I was going to post this under the thread about a potential 100th circle ability, but I thought it deserved its own thread. Right now the guild is terribly bottom heavy in terms of abilities. Just a breakdown of what we can do and when:
* Healing - 1st circle
* Link - 1st circle
* Manipulate - 20th circle
* Shifting - 30th circle
* Spells - 54th to get all known Empath Spells
Shift and shock do grow with skill, and you can heal anything by 20th circle or so, but generally speaking, we cap out very early in terms of new stuff to do. Although I'd love a 100th circle ability(not that I imagine that will happen anytime soon) I'd really prefer to see the midcircle range filled out with abilities.
Please correct me if I'm wrong on this, and I'm missing more stuff in the middle. Hopefully, this is something that will be addressed someday, because really all there is to circle for after a certain point is new titles. And maybe the ability to shift years someday.
ASHCRAFTJ
LAMBL
Re: Bottom Heavy
01/13/2008 09:35 AM CST
<<Although I'd love a 100th circle ability(not that I imagine that will happen anytime soon) I'd really prefer to see the midcircle range filled out with abilities.>>
Yes, you are absolutely correct. I twitch every time someone even brings up the idea of a 100th circle ability...there's a whole lot of ground to cover between 30th and 100th first before we even start to consider thinking about 100th circle abilities. Really, the problem isn't that stuff is acquired too early or that the distribution is bad or anything...there just flat out isn't nearly enough stuff.
Thanks,
-Kaith Partani Karthor
Yes, you are absolutely correct. I twitch every time someone even brings up the idea of a 100th circle ability...there's a whole lot of ground to cover between 30th and 100th first before we even start to consider thinking about 100th circle abilities. Really, the problem isn't that stuff is acquired too early or that the distribution is bad or anything...there just flat out isn't nearly enough stuff.
Thanks,
-Kaith Partani Karthor
ASTARINEL
Re: Bottom Heavy
01/13/2008 05:45 PM CST
I shall repeat my endless and tedious requests for more variations on Manipulate as mid-circle abilities.
Manipulate DESPAIR: Causes a creature to incur roundtimes for weeping, drop to its knees/prone, and refrain from engaging in combat.
Manipulate TERROR: Causes a creature to drop something that it's holding (box, item, coin) and immediately flee the room.
Manipulate RAGE: Causes a creature to disengage from its current melee and immediately advance the Empath.
Manipulate has always seemed to me like an ability that was designed with expansion in mind -- the command is manipulate friendship, not just manipulate. Being able to induce other debilitating emotional effects in creatures (and, hey, why not PCs for some of 'em?) would be nice.
~Laril
Manipulate DESPAIR: Causes a creature to incur roundtimes for weeping, drop to its knees/prone, and refrain from engaging in combat.
Manipulate TERROR: Causes a creature to drop something that it's holding (box, item, coin) and immediately flee the room.
Manipulate RAGE: Causes a creature to disengage from its current melee and immediately advance the Empath.
Manipulate has always seemed to me like an ability that was designed with expansion in mind -- the command is manipulate friendship, not just manipulate. Being able to induce other debilitating emotional effects in creatures (and, hey, why not PCs for some of 'em?) would be nice.
~Laril
LOFTONM1
Re: Bottom Heavy
01/13/2008 07:17 PM CST
I kinda want Manipulate to be rewritten to be more like the new khri setup. A handful of broader categories, lots of specific applications within that relate to the category:
Protection (limitation: usable only on aggressive critters, does not alter fight-or-flight AI (ie, you cannot lock down an Inkhorne to fight for you, because an Inkhorne always runs away from danger))
FRIENDSHIP -- same as now, critters protect you from engaged threats by attacking them.
GUARD -- kinda like a paladin PROTECT. The critter doesn't go on the attack, but will attempt to block attacks with blade and shield. Obviously, only good on critters with such items/abilities. Will follow you around (though probably at speeds similar to a trader caravan/pack animal) for duration and will attempt to disengage if you leave.
RESCUE -- taps a critter to pull you out of battle.
Utility (limitation: usable only in applicable critter area)
MESSAGE -- sends critter off with a message to someone. Limited to critter area, but maybe useable on more than just hunting ground critters (ie, like town guards or friendly faces). Alternatively, could be like thief contacts where you're just given a random person from the faceless masses.
DELIVER -- same as MESSAGE, but for item delivery.
FIND -- sends critter off to search for someone.
LEAD -- uses critter to take you to someone. Operation more like ranger trails/thief passages rather than teleport or other instant travel.
Group (limitation: usable only in applicable critter area, less dependable than existing features (ie, HOLD will not be as great as a real shadow servant, LISTEN will not be as good as PC students, etc))
LISTEN -- allows you to teach a class to critters
HOLD -- allows you to store items on the critter, kinda like a shadow servant.
SLAVE -- allows you to command the critter, like Emmiline's dog.
J'Lo, I'm a ranger.. I'd believe anything.....
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
Protection (limitation: usable only on aggressive critters, does not alter fight-or-flight AI (ie, you cannot lock down an Inkhorne to fight for you, because an Inkhorne always runs away from danger))
FRIENDSHIP -- same as now, critters protect you from engaged threats by attacking them.
GUARD -- kinda like a paladin PROTECT. The critter doesn't go on the attack, but will attempt to block attacks with blade and shield. Obviously, only good on critters with such items/abilities. Will follow you around (though probably at speeds similar to a trader caravan/pack animal) for duration and will attempt to disengage if you leave.
RESCUE -- taps a critter to pull you out of battle.
Utility (limitation: usable only in applicable critter area)
MESSAGE -- sends critter off with a message to someone. Limited to critter area, but maybe useable on more than just hunting ground critters (ie, like town guards or friendly faces). Alternatively, could be like thief contacts where you're just given a random person from the faceless masses.
DELIVER -- same as MESSAGE, but for item delivery.
FIND -- sends critter off to search for someone.
LEAD -- uses critter to take you to someone. Operation more like ranger trails/thief passages rather than teleport or other instant travel.
Group (limitation: usable only in applicable critter area, less dependable than existing features (ie, HOLD will not be as great as a real shadow servant, LISTEN will not be as good as PC students, etc))
LISTEN -- allows you to teach a class to critters
HOLD -- allows you to store items on the critter, kinda like a shadow servant.
SLAVE -- allows you to command the critter, like Emmiline's dog.
J'Lo, I'm a ranger.. I'd believe anything.....
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
ASTARINEL
Re: Bottom Heavy
01/13/2008 07:46 PM CST
<<I kinda want Manipulate to be rewritten to be more like the new khri setup.>>
I don't really like this because of the nature of Manipulate as a form of emotional manipulation. I believe that we should be able to set the emotion, but the results should be a bit unpredictable, as with Friendship. And, again. It'd be nice if they worked on PCs to an extent. :)
Incidentally, though, I believe that some of these functions should and could be done by Guardian Spirits. Would it be possible for GS to pull us out of combat if we get stunned or otherwise incapacitated, along the lines of what fir familiars can do for Warrior Mages?
~Laril
I don't really like this because of the nature of Manipulate as a form of emotional manipulation. I believe that we should be able to set the emotion, but the results should be a bit unpredictable, as with Friendship. And, again. It'd be nice if they worked on PCs to an extent. :)
Incidentally, though, I believe that some of these functions should and could be done by Guardian Spirits. Would it be possible for GS to pull us out of combat if we get stunned or otherwise incapacitated, along the lines of what fir familiars can do for Warrior Mages?
~Laril
THREEPHI
Re: Bottom Heavy
01/15/2008 08:59 PM CST
>I don't really like this because of the nature of Manipulate as a form of emotional manipulation.
I think this opens up a whole realm of possible manipulations.
MANIPULATE WHEEDLE
MANIPULATE COMPLAIN ENDLESSLY
MANIPULATE BRIBERY
MANIPULATE UNFAIR COMPARISON (req: MANIPULATE PLAY FAVORITES)
MANIPULATE HOT/COLD
MANIPULATE EMOTIONAL VACUUM
And the ultimate, 100th circle manipulate:
MANIPULATE FEELINGS
~ Player of Farman et al.
http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/Main_Page
I think this opens up a whole realm of possible manipulations.
MANIPULATE WHEEDLE
MANIPULATE COMPLAIN ENDLESSLY
MANIPULATE BRIBERY
MANIPULATE UNFAIR COMPARISON (req: MANIPULATE PLAY FAVORITES)
MANIPULATE HOT/COLD
MANIPULATE EMOTIONAL VACUUM
And the ultimate, 100th circle manipulate:
MANIPULATE FEELINGS
~ Player of Farman et al.
http://www.elanthipedia.com/wiki/Main_Page
