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>>Not sure I understand how that is good or bad in this context?
If your argument is that new crafting is going to drive people away, I can't imagine how it is going to drive them away if no one is forced to use it.
>>I don't mind that they work on crafting - just that they seem to use all their ressources on it while areas that need repairs are ignored for years. They could also have spent the time making quests or other improvements of the game instead. You need to remember that they are working on a replacement - not something new. You might think it's all different but in the end you will be making swords and armors, etc. still...
Combat and magic are also being reworked, a festival is just around the corner, an older quest was just updated and two new quests were just released. What more do you want, exactly?
Beyond that, you seem to think you know what resources are needed for what, let alone what GMs are interested in tackling. I can't blame GMs for not wanting to really tackle ships, because it's a very big system that doesn't have much payout.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
TEVESHSZAT
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:35 PM CDT
@TEVESHSZAT
<<You said that "anyone can go out and get more skins anytime they like" and followed it with how "you don't get Damite that way I can promise you". They're two notably separate things. There will be rare skins. No skins, as of right now, have stats that are even remotely comparable to rare metal stats.>>
You are simply not quoting me correctly. What I am saying is that the armor maker can get as many skins as he like of that particular type (correct me if I am mistaken) while Damite is a very rare metal that you will often not be able to get your hands on. If in time there are rare skins it might be more reasonable to charge 2pk for leathers as you will have had big expenses obtaining the skins.
<<All of them. They're having a disagreement party. I completely and 100% disagree that you need to do massively adventurous things involving killing big monsters and saving the world to have a fulfilling roleplay experience in the game.>>
Fair enough. I am not saying how you should prefer the game to be. All I am pointing out is that they put a lot of effort into crafting compared to how big a role you would normally think such mechanics should have in a roleplaying game. Let's leave it at that.
<<You're focusing on the fact that they're revamping crafting and ignoring the fact that they're also revamping magic and combat.>>
Actually, the only reason why we are speaking about crafting is because someone mentioned it to be taking all their time. If you ask me they should focus on repairing and new features rather than replacing old systems that was working - perhaps not perfect but they worked.
<<How does making it more possible for people to get involved in crafting drive anyone away?>>
When you change a game dramatically it's always gonna drive some people away. On the same time it's not easy to get new players to an old-style game like this (although it might be hard for us who prefers it to some graphical game any day) so you might end up in a worse place than you were before even if the changes are considered successful in the end...
<<You said that "anyone can go out and get more skins anytime they like" and followed it with how "you don't get Damite that way I can promise you". They're two notably separate things. There will be rare skins. No skins, as of right now, have stats that are even remotely comparable to rare metal stats.>>
You are simply not quoting me correctly. What I am saying is that the armor maker can get as many skins as he like of that particular type (correct me if I am mistaken) while Damite is a very rare metal that you will often not be able to get your hands on. If in time there are rare skins it might be more reasonable to charge 2pk for leathers as you will have had big expenses obtaining the skins.
<<All of them. They're having a disagreement party. I completely and 100% disagree that you need to do massively adventurous things involving killing big monsters and saving the world to have a fulfilling roleplay experience in the game.>>
Fair enough. I am not saying how you should prefer the game to be. All I am pointing out is that they put a lot of effort into crafting compared to how big a role you would normally think such mechanics should have in a roleplaying game. Let's leave it at that.
<<You're focusing on the fact that they're revamping crafting and ignoring the fact that they're also revamping magic and combat.>>
Actually, the only reason why we are speaking about crafting is because someone mentioned it to be taking all their time. If you ask me they should focus on repairing and new features rather than replacing old systems that was working - perhaps not perfect but they worked.
<<How does making it more possible for people to get involved in crafting drive anyone away?>>
When you change a game dramatically it's always gonna drive some people away. On the same time it's not easy to get new players to an old-style game like this (although it might be hard for us who prefers it to some graphical game any day) so you might end up in a worse place than you were before even if the changes are considered successful in the end...
BEVERAGEK
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:38 PM CDT
..?
You're upset that the GMs are...
- Putting their time into fleshing out the Lore skillset
- Rebalancing combat to scale well and be more flexible/fun
- Adding new(yes, new) crafting that is much more robust than what we had originally
- Creating a stable foundation of core systems which can be extrapolated on
- Creating a vast amount of new(yes, new) quests with all new never-before-seen loot
- Rebalancing experience so that you don't have to train a super-ton of skills in order to remain competitive with regard to tdps
- Fleshing out various guild systems and spells
- Putting out fests/events still while doing all of the above
...but aren't working on boats?
~Leilond
http://tinyurl.com/Leilond-Portrait
http://drzeal.forumotion.com Learn How to PvP!
You're upset that the GMs are...
- Putting their time into fleshing out the Lore skillset
- Rebalancing combat to scale well and be more flexible/fun
- Adding new(yes, new) crafting that is much more robust than what we had originally
- Creating a stable foundation of core systems which can be extrapolated on
- Creating a vast amount of new(yes, new) quests with all new never-before-seen loot
- Rebalancing experience so that you don't have to train a super-ton of skills in order to remain competitive with regard to tdps
- Fleshing out various guild systems and spells
- Putting out fests/events still while doing all of the above
...but aren't working on boats?
~Leilond
http://tinyurl.com/Leilond-Portrait
http://drzeal.forumotion.com Learn How to PvP!
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:38 PM CDT
>They could also have spent the time making quests or other improvements of the game instead.
Two new quests have been released fairly recently. They're also in the process of improving Combat, Magic, and Skills.
>we are not allowed to ignore bugs for years
Ships not being for sale is not a bug. It is a feature. Bugs take precedence over features. Features that will benefit more people take precedence over ones that will benefit fewer.
>The current changes definitely touches more sensible parts of the code and are thus more "dangerous" if you like.
But the current changes (Magic/Combat) impact every single player in the game. Ships do not.
>Everyone can have a ship in time
No. No they can't. The point of the pricing when they were initially released was so that not everyone can have one. If they were re-released tomorrow, I'm willing to bet the prices would be inflated.
>I think you underestimate the interest in private ships.
It's possible. But it is still a subset of people in the game. Magic/Combat changes affect everybody in the game. Hence, crafting weapons/armor and enchanting affect everybody in the game.
I'm willing to bet that updating houses to have multiple rooms has more interest than selling ships again. I'm also willing to bet there are dozens of examples of features people want to see changed/fixed/updated/added that have more interest than ships.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
Two new quests have been released fairly recently. They're also in the process of improving Combat, Magic, and Skills.
>we are not allowed to ignore bugs for years
Ships not being for sale is not a bug. It is a feature. Bugs take precedence over features. Features that will benefit more people take precedence over ones that will benefit fewer.
>The current changes definitely touches more sensible parts of the code and are thus more "dangerous" if you like.
But the current changes (Magic/Combat) impact every single player in the game. Ships do not.
>Everyone can have a ship in time
No. No they can't. The point of the pricing when they were initially released was so that not everyone can have one. If they were re-released tomorrow, I'm willing to bet the prices would be inflated.
>I think you underestimate the interest in private ships.
It's possible. But it is still a subset of people in the game. Magic/Combat changes affect everybody in the game. Hence, crafting weapons/armor and enchanting affect everybody in the game.
I'm willing to bet that updating houses to have multiple rooms has more interest than selling ships again. I'm also willing to bet there are dozens of examples of features people want to see changed/fixed/updated/added that have more interest than ships.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:51 PM CDT
>>What I am saying is that the armor maker can get as many skins as he like of that particular type (correct me if I am mistaken) while Damite is a very rare metal that you will often not be able to get your hands on.
My issue is that you keep focusing on damite (and to a lesser extent lumium).
If you want to use the argument that anyone can go out and get more leather of a particular type, you really should recognize that iron and coal are sold in forges themselves and that's pretty much the core metal for all of forging when it comes to weapons and armor.
>>All I am pointing out is that they put a lot of effort into crafting compared to how big a role you would normally think such mechanics should have in a roleplaying game. Let's leave it at that.
The reason they put a lot of effort into it is because there should be more to roleplay than hunting all day. How many RPGs generally have a Trader class, let alone one that is actually expected to do a notable amount of trading?
>>Actually, the only reason why we are speaking about crafting is because someone mentioned it to be taking all their time. If you ask me they should focus on repairing and new features rather than replacing old systems that was working - perhaps not perfect but they worked.
I don't know how many times I can repeat that what you just said is happening. Combat is getting repaired/fixed/upgraded to help address problems in high level combat and the fact that combat in general is way too fast as a whole. Magic is getting revamped to address redundancies in spellbooks and how everything about it essentially runs on just one skill. Guilds that don't use magic are getting their abilities integrated into the system as well. Two new quests, Riot and Tower, just came out. Ghost Ship was just updated. Riot is getting new in-quest and scrip shop loot added. Tower just had some notable updates two weeks ago. You do understand all this, right?
>>When you change a game dramatically it's always gonna drive some people away. On the same time it's not easy to get new players to an old-style game like this (although it might be hard for us who prefers it to some graphical game any day) so you might end up in a worse place than you were before even if the changes are considered successful in the end...
Let's summarize this.
1) Under the old crafting system, very few people crafted.
2) The new crafting system is going to make the crafting system more accessible to crafting as a whole.
3) But no one has to use it.
So how is anyone going to get driven away? From the sound of it, the old crafters are enjoying the new system, more people are also joining in (hello Lore primes, you have more stuff to do now!), and even if you don't want to deal with player to player sales it's an entirely valid way to earn money outside of combat.
Who are the notable phantom players being lost as a result of the new crafting system that you're talking about here?
It seems like every argument, in both this thread and the thread about Premium perks, focus on the fact that the GMs aren't doing what you want. You'd be better off saying that you want these things done because they're what you want than make all these grand arguments about poorly allocated GM time, scaring away the playerbase, etc etc etc.
Just say "I want these things" and leave it at that. As it is, your actual purpose in making these threads is highly transparent and it's slightly insulting that you're making all these drastically incorrect statements/claims in the hopes that your stance gets acknowledged.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
My issue is that you keep focusing on damite (and to a lesser extent lumium).
If you want to use the argument that anyone can go out and get more leather of a particular type, you really should recognize that iron and coal are sold in forges themselves and that's pretty much the core metal for all of forging when it comes to weapons and armor.
>>All I am pointing out is that they put a lot of effort into crafting compared to how big a role you would normally think such mechanics should have in a roleplaying game. Let's leave it at that.
The reason they put a lot of effort into it is because there should be more to roleplay than hunting all day. How many RPGs generally have a Trader class, let alone one that is actually expected to do a notable amount of trading?
>>Actually, the only reason why we are speaking about crafting is because someone mentioned it to be taking all their time. If you ask me they should focus on repairing and new features rather than replacing old systems that was working - perhaps not perfect but they worked.
I don't know how many times I can repeat that what you just said is happening. Combat is getting repaired/fixed/upgraded to help address problems in high level combat and the fact that combat in general is way too fast as a whole. Magic is getting revamped to address redundancies in spellbooks and how everything about it essentially runs on just one skill. Guilds that don't use magic are getting their abilities integrated into the system as well. Two new quests, Riot and Tower, just came out. Ghost Ship was just updated. Riot is getting new in-quest and scrip shop loot added. Tower just had some notable updates two weeks ago. You do understand all this, right?
>>When you change a game dramatically it's always gonna drive some people away. On the same time it's not easy to get new players to an old-style game like this (although it might be hard for us who prefers it to some graphical game any day) so you might end up in a worse place than you were before even if the changes are considered successful in the end...
Let's summarize this.
1) Under the old crafting system, very few people crafted.
2) The new crafting system is going to make the crafting system more accessible to crafting as a whole.
3) But no one has to use it.
So how is anyone going to get driven away? From the sound of it, the old crafters are enjoying the new system, more people are also joining in (hello Lore primes, you have more stuff to do now!), and even if you don't want to deal with player to player sales it's an entirely valid way to earn money outside of combat.
Who are the notable phantom players being lost as a result of the new crafting system that you're talking about here?
It seems like every argument, in both this thread and the thread about Premium perks, focus on the fact that the GMs aren't doing what you want. You'd be better off saying that you want these things done because they're what you want than make all these grand arguments about poorly allocated GM time, scaring away the playerbase, etc etc etc.
Just say "I want these things" and leave it at that. As it is, your actual purpose in making these threads is highly transparent and it's slightly insulting that you're making all these drastically incorrect statements/claims in the hopes that your stance gets acknowledged.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:54 PM CDT
>>I'm willing to bet that updating houses to have multiple rooms has more interest than selling ships again.
The three big things I'm hoping for someday that I fully recognize are hindered by systems issues are:
1) Bigger homes: I'm all for more rooms, being able to have more furniture with stuff on it, etc.
2) Account-wide vaults: Instead of having to juggle backpacks of stuff between characters, I'd rather just be able to have character A access character B's vault as long as they're on the same account. I'm betting it's a systems nightmare so I'm not holding my breath.
3) Tickets/scrip/rpas/etc being account based instead of character based.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
The three big things I'm hoping for someday that I fully recognize are hindered by systems issues are:
1) Bigger homes: I'm all for more rooms, being able to have more furniture with stuff on it, etc.
2) Account-wide vaults: Instead of having to juggle backpacks of stuff between characters, I'd rather just be able to have character A access character B's vault as long as they're on the same account. I'm betting it's a systems nightmare so I'm not holding my breath.
3) Tickets/scrip/rpas/etc being account based instead of character based.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:55 PM CDT
@TEVESHSZAT
<<If your argument is that new crafting is going to drive people away, I can't imagine how it is going to drive them away if no one is forced to use it.>>
Some because they liked the old system better. Others because other needed changes and repairs are neglected in the meanwhile.
<<Combat and magic are also being reworked, a festival is just around the corner, an older quest was just updated and two new quests were just released. What more do you want, exactly?>>
My thoughts on reworking was touched in my last post. Festivals and quests I love although I agree with another person who I think was worried about how all events are getting to be something you pay for seperately or is not participating in. However these things are not really related to this discussion I think. There will be quests and fests - whether there will be reworking or repairs and new features is the question here.
<<I can't blame GMs for not wanting to really tackle ships, because it's a very big system that doesn't have much payout.>>
Again I think that there are more interest than you think. Besides I do see more coin among people than a few years ago and I am not sure how healthy that is. Besides controlling the flow of cash into the game, a good way to change this is to sell very expensive things like ships for instance.
<<If your argument is that new crafting is going to drive people away, I can't imagine how it is going to drive them away if no one is forced to use it.>>
Some because they liked the old system better. Others because other needed changes and repairs are neglected in the meanwhile.
<<Combat and magic are also being reworked, a festival is just around the corner, an older quest was just updated and two new quests were just released. What more do you want, exactly?>>
My thoughts on reworking was touched in my last post. Festivals and quests I love although I agree with another person who I think was worried about how all events are getting to be something you pay for seperately or is not participating in. However these things are not really related to this discussion I think. There will be quests and fests - whether there will be reworking or repairs and new features is the question here.
<<I can't blame GMs for not wanting to really tackle ships, because it's a very big system that doesn't have much payout.>>
Again I think that there are more interest than you think. Besides I do see more coin among people than a few years ago and I am not sure how healthy that is. Besides controlling the flow of cash into the game, a good way to change this is to sell very expensive things like ships for instance.
BLCKGRD4
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:56 PM CDT
>>I don't mind that they work on crafting - just that they seem to use all their ressources on it while areas that need repairs are ignored for years. They could also have spent the time making quests or other improvements of the game instead. You need to remember that they are working on a replacement - not something new. You might think it's all different but in the end you will be making swords and armors, etc. still...
I am a bit puzzled by this assertion really.
>just that they seem to use all their ressources on it while areas that need repairs are ignored for years
This is just not true...at all. Fang Cove was released not long ago and numerous bugs or update requests that have been brought up on a wide range of topics have been fixed or looked into. The majority of their workload is focused on X3.0 it is not limited to this alone.
>They could also have spent the time making quests
Perhaps you've missed the fact that they've released Quelling the Riot, Kanton's Dagger, Akegwe's Legacy, all of them new quests! they've even re-released a few old quests with new and expanded loot lists. I could be wrong on this next point, but I can't recall another year in which they've released 3 brand new quests in so short a time.
>or other improvements of the game instead.
Perhaps you've missed that they're going to be raising the circle cap to 200 soon. Only something people have been asking about for a long time, while the exact details of it might be in question or being debated about, that's still a great improvement for those that will be allowed to do this. Perhaps you've also missed that Traders will be getting a form of magic, a major improvement for a guild that has lacked development for as long as I can remember.
>You might think it's all different but in the end you will be making swords and armors, etc. still...
and you'll be killing things with those swords and armors, etc. still...so what's your point here?
You keep making strawmen arguements and non sequitors and seem completely incapable of listening to others who try their hardest to correct your erroneous statements. You keep speaking on behalf of an invisible majority of people, flaws of a system, or way of doing things but provide absolutely no specifics or data to support your assertions.
While I do appreciate that you seem to be rather civil in your posts compared with other arguements of opinions in the past, your disingenous claims are getting rather tedious and frustrating to me at least, and it appears others are getting to that point or have already reached that point.
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
I am a bit puzzled by this assertion really.
>just that they seem to use all their ressources on it while areas that need repairs are ignored for years
This is just not true...at all. Fang Cove was released not long ago and numerous bugs or update requests that have been brought up on a wide range of topics have been fixed or looked into. The majority of their workload is focused on X3.0 it is not limited to this alone.
>They could also have spent the time making quests
Perhaps you've missed the fact that they've released Quelling the Riot, Kanton's Dagger, Akegwe's Legacy, all of them new quests! they've even re-released a few old quests with new and expanded loot lists. I could be wrong on this next point, but I can't recall another year in which they've released 3 brand new quests in so short a time.
>or other improvements of the game instead.
Perhaps you've missed that they're going to be raising the circle cap to 200 soon. Only something people have been asking about for a long time, while the exact details of it might be in question or being debated about, that's still a great improvement for those that will be allowed to do this. Perhaps you've also missed that Traders will be getting a form of magic, a major improvement for a guild that has lacked development for as long as I can remember.
>You might think it's all different but in the end you will be making swords and armors, etc. still...
and you'll be killing things with those swords and armors, etc. still...so what's your point here?
You keep making strawmen arguements and non sequitors and seem completely incapable of listening to others who try their hardest to correct your erroneous statements. You keep speaking on behalf of an invisible majority of people, flaws of a system, or way of doing things but provide absolutely no specifics or data to support your assertions.
While I do appreciate that you seem to be rather civil in your posts compared with other arguements of opinions in the past, your disingenous claims are getting rather tedious and frustrating to me at least, and it appears others are getting to that point or have already reached that point.
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 04:10 PM CDT
>>Some because they liked the old system better. Others because other needed changes and repairs are neglected in the meanwhile.
Who liked the old forging system? The old system was a pile of bugs on a pile of other bugs where you had to figure out how to break the system through buggy loopholes in order to get good items. You also had to get hundreds of ranks in multiple armors and weapons and be the right guild to have the chance to make the "good" stuff.
>>Festivals and quests I love although I agree with another person who I think was worried about how all events are getting to be something you pay for seperately or is not participating in.
The next festival is free.
When magic 3.0 rolls out, my understanding is that there's going to be an event to explain what happened to magic, and if it is anything like the last times notable system updates came into play (the previous magic tweaks, death mechanics tweaks, etc), this will most likely be one of those epic-scale world events that last for a bit.
>>your disingenous claims are getting rather tedious and frustrating to me at least, and it appears others are getting to that point or have already reached that point.
Agreed.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
Who liked the old forging system? The old system was a pile of bugs on a pile of other bugs where you had to figure out how to break the system through buggy loopholes in order to get good items. You also had to get hundreds of ranks in multiple armors and weapons and be the right guild to have the chance to make the "good" stuff.
>>Festivals and quests I love although I agree with another person who I think was worried about how all events are getting to be something you pay for seperately or is not participating in.
The next festival is free.
When magic 3.0 rolls out, my understanding is that there's going to be an event to explain what happened to magic, and if it is anything like the last times notable system updates came into play (the previous magic tweaks, death mechanics tweaks, etc), this will most likely be one of those epic-scale world events that last for a bit.
>>your disingenous claims are getting rather tedious and frustrating to me at least, and it appears others are getting to that point or have already reached that point.
Agreed.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
JAIREM
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 04:23 PM CDT
>>When magic 3.0 rolls out, my understanding is that there's going to be an event to explain what happened to magic,
The Gorbesh did it!
Zozuskar says, "You're a sneaky little beard."
The Gorbesh did it!
Zozuskar says, "You're a sneaky little beard."
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 04:42 PM CDT
Oh, man - you guys write so fast I can't keep up so answers might be short. However I think most comments lately are merely circling the same areas as we have already touched.
@BEVERAGEK
<<You're upset that the GMs are...>>
I am not at all. I created this thread to ask for the GMs current plans on fixing ships so they can be sold again.
@DANFORDS2
<<Ships not being for sale is not a bug. It is a feature.>>
It's a feature to cover a bug. Don't be cute - you know why they sent Barana on holliday.
<<The point of the pricing when they were initially released was so that not everyone can have one. If they were re-released tomorrow, I'm willing to bet the prices would be inflated.>>
I agree that prices should be adjusted as people have more money these days - that's another thing they should look at in my opinion. Still doesn't mean that anyone can't have one - they just can't have it for a good while if they are running around the shipyard killing rats...
<<Hence, crafting weapons/armor and enchanting affect everybody in the game.>>
It affects only the crafters really...
@TEVESHSZAT
You are going off on a tangent here. We are not discussing metal attributes here - or most of the other subjects you try and move the discussion to for that matter.
@BEVERAGEK
<<You're upset that the GMs are...>>
I am not at all. I created this thread to ask for the GMs current plans on fixing ships so they can be sold again.
@DANFORDS2
<<Ships not being for sale is not a bug. It is a feature.>>
It's a feature to cover a bug. Don't be cute - you know why they sent Barana on holliday.
<<The point of the pricing when they were initially released was so that not everyone can have one. If they were re-released tomorrow, I'm willing to bet the prices would be inflated.>>
I agree that prices should be adjusted as people have more money these days - that's another thing they should look at in my opinion. Still doesn't mean that anyone can't have one - they just can't have it for a good while if they are running around the shipyard killing rats...
<<Hence, crafting weapons/armor and enchanting affect everybody in the game.>>
It affects only the crafters really...
@TEVESHSZAT
You are going off on a tangent here. We are not discussing metal attributes here - or most of the other subjects you try and move the discussion to for that matter.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 04:53 PM CDT
>>I created this thread to ask for the GMs current plans on fixing ships so they can be sold again.
There aren't any.
>>It's a feature to cover a bug.
No, it's recognizing that the game system, as a whole, can't support an uncontrolled number of ships being released.
Look at it this way: is the fact that you can't keep a over 500 items on your character a bug? Is the fact that vault space has a cap a bug? Both of these take place because of system limitations. Ships are limited for the same reason. The game can't handle an infinite number of ships just like the game can't handle an infinite number of items on your character.
>>It affects only the crafters really...
Not really. Combat 3.0 is going to have to acknowledge the types of weapons and armor and enchantments and etc that are created in crafting.
>>You are going off on a tangent here. We are not discussing metal attributes here
If you argue that armorsmiths must get damite/lumium which is hard to come by but tailors can just go out and skin another animal, I'm going to correct you because it's a gross misunderstanding of how the system works and the stats on those materials.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
There aren't any.
>>It's a feature to cover a bug.
No, it's recognizing that the game system, as a whole, can't support an uncontrolled number of ships being released.
Look at it this way: is the fact that you can't keep a over 500 items on your character a bug? Is the fact that vault space has a cap a bug? Both of these take place because of system limitations. Ships are limited for the same reason. The game can't handle an infinite number of ships just like the game can't handle an infinite number of items on your character.
>>It affects only the crafters really...
Not really. Combat 3.0 is going to have to acknowledge the types of weapons and armor and enchantments and etc that are created in crafting.
>>You are going off on a tangent here. We are not discussing metal attributes here
If you argue that armorsmiths must get damite/lumium which is hard to come by but tailors can just go out and skin another animal, I'm going to correct you because it's a gross misunderstanding of how the system works and the stats on those materials.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 05:11 PM CDT
>It's a feature to cover a bug.
I realize they way I phrased that was poor, but I'm not saying it's a feature that ships aren't for sale. I'm saying ships are a feature. You being able to get one is a feature. It's a feature that is disabled. There's no bug with ships, they are simply a resource intensive item. They are therefore no longer adding more resource intensive items to the game.
>It affects only the crafters really...
I have never set foot in a crafting hall and I use entirely player made gear. Crafting affects my combat immensely, even though I don't personally participate. I'm willing to bet a large portion of characters are the same.
>I created this thread to ask for the GMs current plans on fixing ships so they can be sold again.
There are no current plans to fix ships. You're asking about the plans for a system with a very low benefit to cost ratio. In the middle of one of the most major rewrites in the game. Rewrites that will (arguably) benefit every character in the game.
As much as you might like the privately owned ship system, it isn't worth the effort right now. It simply will not improve the day to day play/enjoyment of enough people in comparison to other projects. Especially when there are entire guilds that just got a guild only skill that don't have abilities to teach it.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
I realize they way I phrased that was poor, but I'm not saying it's a feature that ships aren't for sale. I'm saying ships are a feature. You being able to get one is a feature. It's a feature that is disabled. There's no bug with ships, they are simply a resource intensive item. They are therefore no longer adding more resource intensive items to the game.
>It affects only the crafters really...
I have never set foot in a crafting hall and I use entirely player made gear. Crafting affects my combat immensely, even though I don't personally participate. I'm willing to bet a large portion of characters are the same.
>I created this thread to ask for the GMs current plans on fixing ships so they can be sold again.
There are no current plans to fix ships. You're asking about the plans for a system with a very low benefit to cost ratio. In the middle of one of the most major rewrites in the game. Rewrites that will (arguably) benefit every character in the game.
As much as you might like the privately owned ship system, it isn't worth the effort right now. It simply will not improve the day to day play/enjoyment of enough people in comparison to other projects. Especially when there are entire guilds that just got a guild only skill that don't have abilities to teach it.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
RAIST
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 05:14 PM CDT
>Who liked the old forging system? The old system was a pile of bugs on a pile of other bugs where you had to figure out how to break the system through buggy loopholes in order to get good items. You also had to get hundreds of ranks in multiple armors and weapons and be the right guild to have the chance to make the "good" stuff.
Well said. The former system was a well meaning, but hideously convoluted and buggy system.
Much happier with the new one.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
Well said. The former system was a well meaning, but hideously convoluted and buggy system.
Much happier with the new one.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 05:28 PM CDT
@TEVESHSZAT
<<No, it's recognizing that the game system, as a whole, can't support an uncontrolled number of ships being released.>>
Exactly - because the code is bad or bugged or whatever we can agree to call it.
<<Not really. Combat 3.0 is going to have to acknowledge the types of weapons and armor and enchantments and etc that are created in crafting.>>
I am sure that one thing many will like about the changes are new forged weapon types but unless you are a forger you will hardly be interested in how it was made.
<<If you argue that armorsmiths must get damite/lumium which is hard to come by but tailors can just go out and skin another animal, I'm going to correct you because it's a gross misunderstanding of how the system works and the stats on those materials.>>
How is it wrong? I suppose we agree that no rare skins are out there right now (at least none that sits on a critter that can be hunted)?
<<No, it's recognizing that the game system, as a whole, can't support an uncontrolled number of ships being released.>>
Exactly - because the code is bad or bugged or whatever we can agree to call it.
<<Not really. Combat 3.0 is going to have to acknowledge the types of weapons and armor and enchantments and etc that are created in crafting.>>
I am sure that one thing many will like about the changes are new forged weapon types but unless you are a forger you will hardly be interested in how it was made.
<<If you argue that armorsmiths must get damite/lumium which is hard to come by but tailors can just go out and skin another animal, I'm going to correct you because it's a gross misunderstanding of how the system works and the stats on those materials.>>
How is it wrong? I suppose we agree that no rare skins are out there right now (at least none that sits on a critter that can be hunted)?
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 05:32 PM CDT
>Exactly - because the code is bad or bugged or whatever we can agree to call it.
If you feel this passionately about it, you should apply to be a Dev GM.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
If you feel this passionately about it, you should apply to be a Dev GM.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 05:39 PM CDT
>>Exactly - because the code is bad or bugged or whatever we can agree to call it.
Are vaults, homes, and inventories buggy because the system caps the amount of things they can store, as well?
When homes were one per premium account, was that buggy due to a cap?
Is it a bug that GMs can't run multiple iterations of a quest at the same time?
Is it a but that we can't enter 100 commands at once?
Or are these recognized and acknowledged limits that exist to maintain game stability?
>>I am sure that one thing many will like about the changes are new forged weapon types but unless you are a forger you will hardly be interested in how it was made.
That doesn't dismiss that the new system has positive effects to more than just craftsmen.
>>How is it wrong? I suppose we agree that no rare skins are out there right now (at least none that sits on a critter that can be hunted)?
Because your comparisons are flawed based on the points I've previously made.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
Are vaults, homes, and inventories buggy because the system caps the amount of things they can store, as well?
When homes were one per premium account, was that buggy due to a cap?
Is it a bug that GMs can't run multiple iterations of a quest at the same time?
Is it a but that we can't enter 100 commands at once?
Or are these recognized and acknowledged limits that exist to maintain game stability?
>>I am sure that one thing many will like about the changes are new forged weapon types but unless you are a forger you will hardly be interested in how it was made.
That doesn't dismiss that the new system has positive effects to more than just craftsmen.
>>How is it wrong? I suppose we agree that no rare skins are out there right now (at least none that sits on a critter that can be hunted)?
Because your comparisons are flawed based on the points I've previously made.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 05:47 PM CDT
@DANFORDS2
<<There's no bug with ships, they are simply a resource intensive item. They are therefore no longer adding more resource intensive items to the game.>>
I am sure it was not meant to be disabled. It turned out to be ressource demanding and thus they closed the shipyard. In my world an unexpected feature like this is a bug but let's not fight over that.
<<I have never set foot in a crafting hall and I use entirely player made gear.>>
So for you it would not matter if it was made old-style or new-style.
<<There are no current plans to fix ships.>>
I understand what you say but I would still like to hear an update from official side.
<<As much as you might like the privately owned ship system, it isn't worth the effort right now.>>
Now that is where we don't agree. Or at least until some GM says it will take three years to fix - which I doubt.
@RAIST
<<The former system was a well meaning, but hideously convoluted and buggy system. Much happier with the new one.>>
I understand you are but at least there was a system already. Is the new system really that great you think? Perhaps it's not buggy but is it truly great? When do you think it will be done? Will stone carvers be the richest persons around or how will the disciplines generally balance out. Is it your impression that GMs have the slightest idea how their changes will impact the game in short and long term?
<<There's no bug with ships, they are simply a resource intensive item. They are therefore no longer adding more resource intensive items to the game.>>
I am sure it was not meant to be disabled. It turned out to be ressource demanding and thus they closed the shipyard. In my world an unexpected feature like this is a bug but let's not fight over that.
<<I have never set foot in a crafting hall and I use entirely player made gear.>>
So for you it would not matter if it was made old-style or new-style.
<<There are no current plans to fix ships.>>
I understand what you say but I would still like to hear an update from official side.
<<As much as you might like the privately owned ship system, it isn't worth the effort right now.>>
Now that is where we don't agree. Or at least until some GM says it will take three years to fix - which I doubt.
@RAIST
<<The former system was a well meaning, but hideously convoluted and buggy system. Much happier with the new one.>>
I understand you are but at least there was a system already. Is the new system really that great you think? Perhaps it's not buggy but is it truly great? When do you think it will be done? Will stone carvers be the richest persons around or how will the disciplines generally balance out. Is it your impression that GMs have the slightest idea how their changes will impact the game in short and long term?
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 06:01 PM CDT
@DANFORDS2
<<If you feel this passionately about it, you should apply to be a Dev GM.>>
Perhaps...
@TEVESHSZAT
<<Are vaults, homes, and inventories buggy because the system caps the amount of things they can store, as well?>>
I am quite sure that I can not convince you about the differences between a bug and a feature if I told you a thousand times.
<<That doesn't dismiss that the new system has positive effects to more than just craftsmen.>>
We can agree on that though it will hardly mean a big change.
<<Because your comparisons are flawed based on the points I've previously made.>>
That's not an answer.
<<If you feel this passionately about it, you should apply to be a Dev GM.>>
Perhaps...
@TEVESHSZAT
<<Are vaults, homes, and inventories buggy because the system caps the amount of things they can store, as well?>>
I am quite sure that I can not convince you about the differences between a bug and a feature if I told you a thousand times.
<<That doesn't dismiss that the new system has positive effects to more than just craftsmen.>>
We can agree on that though it will hardly mean a big change.
<<Because your comparisons are flawed based on the points I've previously made.>>
That's not an answer.
BEVERAGEK
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 06:01 PM CDT
| There's no bug with ships, they are simply a resource intensive item. They are therefore no longer adding more resource intensive items to the game.>> |
| I am sure it was not meant to be disabled. It turned out to be ressource demanding and thus they closed the shipyard. In my world an unexpected feature like this is a bug. |
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~Leilond
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RAIST
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 06:02 PM CDT
>I understand you are but at least there was a system already. Is the new system really that great you think? Perhaps it's not buggy but is it truly great?
Yes. Very much, yes.
>When do you think it will be done?
Next year or two probably, I'd guess.
If you mean, when will will be able to do everything in the new system that we did in the old, we can do most of it already, so maybe 6 months, hard to predict.
>Will stone carvers be the richest persons around or how will the disciplines generally balance out.
Does it matter? The stonecarving didn't even exist in the old system, so they're already ahead. Given a choice between "you can do it, but you might not be the richest person in game" and "you can't do it at all," I'll take the former.
As I've been pointing out for quite a while, for me, crafting isn't the huge revenue source people seem to think it is. I could make quite a bit more money hunting.
>Is it your impression that GMs have the slightest idea how their changes will impact the game in short and long term?
Like all systems in a game as complex as this, they'll be adjusted as we players find new ways to abuse them in unanticipated ways. The social impact will probably take years to fully unfold.
Also, I find the undertone of this question to be slightly offensive, and unconductive to motivating the developers to continue working. Wonder at the implications all you want, but implying that the GMs are clueless isn't very helpful.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
Yes. Very much, yes.
>When do you think it will be done?
Next year or two probably, I'd guess.
If you mean, when will will be able to do everything in the new system that we did in the old, we can do most of it already, so maybe 6 months, hard to predict.
>Will stone carvers be the richest persons around or how will the disciplines generally balance out.
Does it matter? The stonecarving didn't even exist in the old system, so they're already ahead. Given a choice between "you can do it, but you might not be the richest person in game" and "you can't do it at all," I'll take the former.
As I've been pointing out for quite a while, for me, crafting isn't the huge revenue source people seem to think it is. I could make quite a bit more money hunting.
>Is it your impression that GMs have the slightest idea how their changes will impact the game in short and long term?
Like all systems in a game as complex as this, they'll be adjusted as we players find new ways to abuse them in unanticipated ways. The social impact will probably take years to fully unfold.
Also, I find the undertone of this question to be slightly offensive, and unconductive to motivating the developers to continue working. Wonder at the implications all you want, but implying that the GMs are clueless isn't very helpful.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 06:03 PM CDT
>So for you it would not matter if it was made old-style or new-style.
New style allows for creation of things that weren't possible before. So new style makes a huge difference to me. And that's without the full system released. When enchanting gets released, it will be even more awesomely better.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
New style allows for creation of things that weren't possible before. So new style makes a huge difference to me. And that's without the full system released. When enchanting gets released, it will be even more awesomely better.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 06:51 PM CDT
@RAIST
<<Also, I find the undertone of this question to be slightly offensive, and unconductive to motivating the developers to continue working. Wonder at the implications all you want, but implying that the GMs are clueless isn't very helpful.>>
Noted. My point was merely that being new doesn't mean being great and that I personally can't see the finishing date in the near future.
<<Also, I find the undertone of this question to be slightly offensive, and unconductive to motivating the developers to continue working. Wonder at the implications all you want, but implying that the GMs are clueless isn't very helpful.>>
Noted. My point was merely that being new doesn't mean being great and that I personally can't see the finishing date in the near future.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 06:56 PM CDT
>>My point was merely that being new doesn't mean being great and that I personally can't see the finishing date in the near future.
Forging is already finished.
The others are in progress, but since they didn't exist before, I can't exactly say we're still playing catch up.
At this point, I think most of your issues with a lack of development is that you don't really have a solid grasp on what is being developed.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
Forging is already finished.
The others are in progress, but since they didn't exist before, I can't exactly say we're still playing catch up.
At this point, I think most of your issues with a lack of development is that you don't really have a solid grasp on what is being developed.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 07:01 PM CDT
>The others are in progress, but since they didn't exist before, I can't exactly say we're still playing catch up.
To be fair, some of the others do exist, like fletching, tailoring, and enchanting. But they haven't removed the old systems.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
To be fair, some of the others do exist, like fletching, tailoring, and enchanting. But they haven't removed the old systems.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 07:34 PM CDT
>>To be fair, some of the others do exist, like fletching, tailoring, and enchanting.
True, but tailoring is pretty much 95% of the way to being where it previously was, right? Just needs shields to roll back out.
Fletching does need to happen, though, but like you said it's still around so yeah.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
True, but tailoring is pretty much 95% of the way to being where it previously was, right? Just needs shields to roll back out.
Fletching does need to happen, though, but like you said it's still around so yeah.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
GERSTEINJ2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/24/2012 12:28 PM CDT
<<I'm willing to bet that updating houses to have multiple rooms has more interest than selling ships again. I'm also willing to bet there are dozens of examples of features people want to see changed/fixed/updated/added that have more interest than ships>>
I'll take that bet. As a premium subscriber, I have more interest in acquiring a ship in the instance I don't have one in, than in acquiring yet more rooms for the houses I already have. Some even remain relatively unfurnished. :-)
-just a slumlord, with projects in the crossings...--
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
I'll take that bet. As a premium subscriber, I have more interest in acquiring a ship in the instance I don't have one in, than in acquiring yet more rooms for the houses I already have. Some even remain relatively unfurnished. :-)
-just a slumlord, with projects in the crossings...--
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
GERSTEINJ2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/24/2012 12:33 PM CDT
<<there's going to be an event to explain what happened to magic, >>
Face it. Meraud didn't get enough Lavender last time around....
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
Face it. Meraud didn't get enough Lavender last time around....
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
BUUWL
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/25/2012 02:29 PM CDT
Wow that really got out of hand fast... I think Brick killed a guy.
- Buuwl
- Buuwl
BLCKGRD4
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/25/2012 03:39 PM CDT
lol
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
MOD-ZAIRYCHE
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/25/2012 09:48 PM CDT
Let's get this back on topic. Thanks!
Zairyche
DragonRealms Board Monitor
If you have questions or comments, please email me at (Mod-Zairyche@play.net) or Senior Board Monitor Sidatura at (DR-
Sidatura@play.net) or Message Board Supervisor Annwyl (DR-Annwyl@play.net).
Zairyche
DragonRealms Board Monitor
If you have questions or comments, please email me at (Mod-Zairyche@play.net) or Senior Board Monitor Sidatura at (DR-
Sidatura@play.net) or Message Board Supervisor Annwyl (DR-Annwyl@play.net).
