. Like how much they would find appropriate and how much they typically tip. I have a ranger that I had before my empath. I always tipped a plat and I still do when I need healing. I would never have considered tipping a gem. Never crossed my mind. We're all talking here from the empath view but I'm curious what the "average" person thinks is acceptable and not acceptable to do when healed.

I see what you mean about a tipper not wanting to feel indebted. But still I don't take tips. I will however take herbs when offered. Several people I know get me cebi root, yelith root and hisan salve cause they know I won't take anything else. Best gift ever! I'm still rather young and my perception isn't so good yet, so for the most part I can't stop someone (who I can't even see) from slipping me money. But I don't want them to and if given the opportunity I'll return it before that person leaves. But, I can also understand how they don't want to feel indebted to me so I don't get mad.






"Suffering knows no boundaries...neither should compassion."

I understand about not wanting to feel indebted, but if you offer, and the offer is refused...I don't see where the feeling of being in debt to a person comes in. You tried, they said no, you're free and clear. Now if they whip out a contract and ask you to sign...

Seriously, if I heal to be nice, then I don't see why I should be forced to accept something I didn't ask for and clearly indicated (by rejecting or giving back the tip) I didn't want. It goes against the intended spirit (appreciation generally) of the tipping to begin with. I still genuinely appreciate the offer, however.

Frankly, healing people really doesn't give as much experience as an non-empath would like to think. So the argument of 'it's giving them experience' doesn't really hold too much, in my eyes. That said, as far as how much is appropriate, I agree it should be at least as much as you would pay an autopath. If you can afford more, then your tips should be more, of course.

It should also at least scale based on the severity of your wounds and the inconvenience factor (they came to you for example). I wouldn't expect taking a little nerve damage from someone who found me sitting at a known healing area to equate to what should be offered if I drop everything to run out to a dangerous hunting area and save someone from near death.

>>Putting something on the boards after one time being stiffed by someone is really poor taste. I'm going to assume you just told him he's a crappy payer then posted here to that effect.

Being a crappy payer is in really poor taste. It's not my Empath's job to find out this fellow's life story and delve into the myriad reasons he could only come up with a small gem. Perhaps he's a mute orphan! Do I care? No.

I just think it's funny; if people are willing to tip crappily, then they should have no problems with their crappy tips being showcased for all the world to see, just as the people who gweth questionable things shouldn't mind having that on the boards, either.

In neither case is it my responsibility to hold their wee hands and explain to them why their behavior is questionable -- all I want is a laugh or two at their expense.

>>Actually, the healing is really the act of charity.

>Well, yes except:

>- it is the main focus of the empath guild
>- the wound system was designed around the assumption that empaths would heal
>- the broken/crappy autopaths aren't fixed because of PC empaths
>- herbs aren't really developed because of PC empaths as well.
>- it does teach the empath a key skill (although the exp really needs to be upped)

I cannot see any connection between the first quoted statement and your supposed rebuttal evidence. Even if one accepts that every contention you listed above is correct (which I do not--many of those statements are shaky at best), it is a completely unsupported leap to then say that Empaths should be expected to render their services for free or "charity" as people are putting it.

Just because a guild ability has been (or may have been) designed and integrated as a key part of a larger system has absolutely no bearing or implication as to what the proper compensation or value for the performance of that ability is. Game balance and guild interdependency doesn't mean free.

I'm also really surprised to see you echoing the "exp means it's not worth a tip" chestnut. I'm really trying to understand this on a rational level... why do people think that Empath healing shouldn't be compensated on the grounds that we learn exp from it? Let me put that argument another way: Why should hunters get boxes and coin for hunting? They learn EXP in the fields, right?

~ Player of Farman et al.

http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/Main_Page