Howdy folks. Ok, so this is my plan for arrows....

Raw resource -> Refining -> 5 Arrowhead
Lumber -> Refining -> 5 Shafts
Buy straight, spiral or flu-flu flights from the store for now. Someday make your own.

Arrowhead + Shafts + Flights = Stack of 5 arrows. In general the arrowhead and shaft making will just 1 or 2 actions. Making the arrows will be a process about as long as making a toy bow.

Different types of arrowheads will be craftable from Metal, Bone Teeth, Bone Talons and Stone.

- Metal-headed arrows will be equivalent to today's basilisk arrows, with Tyrium-quality coming in a bit above. I'm planning on having basic arrowheads, broadheads, nbodkins, swallow-tails and blunt heads, each with stats re-assigned appropriately. Metal arrows will feature higher durability to compensate for being a bit less damaging. Rare templates will allow access to reduced-durability metal arrows with higher stats and cool sounding names.

- Stone-headed arrows made from rare stone materials will be better than today's basilisk arrows with less durability. These will have an added impact component.

- Bone teeth and claw arrows made from rare materials will be better than today's basilisk arrows with comparable durability. These will have added slice or puncture components.



Templates in the book will be something like this -

Basic Arrow = Arrowhead + Shaft + Flights
Broadhead Arrow = Broadhead + Shaft + Flights
Leadhead Arrow = Leadhead + Shaft + Flights
Blunthead Arrow = Blunthead + Shaft + Flights

Stone Arrow = Stone Arrowhead + Shaft + Flights

Basilisk Arrow = Refined Basilisk tooth + Shaft + Flights
Sharktooth Arrow = Refined Shark tooth + Shaft + Flights
Warklin Arrow = Refined Warklin claw + Shaft + Flights
Merrow Arrow = Refined Merrow claw + Shaft + Flights
Peccary Arrow = Refined Peccary tusk + Shaft + Flights

and so on as we think of new things to add...

Exotic Arrow = Refined exotic animal part + Shafts + Flights

The type of animal will determine the stat assignment. There won't really be a "rarity" to the animal parts themselves, but you may occasionally come across a rare critter that fits the exotic arrow requirements and gives enhanced stats.

I wanted this approach vs a "critter" arrow, because it lets us have more tiers of arrows to support work orders. More work for me setting it all up, but it stops folks from guessing "can this be used for an arrow?".

Flights will come in 3 kinds Straight, Spiral and Flu-flu. Straight will give no bonuses. Flu-flu will give bonus damage at melee and reduced damage at missile. Spiral will give increased chance of lodging 1-level deeper in exchange for a 20% chance of +1 second load time.

Now, a big problem I have is the game engine does not allow me to store practically anything on the arrows themselves... this is to make stacking possible and keep the memory requirements sane. So...

- Arrows will have all the "Creation" info on them until combined/broken. So you'll be able to analyze or turn them in for work orders until you've manipulated them.
- Arrows will store the type of flights used. You can appraise them to figure this out - it isn't possible to modify their name based on flights used.
- Arrows will have a chance to break on hit. This will be extremely low for even the weakest arrows, but it is much easier on everyone than tracking and forcing you to repair your arrows. Kertig arrows will generally break 1-in-10,000 or so uses, and Tyrium 1-in-25,000... probably less often than you lose them on your own!

Arrows will need to be exact matches to stack. This means name, quality and type of flights used. If they don't stack when you use COMBINE I'll try to give some feedback as to why.


So yeah, that is my current plan. Please let me know what you think. I'm hoping to release the new bow making part of shaping, then finish working on arrows and other craftables while people break stuff with that :P

There's a number of systems I need to update (all the critters, each of the material types, add the templates, messaging, etc), and I've been somewhat distracted with PvP discussions this month, so arrows are probably 3 weeks or so away.

Thanks!

---

"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes

please make arrows enchantable (also ignite-able)

In the scope of ammo, what does durability mean? I'm hoping more "you'll have to repair your ammo" vs "ammo breaks", mainly because I'm concerned about the idea of having quest-material ammo outright break.

---

Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>>Probability of breaking

Ah, missed that line.

Ick. Definitely not a fan of that, unless you can recover the arrowheads after the fact to rebuild the same arrow (but even then quest-quality material woods would be pretty dumb to use on these then)

Also obviously concerned about having my sling ammo now break when this gets rolled out further. Having perma breakage for senci sling ammo sounds terrible to me, mainly because once again it's not a commonly available/accessible material.

---

Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

If the lion's share of what makes an arrow good comes from the arrowhead, I'd be partial to something like:

1) You fire an arrow and it becomes "a super-rare-material-headed arrow with a broken shaft"
2) You need to use tech X to harvest the arrowhead from the shaft
3) You then need to just make a new shaft/flights/etc to attach it again

I don't know how this would necessarily translate to non arrow/bolt ammo, but at least it means you can't stop acknowledging the creation system past your single arrow, and if shafts are essentially as inconsequential as what you use for padding in armor (aka: you don't need super ultra rare shafts at any time)

---

Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>>I actually like the perma-breakage for that reason. I can see how this doesn't appeal to people wanting to use quest/fest materials for ammo, but some rare materials leaving the system isn't a bad thing at this point.

I agree with this being a good draw for kertig and all the minable rare metals, we need a good sink to remove some of it from circulation and increase it's rarity, imo. Double edged sword in the whole spectrum of tyrium and non minable materials, though. There simply isn't the supply to justify using these for arrows, if this is the system as it stands. That being said, I'd still struggle, personally, to get a half dozen or so made just to have the option (I'll just be too scared to actually use them).

I will add that I really dislike the random component to them breaking. I can see myself making an arrow with some ultra-rare materials then getting that random roll to break on the first or second time I use it. It's the kind of luck I have.

>>I will add that I really dislike the random component to them breaking. I can see myself making an arrow with some ultra-rare materials then getting that random roll to break on the first or second time I use it. It's the kind of luck I have.

Except that you will be making 5 at a time. So you will lose one and still have four left. With a 1 in 10,000 chance of breaking, you are going to have some ultra-rare arrows for at least a long time.


Abison/Rystien

I think its fine, considering how often people loose arrows. And this allowing for a complete skip on having to do repairs to them is an overall win.

---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS

---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.

Okay, one thing I think that people are going to have to get use to is that arrows are not everything. Bows are going to matter much more, if not at least half. You can have an ultra rare bow with average arrows and have a decent range attacked. Its going to be a combo things, so ultra rare arrows are going to be best, but its going to be a bigger range and not so bad if you don't have the ultra rate arrows.

Abison/Rystien

>>I agree with you in that it is annoying to need a continuous supply of some rare material to upkeep an item. I believe we as players are going to have to come to a compromise though when it comes to a rare material sink, and I think this is an easy one to compromise on. Players have become accustomed to losing ammo, even when we spend 5-10 plat per arrow\quad, so it seems only natural to carry that over into new ammo.

TBH, I feel like gear damage matters too little these days, and I'd love to see needing to repair stuff (and durability as a whole) meaning a lot more. It's just the perma-breakage I'm not a fan of.

That said, I really am interested in having arrow/bolt shafts (and whatever for sling ammo) breaking so you'd need to gather up the arrow/bolt heads and have them rebuilt into full arrows/bolts.

>>I too, will never use a material that I spent RL money to attain for ammo because it would feel like I wasted it when it finally broke, but I wouldn't think twice to pound some arrowheads from some kertig or other rare mat that is attainable in game without paying cash.

Same here, really. If anything, I expect mostly high steel and/or whatever high end bone stuff is easily obtainable to fill the market.

---

Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>>I feel like this would just be a major PITA for everyone and take far too long to code up properly... again, storing the appropriate stats is not possible. Once an arrow is made the system loses all knowledge of what materials were used in its creation.

Ick, good point. Darn.

---

Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

My hope is that volatile materials and enchanting makes this a reality. It is too hard to disrupt historical systems (weapons, armor, containers, perma-magic devices). So instead I'll come up with new places for folks to sink mats.

---

"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes

<<I actually like the perma-breakage for that reason. I can see how this doesn't appeal to people wanting to use quest/fest materials for ammo, but some rare materials leaving the system isn't a bad thing at this point.>>

I honestly don't care about the breakage concept. It seems pretty low odds, and I already deal with regularly losing arrows. It's not like you wouldn't make senci arrows because you're scared to lose them, so breaking them isn't really much of a difference at such low odds. I guess it will also matter on how much material it costs to make arrows, which will affect how available things are. There's quite a bit of material floating around.

But in the spirit of figuring out a solution to appeal to people. Is it not possible to just have an arrow be converted into a "broken X arrow." Basically a stacking, non-ammo item that stores all the stats of the arrow. And when some repair is made to them, they are switched back to a stack of usable arrows again.



~Van

I think the break rate is more than reasonable.

Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur

<<The breakage chance compounded with the regular loss of arrows by hunting is not acceptable. >>

At 1 in 25000 shots, I might break like 20 arrows in the next 5 years of playing. To be honest, I think the infinite compounding saturation of the so called "precious metals" in DR is a lot more of a problem than a few arrows occasionally breaking.

If the thought of a rare breakage is something that would bend peoples to the edge of quitting, then I'd say those people shouldn't use the material for arrows then. It's not exactly required to have the best arrows ever. It's just a nice asset, that comes with a very small risk. Most of the time I carry 2 sets of arrows. One for common usage and frequent, general shooting. And another set for that extra edge when I need it. This helps minimize the loss of expensive arrows, for me at least.

Although, I really don't see why a "damaged arrow" idea couldn't totally be conceived though. I think ultimately this would be the median that would suffice for everyone's concerns and positions.



~Van

Okay, went through and test most. I could add all ingredients that I tested(catalyst, handle, hilt, etc). Just didn't do long and short pole. Going to wait for arrows though, and then I'll go back and test all over again.

Abison/Rystien

Hi Kodius,

Was there ever an update to this? Are there any further plans for Blunt-tipped arrows? I've search Elanthipedia and can't find anything.

Cheers!
~ben

>>Howdy folks. Ok, so this is my plan for arrows....

>>Raw resource -> Refining -> 5 Arrowhead
>>Lumber -> Refining -> 5 Shafts
>>Buy straight, spiral or flu-flu flights from the store for now. Someday make your own.
>>
>>Arrowhead + Shafts + Flights = Stack of 5 arrows. In general the arrowhead and shaft making will just 1 or 2 actions. Making the arrows will be a process about as long as making a toy bow.
>>
>>Different types of arrowheads will be craftable from Metal, Bone Teeth, Bone Talons and Stone.
>>
>>- Metal-headed arrows will be equivalent to today's basilisk arrows, with Tyrium-quality coming in a bit above. I'm planning on having basic arrowheads, broadheads, nbodkins, swallow-tails and blunt heads, each with stats re->>assigned appropriately. Metal arrows will feature higher durability to compensate for being a bit less damaging. Rare templates will allow access to reduced-durability metal arrows with higher stats and cool sounding names.
>>
>>- Stone-headed arrows made from rare stone materials will be better than today's basilisk arrows with less durability. These will have an added impact component.
>>
>>- Bone teeth and claw arrows made from rare materials will be better than today's basilisk arrows with comparable durability. These will have added slice or puncture components.
>>
>>
>>
>>Templates in the book will be something like this -
>>
>>Basic Arrow = Arrowhead + Shaft + Flights
>>Broadhead Arrow = Broadhead + Shaft + Flights
>>Leadhead Arrow = Leadhead + Shaft + Flights
>>Blunthead Arrow = Blunthead + Shaft + Flights
>>
>>Stone Arrow = Stone Arrowhead + Shaft + Flights
>>
>>Basilisk Arrow = Refined Basilisk tooth + Shaft + Flights
>>Sharktooth Arrow = Refined Shark tooth + Shaft + Flights
>>Warklin Arrow = Refined Warklin claw + Shaft + Flights
>>Merrow Arrow = Refined Merrow claw + Shaft + Flights
>>Peccary Arrow = Refined Peccary tusk + Shaft + Flights
>>
>>and so on as we think of new things to add...
>>
>>Exotic Arrow = Refined exotic animal part + Shafts + Flights
>>
>>The type of animal will determine the stat assignment. There won't really be a "rarity" to the animal parts themselves, but you may occasionally come across a rare critter that fits the exotic arrow requirements and gives >>enhanced stats.
>>
>>I wanted this approach vs a "critter" arrow, because it lets us have more tiers of arrows to support work orders. More work for me setting it all up, but it stops folks from guessing "can this be used for an arrow?".
>>
>>"Flights will come in 3 kinds Straight, Spiral and Flu-flu. Straight will give no bonuses. Flu-flu will give bonus damage at melee and reduced damage at missile. Spiral will give increased chance of lodging 1-level deeper in >>exchange for a 20% chance of +1 second load time.
>>
>>Now, a big problem I have is the game engine does not allow me to store practically anything on the arrows themselves... this is to make stacking possible and keep the memory requirements sane. So...
>>
>>- Arrows will have all the "Creation" info on them until combined/broken. So you'll be able to analyze or turn them in for work orders until you've manipulated them.
>>- Arrows will store the type of flights used. You can appraise them to figure this out - it isn't possible to modify their name based on flights used.
>>- Arrows will have a chance to break on hit. This will be extremely low for even the weakest arrows, but it is much easier on everyone than tracking and forcing you to repair your arrows. Kertig arrows will generally break 1-in->>10,000 or so uses, and Tyrium 1-in-25,000... probably less often than you lose them on your own!
>>
>>Arrows will need to be exact matches to stack. This means name, quality and type of flights used. If they don't stack when you use COMBINE I'll try to give some feedback as to why.
>>
>>
>>So yeah, that is my current plan. Please let me know what you think. I'm hoping to release the new bow making part of shaping, then finish working on arrows and other craftables while people break stuff with that :P

>>There's a number of systems I need to update (all the critters, each of the material types, add the templates, messaging, etc), and I've been somewhat distracted with PvP discussions this month, so arrows are probably 3 weeks or >>so away.

>>Thanks!