So after reading the play.net homepage for something Cleric-related, I noticed this little gem in the official Simu description of Clerics.
"We are the Priests of War and the Patrons of Peace. We are the menders of the soul and the force that shears it like fresh meat. We are the most feared opponent of the Undead *and the summoners of ancient spirits*."
Now, i've never heard this talked about in any other piece of Cleric discourse. Recently hearing about the plan to make Avengers TM-based, I had an idea. (and i don't mean to rob wholesale the avenger idea, it's just the only current example of a fighting minion we have in DR)
The spell would be called..drumroll please...Ancient Spirit. It would function off the Cleric's last favor, and you would beseech that god to grant you a spirit minion (we can't just wrench them from the dead, that would be necromancy). The minion would have god-specific flavor.
>cast
You beseech Aldauth to aid you in this mortal realm.
A churning mist coalesces into the form of a vulture-headed spirit at your side.
Functionally, it would perform something like SLS or an Avenger. You could command it to attack things, and it would do cold-based damage to living, and possibly spirit damage to undead (to prevent cries of OMGHAX from other players that remember chill spirit).
And - since I played a MM long enough that I think every cool spell needs a downside, perhaps if you don't have your god's BENEdiction active, the spirit would have a chance to turn on you.
Another idea I had, and i'm not sure what it would be called...but basically a 4th tier Aesrela Everild (it's always bothered me that this spell doesn't function like this anyway)
It would be a persistant melee-range AOE. Preferrably held-mana, useable with OM, but requiring infusion for upkeep. The OM orb would maintain the spell pattern, but each bolt requires a certain amount of infused mana, variable by PM (maybe pm/50?...pm/100 feels a bit too easy for high PM). The drawbacks to this spell would obviously be maintaining the drain on the OM orb, and the constant infusion to keep the bolts going.
NERDINSTINCTS
MASON19
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/03/2009 12:09 PM CST
I'm pretty sure the GM's have stated that clerics wont get a pet or minion of any sort ever. Maybe that was referring to things like familiars/shadow servants/companions, so I may be wrong.
Personally I'd prefer a spell that functions like rimefang, but isn't rimefang. Having another AoE that blows everyone who walks through your room apart does me absolutely no good. Having a melee only or targets facing only AoE that's sustainable through OM would do me some good, assuming that it's usable on living things as well.
I'd really like soul attrition or chill spirit or whatever manifestation of the spell the GM's will allow to exist in the game. We're the, "menders of the soul and the force that shears it like fresh meat." Sadly we're now only the menders of it, because apparently using it in an attack is broken. If we can't have a single target spirit draining spell that works across a distance, can we at least have an AoE spell similar to the Snaer Hafwa spirit draining chant?
Personally I'd prefer a spell that functions like rimefang, but isn't rimefang. Having another AoE that blows everyone who walks through your room apart does me absolutely no good. Having a melee only or targets facing only AoE that's sustainable through OM would do me some good, assuming that it's usable on living things as well.
I'd really like soul attrition or chill spirit or whatever manifestation of the spell the GM's will allow to exist in the game. We're the, "menders of the soul and the force that shears it like fresh meat." Sadly we're now only the menders of it, because apparently using it in an attack is broken. If we can't have a single target spirit draining spell that works across a distance, can we at least have an AoE spell similar to the Snaer Hafwa spirit draining chant?
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/03/2009 03:53 PM CST
>I'm pretty sure the GM's have stated that clerics wont get a pet or minion of any sort ever. Maybe that was referring to things like familiars/shadow servants/companions, so I may be wrong.
It was also stated at one point that clerics would never, ever, have TM vs. living.
While I think the concept is still true (we won't get fams or shadowlings), I think it's possible clerics will get some summonable to do something.
It was also stated at one point that clerics would never, ever, have TM vs. living.
While I think the concept is still true (we won't get fams or shadowlings), I think it's possible clerics will get some summonable to do something.
LIURIDR
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/03/2009 03:55 PM CST
In line with Ucu's thoughts, I believe that GM Grejuva mentioned some sort of summoning spell being on his ever-growing to-do list. However, I could be dreaming.
ALDEN
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/03/2009 04:07 PM CST
Actually at one point- what 2 years ago?- we were asked what kind of 'companions' we would wish for. That was part of a game wide concept project I think, and when it was over....well i can't remember- certainly low on the list if nothing else.
However in other threads, its been stated that Necro's would have the best 'companions', so our expectations would have to be realistic. Personally I don't need a creature to attack for me, but i wouldn't mind one that held my backpacks and would listen to me teach.
However in other threads, its been stated that Necro's would have the best 'companions', so our expectations would have to be realistic. Personally I don't need a creature to attack for me, but i wouldn't mind one that held my backpacks and would listen to me teach.
YUOREE
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/03/2009 04:56 PM CST
>and would listen to me teach.
Lol. Great idea.
>teach bunny target
You begin to lecture the fuzzy bunny on the Targeted Magic Skill.
I heartily approve.
Lol. Great idea.
>teach bunny target
You begin to lecture the fuzzy bunny on the Targeted Magic Skill.
I heartily approve.
LORZELOPHIA
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/03/2009 04:58 PM CST
I wish I could teach my avenger ME. It really needs all the help it can get. :-(
-- Player of Szrael --
"Necromancy is Bad" (GM Armifer)
-- Player of Szrael --
"Necromancy is Bad" (GM Armifer)
DR-GREJUVA
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 01:22 AM CST
I most definitely encourage summoning ideas. There are already several floating around backstage as well.
Long-term, guild-defining minions a la Familiars, Companions, Risen? No.
Short-term, spell-based minions a la Shadow Servant, Guardian Spirit, Awaken Forest? Yes.
We are not going to copy any of those, however, and I would prefer combat to be a secondary function at best. I'm sure there are more exciting and unique purposes we can pursue for clerical minions.
GM Grejuva
Long-term, guild-defining minions a la Familiars, Companions, Risen? No.
Short-term, spell-based minions a la Shadow Servant, Guardian Spirit, Awaken Forest? Yes.
We are not going to copy any of those, however, and I would prefer combat to be a secondary function at best. I'm sure there are more exciting and unique purposes we can pursue for clerical minions.
GM Grejuva
JOHNSONS781
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 02:45 AM CST
When I think of Cleric summons, I think of Ritualists from Guild Wars (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Ritualist) and the spirits that they can summon (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Communing). They have both offensive and defensive effects like simple periodic direct damage to one target, knocking down a single target, blinding a target, removing spells from a target, or interrupting that target's actions, as well as defensive abilities like increasing evasion or reducing direct damage taken. Here's the only Youtube I could find of a Guild Wars ritualist in action without a terrible song laid over it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4sLhTvqKbk
MOOK1
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 04:54 AM CST
<<When I think of Cleric summons, I think of Ritualists from Guild Wars
I love my ritualist. That said, a) binding spirits are kind of a primary feature of that profession and not something I envision a DR cleric having. At least not to the degree that ritualists have in that game. As Grejuva said, Clerics aren't pet masters. And b) the spirits they summon are effectively incorporeal undead. In DR that doesn't fit with accepted lore. Clerics kill undead, not make them.
If I were to envision a 'cleric pet' it would be something like the unicorn in HORN, but longer lasting and the option to use various god's favours to determine the avatar. It would have some combat capability, primarily against undead/cursed. Something akin to awaken forest.
-Evran
Crackling with unspent rage since 386A.V.
I love my ritualist. That said, a) binding spirits are kind of a primary feature of that profession and not something I envision a DR cleric having. At least not to the degree that ritualists have in that game. As Grejuva said, Clerics aren't pet masters. And b) the spirits they summon are effectively incorporeal undead. In DR that doesn't fit with accepted lore. Clerics kill undead, not make them.
If I were to envision a 'cleric pet' it would be something like the unicorn in HORN, but longer lasting and the option to use various god's favours to determine the avatar. It would have some combat capability, primarily against undead/cursed. Something akin to awaken forest.
-Evran
Crackling with unspent rage since 386A.V.
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 06:29 AM CST
How about a mashup of OM and other spells?
Take a favor orb, any, and cast Bind Spirit (or holy ham sammich, whatever) to create an avatar of the favor orb (Huldah = weasel, meraud = wolf, etc.).
The avatar can then be set to auto-cast a spell or two with no RT or mana cost to you (say some type of trigger, like point to activate). Or even auto-casts for you.
Like OM, uses mana you charge it with to stick around.
General idea is a debuff bot, something that would cast curses and such on your critters for you, so you can deal with the killing.
Take a favor orb, any, and cast Bind Spirit (or holy ham sammich, whatever) to create an avatar of the favor orb (Huldah = weasel, meraud = wolf, etc.).
The avatar can then be set to auto-cast a spell or two with no RT or mana cost to you (say some type of trigger, like point to activate). Or even auto-casts for you.
Like OM, uses mana you charge it with to stick around.
General idea is a debuff bot, something that would cast curses and such on your critters for you, so you can deal with the killing.
ALDEN
MASON19
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 11:00 AM CST
I'd personally rather have soul attrition or chill spirit back which was arguably one of our best spells than some gimped pet thing that tries to fight for me in combat and follows me around holding a backpack. Grejuva, is there any possibility of releasing chill spirit back to us? Snaer Hafwa and other creatures still have spirit based attacks.
If I were to have some kind of pet, I'd want it to involve infusing spirit energy into whatever it is. The easiest way I could envision doing something like this, is having access to chill spirit and being able to shape the spirit energy you're draining into some form of spirit being as a secondary function requiring the cleric to possess knowledge of vigil, chs, and whatever the spirit things spell is plus a considerable pm/md check. I'd prefer it to be a higher tier spell so the summoned spirit thing could possess buffing capabilities, spell boosts, etc. as opposed to mediocre fighting and holding a backpack capabilities.
If I were to have some kind of pet, I'd want it to involve infusing spirit energy into whatever it is. The easiest way I could envision doing something like this, is having access to chill spirit and being able to shape the spirit energy you're draining into some form of spirit being as a secondary function requiring the cleric to possess knowledge of vigil, chs, and whatever the spirit things spell is plus a considerable pm/md check. I'd prefer it to be a higher tier spell so the summoned spirit thing could possess buffing capabilities, spell boosts, etc. as opposed to mediocre fighting and holding a backpack capabilities.
NERDINSTINCTS
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 11:32 AM CST
All of those sound like great ideas. I'm imagining an alignment-based spirit summon, dark would debuff enemies, light would buff you...neutral would, uhh...no idea, I'm at a loss here. Preferrably they would be aura-type debuffs, so we're not waiting around for the spirit to cast. Perhaps melee range?
Upkeep would be in the form of constant spirit drain (counteracted by Vigil of course). OR like Phaelynae suggested, upkeep would be a sort of spirit infuse (in a perfect world this would come along with chill spirit that drains spirit energy to the caster).
Upkeep would be in the form of constant spirit drain (counteracted by Vigil of course). OR like Phaelynae suggested, upkeep would be a sort of spirit infuse (in a perfect world this would come along with chill spirit that drains spirit energy to the caster).
DR-GREJUVA
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 11:43 AM CST
The main reason I haven't given high priority to lethal spiritual combat is that I feel it's less of a necessity now that we have a fleshed-out TM tree. I really want to re-release Chill Spirit and Soul Attrition (and more) eventually, but there are other new spells I'd like to make before, several which I believe would enrich the clerical arsenal in more substantial ways.
GM Grejuva
GM Grejuva
JMF90
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 11:46 AM CST
Before any new ways to drain spirit are released, I'd really like the spirit death mechanics to be updated. A 1 minute depart time regardless of stats seems excessively harsh.
MASON19
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 12:04 PM CST
>>Before any new ways to drain spirit are released, I'd really like the spirit death mechanics to be updated. A 1 minute depart time regardless of stats seems excessively harsh.
I sort of agree with this. If you die of lack of spirit health, and spirit health is the only thing keeping you from departing...I don't see what's really broken. On the flip side, I could see a massive influx of complaints of people dying and basically auto-departing without rejuves and losing exp.
My solution:
Adding a fixed 30 minute depart time from a spirit related death. This would be regardless of stats. It would also come with a stipulation of not being able to increase your depart timer with vigil, so you got 30 minutes, end of story. That's long enough to at least get a rejuve and depart under the new death system if you can't manage a raise in that time.
>>The main reason I haven't given high priority to lethal spiritual combat is that I feel it's less of a necessity now that we have a fleshed-out TM tree. I really want to re-release Chill Spirit and Soul Attrition (and more) eventually, but there are other new spells I'd like to make before, several which I believe would enrich the clerical arsenal in more substantial ways.
Yes we have a fleshed out TM tree, but I wasn't looking at it from a TM perspective. I was looking at it from a, "this is a unique function for clerical combat perspective." I would love a new spellbook dedicated to spiritual combat, but if you have something better in mind in an unrelated field, I guess I'll just have to wait and see what it is.
I sort of agree with this. If you die of lack of spirit health, and spirit health is the only thing keeping you from departing...I don't see what's really broken. On the flip side, I could see a massive influx of complaints of people dying and basically auto-departing without rejuves and losing exp.
My solution:
Adding a fixed 30 minute depart time from a spirit related death. This would be regardless of stats. It would also come with a stipulation of not being able to increase your depart timer with vigil, so you got 30 minutes, end of story. That's long enough to at least get a rejuve and depart under the new death system if you can't manage a raise in that time.
>>The main reason I haven't given high priority to lethal spiritual combat is that I feel it's less of a necessity now that we have a fleshed-out TM tree. I really want to re-release Chill Spirit and Soul Attrition (and more) eventually, but there are other new spells I'd like to make before, several which I believe would enrich the clerical arsenal in more substantial ways.
Yes we have a fleshed out TM tree, but I wasn't looking at it from a TM perspective. I was looking at it from a, "this is a unique function for clerical combat perspective." I would love a new spellbook dedicated to spiritual combat, but if you have something better in mind in an unrelated field, I guess I'll just have to wait and see what it is.
ALDEN
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/04/2009 05:51 PM CST
>> Adding a fixed 30 minute depart time from a spirit related death.
It doesn't even need to be 30. 10 would be more than enough.
But yes, there does need to be some contingency in place before lethal spirit combat comes back.
Rev. Reene
"When a mind does not know itself, it is flawed. When a mind is flawed, the man is flawed. When a man is flawed, that which he touches is flawed. It is said that what a flawed man sees, his hands make broken." - Dak'kon
It doesn't even need to be 30. 10 would be more than enough.
But yes, there does need to be some contingency in place before lethal spirit combat comes back.
Rev. Reene
"When a mind does not know itself, it is flawed. When a mind is flawed, the man is flawed. When a man is flawed, that which he touches is flawed. It is said that what a flawed man sees, his hands make broken." - Dak'kon
FALLENSHADOWS
Re: Couple spell ideas.
12/22/2009 06:20 AM CST
why not just make the decay based on your MAX spirit health rather then current. Would fix it right up.
_______________________
"Your toast has been burned! and no amount of scraping will remove your blackness"
-Caboose, RvB
_______________________
"Your toast has been burned! and no amount of scraping will remove your blackness"
-Caboose, RvB
