Got a circle 5 empath and i'm wondering at what point i'll just be able to heal everything at once w/o having my concentration dropping to 0 and stopping the healing.
Also i'm interested to know when i'll be able to take wounds 'quick' or 'fast' or whatever the verbage is.
Plus.. healing spells, are the spells outside of iwh/ewh/esh/ish that heal stuff worth getting? I noticed there was one that appeared to heal like all internal and external wounds at once.
CHRISTIANSONK3
MATTSMOMMA
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 11:54 AM CST
>>I noticed there was one that appeared to heal like all internal and external wounds at once.
I didn't start using HS and HW until around 40ish, not because I didn't have them but just because it takes an insane amount of mana to use them efficiently. Refresh, Blood staunch and Vitality healing are an empaths friend and will save your life, closely followed by Cure Disease and flush poison if you want to be able to transfer it. IIRC you can't transfer poison until around 80 empathy and disease around 100.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
I didn't start using HS and HW until around 40ish, not because I didn't have them but just because it takes an insane amount of mana to use them efficiently. Refresh, Blood staunch and Vitality healing are an empaths friend and will save your life, closely followed by Cure Disease and flush poison if you want to be able to transfer it. IIRC you can't transfer poison until around 80 empathy and disease around 100.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
MCNITTD1
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 02:30 PM CST
I still don't use HW. Seems like you got a better return on your mana when using ewh and iwh in most cases. I would like to see the mana-intensiveness of HW brought down just a smidge personally.
HS seems to save a lot of mana over esh and ish though. Sometimes I think the difficulty of ish is broken; it's still tough for me to cast.
I would get HS, then regen, then HW when your magics are in the 150-200 range.
~Purehand
HS seems to save a lot of mana over esh and ish though. Sometimes I think the difficulty of ish is broken; it's still tough for me to cast.
I would get HS, then regen, then HW when your magics are in the 150-200 range.
~Purehand
RIVERSTAR
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 02:54 PM CST
I thought regen really didn't work well until around 250-300 in magics due to the fact it fries your nerves.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
SYLVERWIND
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 02:56 PM CST
It's worked very well for me before that.
As long as you're not stupid about harnessing mana it won't really fry your nerves that fast. When you get to severe twitching or so (takes me about 10-20 minutes minimum) just throw all you have harnessed into an IWH.
Rev. Reene
"It is in vain to say human beings ought to be satisfied with tranquility: they must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it." - Jane Eyre
Make some action!
http://reene.euphoricsoup.com/text/roleplaying.html
As long as you're not stupid about harnessing mana it won't really fry your nerves that fast. When you get to severe twitching or so (takes me about 10-20 minutes minimum) just throw all you have harnessed into an IWH.
Rev. Reene
"It is in vain to say human beings ought to be satisfied with tranquility: they must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it." - Jane Eyre
Make some action!
http://reene.euphoricsoup.com/text/roleplaying.html
CHRISTIANSONK3
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 03:01 PM CST
So HS is bad, other spells are good, what about healing quickly, and the factors that will allow me to be able to heal someone fully w/o stopping because i'm too hurt or some such?
ZONKAR
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 03:19 PM CST
According to the website spell list, you need HW and HS before you can get regen.
ZONKAR
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 03:20 PM CST
I believe that empathy is what dictates the severity of the wounds you can take. As for concentration dropping to 0, don't take so many wounds at once and it won't happen.
MCNITTD1
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 03:30 PM CST
HS is good. HW is not as good. Regen is good with higher PM.
As far as maintaining a link goes, raise discipline for the next circle or two. Those first ranks are the hardest.
~Purehand
As far as maintaining a link goes, raise discipline for the next circle or two. Those first ranks are the hardest.
~Purehand
MATTSMOMMA
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 03:30 PM CST
>>As for concentration dropping to 0, don't take so many wounds at once and it won't happen.
Way to state the obvious, that was his question. I didn't start using QUICK until I needed to also around 40th circle. Up until that point I learned healing with no problem, however you'll notice as you get to that point that your learning from healing slows down, quick helps make up for this somewhat. It's also a surefire way to ensure you'll die at a young circle. I'd say at about 20th you'll start to be able to control links, up to that point if you try to do half or part you'll see the links go crazy and start transferring like mad. Heal to about 10th, then at that point mix in some perceiving health to 20. At 20 start manipulating for exp. Around 30 - 40 start mixing in heal quick. Word of advice, don't put off your combats if you want to be a battle empath/manipulator or your manipulate ability (which is based on empathy and concentration I believe) will be way more advanced than your combats and you won't notice quite as much learning from it as you would if they were near the same level. Not sure if all of that makes sense, I'm insanely tired.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
Way to state the obvious, that was his question. I didn't start using QUICK until I needed to also around 40th circle. Up until that point I learned healing with no problem, however you'll notice as you get to that point that your learning from healing slows down, quick helps make up for this somewhat. It's also a surefire way to ensure you'll die at a young circle. I'd say at about 20th you'll start to be able to control links, up to that point if you try to do half or part you'll see the links go crazy and start transferring like mad. Heal to about 10th, then at that point mix in some perceiving health to 20. At 20 start manipulating for exp. Around 30 - 40 start mixing in heal quick. Word of advice, don't put off your combats if you want to be a battle empath/manipulator or your manipulate ability (which is based on empathy and concentration I believe) will be way more advanced than your combats and you won't notice quite as much learning from it as you would if they were near the same level. Not sure if all of that makes sense, I'm insanely tired.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
LOFTONM1
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 04:06 PM CST
Holy cow! Talk about some bad advice! :)
You can use QUICK non-stop at 25-30th, without any real concern about dying (in other words, you have to be amazingly stupid or careless or uninformed about transfer and wounds in general). You get all the perks of fast healing yet still have the toe-the-line slowness protection like novices and lowbies get. Unless you are lazy or know you would die without preventative measures (ie, getting spells off), there's actually no reason to use normal or slow at all at this point. I dunno how much before 25th it stays like this, as that was about when I was when QUICK was released.
As for manipulation, combats simply make it easier to do as a form of stand-at-melee slugfest. Except for a few instances, you don't even actually NEED to train your combats. Symphaena can't even handle armed goblins quite yet, but she's able to manipulate super rock trolls and harder critters without getting hit once. Timing is the key in these situations, as taking a single hit's gonna get you killed.
Oh, and it's 45 ranks for transferring poison and 75 ranks for transferring disease.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
You can use QUICK non-stop at 25-30th, without any real concern about dying (in other words, you have to be amazingly stupid or careless or uninformed about transfer and wounds in general). You get all the perks of fast healing yet still have the toe-the-line slowness protection like novices and lowbies get. Unless you are lazy or know you would die without preventative measures (ie, getting spells off), there's actually no reason to use normal or slow at all at this point. I dunno how much before 25th it stays like this, as that was about when I was when QUICK was released.
As for manipulation, combats simply make it easier to do as a form of stand-at-melee slugfest. Except for a few instances, you don't even actually NEED to train your combats. Symphaena can't even handle armed goblins quite yet, but she's able to manipulate super rock trolls and harder critters without getting hit once. Timing is the key in these situations, as taking a single hit's gonna get you killed.
Oh, and it's 45 ranks for transferring poison and 75 ranks for transferring disease.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
SYLVERWIND
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 04:18 PM CST
Holy cow talk about snarky posters.
There is no right or wrong way to do it. Everyone has their own healing style and unless you find yourself overhealing constantly there's no issue with how you happen to be healing.
And considering how many Empaths still use the crutch despite how atrocious it is and despite its lack of a 'quick' option, I'd say that yes there is a reason lots of people still use normal.
Heck I use normal sometimes just because I want to manage my wound transfers better.
Using 'quick' non-stop at 25th-30th unless you have higher discipline than most Empaths will at that level will do things to your concentration that may make it a bad choice for some healers.
The best advice in this case would be to try it out and if it works great. If it doesn't just put it off 'til later. There's no reason to ride anyone's ass about it.
Rev. Reene
"It is in vain to say human beings ought to be satisfied with tranquility: they must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it." - Jane Eyre
Make some action!
http://reene.euphoricsoup.com/text/roleplaying.html
There is no right or wrong way to do it. Everyone has their own healing style and unless you find yourself overhealing constantly there's no issue with how you happen to be healing.
And considering how many Empaths still use the crutch despite how atrocious it is and despite its lack of a 'quick' option, I'd say that yes there is a reason lots of people still use normal.
Heck I use normal sometimes just because I want to manage my wound transfers better.
Using 'quick' non-stop at 25th-30th unless you have higher discipline than most Empaths will at that level will do things to your concentration that may make it a bad choice for some healers.
The best advice in this case would be to try it out and if it works great. If it doesn't just put it off 'til later. There's no reason to ride anyone's ass about it.
Rev. Reene
"It is in vain to say human beings ought to be satisfied with tranquility: they must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it." - Jane Eyre
Make some action!
http://reene.euphoricsoup.com/text/roleplaying.html
MATTSMOMMA
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 04:22 PM CST
Shhhh J'Lo has inside sources. Oh wait... No he doesn't.
>>You can use QUICK non-stop at 25-30th, without any real concern about dying
I swore I said at LOW levels and that I PERSONALLY didn't need it until after that to learn. Good job reading champ.
>>As for manipulation, combats simply make it easier to do as a form of stand-at-melee slugfest. Except for a few instances, you don't even actually NEED to train your combats. Symphaena can't even handle armed goblins quite yet, but she's able to manipulate super rock trolls and harder critters without getting hit once. Timing is the key in these situations, as taking a single hit's gonna get you killed.
Arwin can manipulate quite a bit, the more difficult the critter teaching more. Just because you CAN doesn't mean you can stand there and learn continuously. I rather stand with vipers and learn more than just running in manipulating and running back out for fear of death or better yet manipulating the entire room and hogging every critter in the hunting area. And she DEFINITELY learns more from manipulating the vipers that don't kill her while she stands there than she does on goblins or rats. Thanks for playing.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
>>You can use QUICK non-stop at 25-30th, without any real concern about dying
I swore I said at LOW levels and that I PERSONALLY didn't need it until after that to learn. Good job reading champ.
>>As for manipulation, combats simply make it easier to do as a form of stand-at-melee slugfest. Except for a few instances, you don't even actually NEED to train your combats. Symphaena can't even handle armed goblins quite yet, but she's able to manipulate super rock trolls and harder critters without getting hit once. Timing is the key in these situations, as taking a single hit's gonna get you killed.
Arwin can manipulate quite a bit, the more difficult the critter teaching more. Just because you CAN doesn't mean you can stand there and learn continuously. I rather stand with vipers and learn more than just running in manipulating and running back out for fear of death or better yet manipulating the entire room and hogging every critter in the hunting area. And she DEFINITELY learns more from manipulating the vipers that don't kill her while she stands there than she does on goblins or rats. Thanks for playing.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
RIVERSTAR
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 05:15 PM CST
>>I rather stand with vipers and learn more than just running in manipulating and running back out for fear of death or better yet manipulating the entire room and hogging every critter in the hunting area.
Solution to not hogging all the critters is to manipulate one or two, keep one or two on you and just innocence away any other critters that happen to wander in unless one of your non-tame critters dies. Also, for the newer empath, brawling is your friend while manipulating if you do it as a way to gain boxes. Grappling and spinning around with the critters is a great way to help your tame critters kill them, or even better if you can manage it simply knock them over, grapple them and kneel on their backs so your tame critters will beat them senseless much easier. Happy fake hunting. ;-P BTW, if you do plan on becoming a battlepath innocence is your friend. I highly recommend getting it.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
Solution to not hogging all the critters is to manipulate one or two, keep one or two on you and just innocence away any other critters that happen to wander in unless one of your non-tame critters dies. Also, for the newer empath, brawling is your friend while manipulating if you do it as a way to gain boxes. Grappling and spinning around with the critters is a great way to help your tame critters kill them, or even better if you can manage it simply knock them over, grapple them and kneel on their backs so your tame critters will beat them senseless much easier. Happy fake hunting. ;-P BTW, if you do plan on becoming a battlepath innocence is your friend. I highly recommend getting it.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
LOFTONM1
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 06:15 PM CST
>>Using 'quick' non-stop at 25th-30th unless you have higher discipline than most Empaths will at that level will do things to your concentration that may make it a bad choice for some healers.
The only thing I've noticed is the higher fatigue cost, and that's easily negated with a refresh beforehand. The fatigue doesn't even become a factor until you start taking wounds/scars in a Crutch-like way, so if you are doing things by hand you will never have to worry about fatigue. And what would be considered normal discipline for circles 25-30? Symphaena's circle 31 with a discipline of 20, and I haven't raised it for at least 2 if not 6 circles. I can't imagine that'd be considered above-normal.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
The only thing I've noticed is the higher fatigue cost, and that's easily negated with a refresh beforehand. The fatigue doesn't even become a factor until you start taking wounds/scars in a Crutch-like way, so if you are doing things by hand you will never have to worry about fatigue. And what would be considered normal discipline for circles 25-30? Symphaena's circle 31 with a discipline of 20, and I haven't raised it for at least 2 if not 6 circles. I can't imagine that'd be considered above-normal.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
DISPHORIA
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 07:27 PM CST
1) I give credit to the empaths that still type out <take patient wound int quick>
2) HEAL QUICK can still tank my fatigue quite well with 30 stamina, 38 discipline, and a regenerate. If I do it well enough to lock my empathy, I will most likely be exhausted/bone-tired/beyond reason...whatever, for possibly around 1-2 minutes. So if the empath is not skilled enough, not used to being an empath enough, or whatever...they can end up killing themselves quite easily with HEAL QUICK.
3) Forget brawling in order to kill of critters. Lethargy them and they are good as dead. Quite nice.
4) And vipers spit in Ini's eyes. I seen it. [Trying to find my nickname for her]
Renegade Empath Raudhan just arrived.
A cutthroat gasps, "I can't get UP!"
You begin to lecture Reexa on the proper use of the brawling skill.
You cackle!
You strike a heroic pose.
2) HEAL QUICK can still tank my fatigue quite well with 30 stamina, 38 discipline, and a regenerate. If I do it well enough to lock my empathy, I will most likely be exhausted/bone-tired/beyond reason...whatever, for possibly around 1-2 minutes. So if the empath is not skilled enough, not used to being an empath enough, or whatever...they can end up killing themselves quite easily with HEAL QUICK.
3) Forget brawling in order to kill of critters. Lethargy them and they are good as dead. Quite nice.
4) And vipers spit in Ini's eyes. I seen it. [Trying to find my nickname for her]
Renegade Empath Raudhan just arrived.
A cutthroat gasps, "I can't get UP!"
You begin to lecture Reexa on the proper use of the brawling skill.
You cackle!
You strike a heroic pose.
RIVERSTAR
Re: New empath
11/14/2006 08:25 PM CST
Last time I played an empath lethargy was still horribly broken so I haven't gotten a chance to see it in all it's sleepy glory.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
ZARICHC
Re: New empath
11/15/2006 07:37 AM CST
Okay everyone else seems to have gone off on a spell and/or combat tangent here.
As for being a young empath, its gonna be quite difficult to heal without stopping for a little bit still. I would say that even by 10th circle, most empaths have decent enough magic and empathy that the time it takes them to heal someone from head to toe is cut in half from that of 5th circle. So just hang in there and keep working your PP so you may perceive health sooner to learn.
Like the others have said, stay away from the other higher-tiered healing spells until at least 20th. (Maybe more).
After you have the 4 healing spells, it is up to you to mold yourself into the type of empath you would like to be. You can start gathering up some combat spells (SOP is good for magic, AD you may want, innocence) and lean that way, or you can get a few more life-saving spells (CD in order to train first aid seeing as you cant take disease till ABOUT 20th and even then its slow, vitality healing, blood staunching, flush poisons (even though you cant take disease till ABOUT 11th circle)
As for being a young empath, its gonna be quite difficult to heal without stopping for a little bit still. I would say that even by 10th circle, most empaths have decent enough magic and empathy that the time it takes them to heal someone from head to toe is cut in half from that of 5th circle. So just hang in there and keep working your PP so you may perceive health sooner to learn.
Like the others have said, stay away from the other higher-tiered healing spells until at least 20th. (Maybe more).
After you have the 4 healing spells, it is up to you to mold yourself into the type of empath you would like to be. You can start gathering up some combat spells (SOP is good for magic, AD you may want, innocence) and lean that way, or you can get a few more life-saving spells (CD in order to train first aid seeing as you cant take disease till ABOUT 20th and even then its slow, vitality healing, blood staunching, flush poisons (even though you cant take disease till ABOUT 11th circle)
RIVERSTAR
Re: New empath
11/15/2006 09:10 AM CST
To add one more spell to ZARICHC's list refresh is nice and can be a life saver since it tends to stop you from tanking your fatigue which can prevent you from getting spells off. Also if you keep collapsing while healing this spell helps there a bit as well.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
River
Hello, my name is xxxx and I'm here for the meeting of Scripters Anonymous.
CHRISTIANSONK3
Re: New empath
11/15/2006 03:08 PM CST
Does anyone actually know when i'll be able to type in take <person> <wound> quickly and not get this as an output?
You are not skilled enough to transfer at an accelerated rate.
I guess that is my real question.
>>As for concentration dropping to 0, don't take so many wounds at once and it won't happen.
I'm not really sure if you were actually trying to be helpful or not, but let me give you two responses that will cover either.
You were trying to be a smart ass(response): THANKS!!!!
You were trying to actualy be helpful(response): Yea I knew that already, I was asking at what point I'll be able to actually run a script that just says take wound/take wound/take wound/on and on/take last wound.
Is that something that is like a 'big' empath only thing, or is that something that is doable and low'ish circle?
You are not skilled enough to transfer at an accelerated rate.
I guess that is my real question.
>>As for concentration dropping to 0, don't take so many wounds at once and it won't happen.
I'm not really sure if you were actually trying to be helpful or not, but let me give you two responses that will cover either.
You were trying to be a smart ass(response): THANKS!!!!
You were trying to actualy be helpful(response): Yea I knew that already, I was asking at what point I'll be able to actually run a script that just says take wound/take wound/take wound/on and on/take last wound.
Is that something that is like a 'big' empath only thing, or is that something that is doable and low'ish circle?
ZONKAR
Re: New empath
11/15/2006 03:24 PM CST
>You were trying to actualy be helpful(response): Yea I knew that already, I was asking at what point I'll be able to actually run a script that just says take wound/take wound/take wound/on and on/take last wound.
I have no idea what you know about empaths, but you were asking some basic questions. No, I wasn't trying to be a smart ass.
However, there is no simple answer to this question, it depends on wound severity. My empath is 45th circle, with 38 discipline and 35 stamina, and I can still tank fatigue depending on wound severity. Refresh helps a lot with this, but seriously, you just need to take wounds slower if there are too many or they are severe.
I have no idea what you know about empaths, but you were asking some basic questions. No, I wasn't trying to be a smart ass.
However, there is no simple answer to this question, it depends on wound severity. My empath is 45th circle, with 38 discipline and 35 stamina, and I can still tank fatigue depending on wound severity. Refresh helps a lot with this, but seriously, you just need to take wounds slower if there are too many or they are severe.
LOFTONM1
Re: New empath
11/15/2006 04:22 PM CST
>>I was asking at what point I'll be able to actually run a script that just says take wound/take wound/take wound/on and on/take last wound.
25th using quick, except for the most extreme cases where not even the high-powered empaths could transfer very effectively.
Not sure about 20th using quick (assuming it's available), as quick didn't come into play until I was 25th, but by 20th I was easily healing everything at normal speed in roughly 45 seconds to 1 minute with a script operating at crutch-like speeds (or, like a bunch of cambrinth items snapping at the same time).
20th circle was more dependant on Refresh, but so long as Refresh was up I've never completely tapped my fatigue to the point of collapse.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
25th using quick, except for the most extreme cases where not even the high-powered empaths could transfer very effectively.
Not sure about 20th using quick (assuming it's available), as quick didn't come into play until I was 25th, but by 20th I was easily healing everything at normal speed in roughly 45 seconds to 1 minute with a script operating at crutch-like speeds (or, like a bunch of cambrinth items snapping at the same time).
20th circle was more dependant on Refresh, but so long as Refresh was up I've never completely tapped my fatigue to the point of collapse.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
SCHMOJA1
Re: New empath
11/18/2006 06:28 AM CST
Just a quick insert here, as for the lack quick option in crutch, that is partially incorrect. It is available in the plugin i have for strata. If anyone is interested, contatct me AIM FomarDR3.
As for the whole issue of quick, normal, or slow, manipulate, perc health, or any other method of training empathy, it should be based on the personallity of your character. If i just cared about the best ways to train empathy, well Fomar would still be 52nd circle. Thats just my opinion. Hugs to all
Teacher Fomar Havashal, Surgeon of Elanthia
As for the whole issue of quick, normal, or slow, manipulate, perc health, or any other method of training empathy, it should be based on the personallity of your character. If i just cared about the best ways to train empathy, well Fomar would still be 52nd circle. Thats just my opinion. Hugs to all
Teacher Fomar Havashal, Surgeon of Elanthia
CHRISTIANSONK3
Re: New empath
11/21/2006 02:40 PM CST
Most of the time I enjoy scripting more than I do 'playing' so i'm more of a numbers guy than a RP guy or whatever.
Someone has got to know when I can take <wound> quick
!
hugz!
Someone has got to know when I can take <wound> quick
!
hugz!
MATTSMOMMA
Re: New empath
11/22/2006 06:44 AM CST
...
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
CHRISTIANSONK3
Re: New empath
11/22/2006 02:13 PM CST
Out of all the posts i've ever seen, the entire post containing only '...' is probably the most useful.
I would have assumed that the 's around playing would have indicated that I meant it in a more general sense like role-playing, or physically typing in commands over and over.
But hey, some people just make it a point to be obnoxious.
I would have assumed that the 's around playing would have indicated that I meant it in a more general sense like role-playing, or physically typing in commands over and over.
But hey, some people just make it a point to be obnoxious.
MATTSMOMMA
Re: New empath
11/22/2006 02:48 PM CST
>>But hey, some people just make it a point to be obnoxious.
You mean like asking the exact same question over and over?
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
You mean like asking the exact same question over and over?
~Arwinia
It's mind over matter. I don't mind, because you don't matter.
