I've been looking for you and Imp but we must not be on at the same times. I've set out an alert for you both so hopefully someone can find you. Thanks! Rinae

Rinae,

If can give me a general idea of time, I can make it a point to be around most likely.

I fluctuate through different characters through out the night.

Best bet to catch Brablo is before 9 eastern, but can be around later if have some sort of notice.

Brabs

---

Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.

"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"


Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss

---

[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"

Alterations typically involve changing only the TAP, LOOK, and READ descriptions on an item.

For your idea, you are more likely to see that as some kind of new item. As far as submitting the idea, I'm not certain where the appropriate place would be.

Arcelebor

---

Combat Combos http://www.angelfire.com/dragon/steelflash/drealms/weapons.html
Combat Quick-Reference http://dr.theflightline.net/combat.htm

Well shows you once again what I know. There'd definately have to be some sort of process though for making it change from 6 items to 1, some kind of intervention.

Something to hold all the medals and pins some characters get would be great.

>As far as adding items into items and making them one item, there are limitations on the amount of text any one item can manage, and unless the only thing that showed was the TAP... there's not currently any really satisfying way to make items disappear and still have their text remain...

What if an alterer sold items such as a gem case, a display case, whatever, several cases named in ways appropriate for holding different item types. These would not be containers. On their own, they would not hold anything or open/close. You'd just have "a case" of some kind in your hand.

The alterer would take any items from you that you wanted displayed in this case, as well as the case that you've just purchased from him. Lets use the example of your rare gem collection:

- The case might be "a polished cherrywood gem case." When you look at it you would see "The polished cherrywood gem case is holding nothing."

- You might have "a pretty rock, a shiny rock, a really expensive rock, an even more expensive rock, and a diamond shaped like Iocanthe", all of which you want in this case.

The alterer would take your gems, scrapping any look they might have individually and using only the TAPs, and copy them over to the look of the gem case. You'd be left with:

TAP: a polished cherrywood gem case
LOOK: The polished cherrywood gem case is holding a pretty rock, a shiny rock, a really expensive rock, an even more expensive rock, and a diamond shaped like Iocanthe.

Of course, the items could not be removed or manipulated anymore, since essentially they no longer exist. If you wanted to add more items to the case, you could track down the same alterer again to add to the LOOK. There would need to be a limit to how many items you could list in the LOOK, and you lose your pretty gems, but you have a nifty piece of fluff that you can put on your table in your home.

Would this work, or am I way out there? <g>


~Vien De'Lionne of the Monks, a Prydaen.

>> What if an alterer sold items such as a gem case, a display case, whatever, several cases named in ways appropriate for holding different item types. These would not be containers. On their own, they would not hold anything or open/close. You'd just have "a case" of some kind in your hand.


Bah! You stole the idea I had before this one that I didn't tell anybody about. hee

However, we were told we'd be able to have multiroom houses in DR2 since everything's getting expanded. Is this still the case Iocanthe-me-love?


Mytherceria, Stylebunny Extraordinaire.

Okay, I feel silly but I picked up an LTB scroll awhile back. My first alteration submission was rejected, so I need to change my scroll. However, I'll be darned if I can recall the verbage that allowed me to see how to manipulate the scroll? All of the usuals don't work: LOOK, APPRAISE, READ< GLANCE, etc. The portal to the caves isn't currently open, and even if it was, not sure I could get back into the first year tent to read the sign again.

Anyone know?

Mrena

Just wondering how long, on average, it takes to go from a scroll to actually having the alteration done? Not trying to start a fight or anything just curious.


Xavain

I think there's currently a substantial backlog, though.

Arcelebor

---

"Back off, man. I'm a scientist."

Once you write out your request, a GM will claim it to work on it. Depending on what the item is, what all you've requested, and anything that may need to consulted with another GM on, the length of time varies.

If for some reason you just wanted to change "some leather pants" into "some blue leather pants", chances are you'll get it rather quickly. Conversely, if you want them to become "some leather pants with glowing sigils of doom surrounded by rabid death squirrels", well...that particular one would get shot down pretty quickly--but in general we'd check with a few folks to see if it could be done.

Once you've written out the request, when a GM works on it you should see a message when you log in. Can always read the scroll for information on it. :)

Hope this helps!

AGM Zadraes
Premium/Platinum Assistant

(cross-posting this from the Events folders since I know a lot of similar questions come up in relation to LTBs--GMR)


Alterations are one of those opportunities that players have to define a bit of who their characters are, where they come from, what they believe in. As such, they are agonized over, coveted, and are, in my opinion, as important to personal character development as the systems and guilds that each character participates in. Perhaps this is why they generate so much debate, discussion, and anticipation. I have often responded to questions regarding what is and is not ok to alter, the processes and procedures, both here and in game, and have read many posts from fellow players who have offered their own experiences and recommendations. Over the last weeks, while participating in Excursion alterations, LTBs, and general IG altering, I've realized that there are a lot of questions still unanswered for people, and a lot of people still approaching their first alterations (sometimes after many years!) with great trepidation and confusion. Some alterers do one thing, some do another...yes you can alter that, no you can't, well sometimes maybe, but not now...

What follows is some information, and answers to some of the most common questions I've encountered in recent weeks. I hope that it's helpful to you in the future.

GM Reexa

Q: "I really suck at this alteration thing."
A: Ok so I know that first one isn't really a question, but it's by far the most common comment I receive. Though I've seen posts from a handful of folks who really pride themselves on being able to write alterations, the vast majority of players seem to believe that they are no good at it at all. Though I address this individually when I alter, I'll say it broadly now:

There is no such thing as being bad at designing an alteration. Ever.

Those of you who have had alterations rejected or revised may be rolling your eyes at that statement, but I do mean it. As I mentioned earlier, alterations in a text based world help define who your character is. Alterations are, in essence, your imagination, and a bit of your character's soul. As such, no alteration idea is ever a bad one. Execution of that idea, however, is where the problem sometimes lies.

What I believe is that a lot of people have trouble translating their vision into words, and this is the part that people struggle with. Part of the confusion comes from understanding what is and isn't allowable by game and system standards (some of which I hope to clear up momentarily), and part of it just comes from not having strong writing skills. That does NOT mean your idea is bad, so if that thought pops into your head, you chase it right on out again. While the wording of it may not be appropriate for the game environment, that doesn't mean that the idea can't be conveyed with some word tweaking.

Q: "Can I get my cambrinth {whatever} altered?"
A: This gets lumped into the "Some alterers do one thing, some do another...yes you can alter that, no you can't, well sometimes maybe, but not now..." category. Why? Cambrinth is a tricky material to work with in terms of altering. Doing it incorrectly can lead to the cambrinth ceasing to function altogether, for example. Because of this, altering cambrinth requires some guidance from the Magic Team, and is generally done in only some circumstances and with special permission. This is why, for example, cambrinth is not alterable via the LTB scroll system, and why, when you do find an alterer who will do it, the cost of such an alteration can be very high.

Some important things to remember about altering cambrinth if you do have an opportunity and desire to do so:
1) The mana amount cannot be changed.
2) The "base item" cannot be changed without special permission from the Magic Team, which is why (if you are having a "live" alteration session), the alterer will tell you no when you want to change an armband to a tailband. This criteria may change at a future date, but has not currently and still applies.
3) Cambrinth is a mineral. As such, consider the size of the item you are having done and compare it to the design. There is no way even the most skilled artisan is going to be able to put a scaled replica of the Crossing on a cambrinth ring. Minerals aren't that flexible.

Q: "I keep hearing alterers talk about the "base item". What does that mean?"
A: Every item that exists in game--from the chairs you sit in at the local tavern, to the ring on your finger, to the apple you feed to your donkey--is based off of a template for that item type. Many (most) of these items have certain qualities that are inherent to that item type. These qualities include: value (how much it appraises /sells for), size (can it fit in a pouch/backpack/sheath?), volume (how much can it hold?), strength (how much damage can it take/deliver before it's destroyed?), content (if it is magical, or contains metal)...there are many more, but you get the idea. In addition, there are a number of items that have properties specific to that particular item (what we, as players, commonly call "verby" items). These templates are what we use to build off of, and are what we refer to as "base items." Changing the base item essentially requires that the ENTIRE item be changed, template included. Doing this then requires levels of QC that are not available during a typical alteration process, and often requires approvals so that (for example) a gem pouch does not end up holding what a journeypack can. This is why, when getting an alteration, you'll typically be told no if you want to change a haversack to a backpack, or vice versa. Since those two items have different properties, requests of this type are usually turned down. We also do this to ensure that your nifty, verby bodice doesn't lose its verbs by changing the bodice to a vest.

As with so many things, there are exceptions to the above rules from time to time. We have had, for example, a specialized merchant who can "stretch" bags for a fee, or as many of the older players may be aware, periodic merchants who can balance or temper weapons. In general though, be prepared that such requests will be turned down, and have an alternate idea in mind.

Q: "Can I get a tattoo?"
A: Yes, tattoos can be altered. HOWEVER (and yes I'm stressing that word on purpose), tattoo alterations are even more complicated than cambrinth alterations, and require very specific training on the GM side in order to do them. Currently, there are only a couple of GMs that can do tattoos, and for now, tattoo alterations and training are on hold pending some revisions in the training process. As such, tattoo alterations will likely continue to be on the rare side, and not something available through scroll systems such as the LTBs or Excursions.

Q: "What do I need to know about getting my weapon/armor/shield altered?"
A: First, keep in mind what I mentioned about "base items." This applies to all items but especially to weapons/armor/shields, and containers, since their properties are what tell the item how to function. Therefore, a broadsword cannot become a scimitar, "leathers"cannot become "leather armor", and so on.

Second, READs cannot be added to weapons/armor/shields. If you have a phrase you want to add to your item, consider incorporating it into the LOOK. If you're not sure how to do that, let the alterer help you...that's what we're here for.

Third, balance/tempering are done rarely and by highly specialized merchants only.

Fourth, bonded or forged weapons CAN be altered. If you are doing it through the scroll system (LTB or other), you will need to be online with the alterer at the time that the alteration is completed because there is an extra step the GM has to do in order to make sure everything "sets" correctly with your alteration. If you know for certain that your item is forged or bonded at the time you submit your alteration request, it's helpful to mention that in advance...most of the time we can tell, but sometimes we miss it and then say "doh!" when the scroll system doesn't work as you try to WRITE ACCEPT on the scroll (if you've ever had that happen before, now you know why). If you aren't certain, but you try and WRITE ACCEPT and get some kind of message about needing to empty your carving knife first, now you know why...it means we need to help you "live" in order to get the scroll through. All you need do if this happens is ASSIST, or WRITE REPLY on your scroll to let your alterer know the scroll is yelling at you to empty your item, and we'll take care of it.

Lastly, if your forged item has a maker's mark on it, that maker's mark MUST remain in the LOOK of your alteration request. If you don't add it in, we will automatically. It's a measure of respect toward the person who created that item, and leaving it in the LOOK is not negotiable.

Q: "What other tips can you give me for altering?"
A: I have numerous recommendations, and will likely think of more as soon as I hit "post." In addition, your fellow players likely have as many (if not more) than I do. However, here are 7 immediate thoughts that come to mind:

1) Be prepared with your materials. The rare materials listing put out by the Wedding Team is a good place to start (the list can be found on GM Tvini's Web site at http://www.tvini.com/), and a good baseline to follow. However, you should be aware that individual alterers may have their own criteria regarding what they will and will not provide. Therefore, if you wish to request that the material of your gown be changed from a simple fabric (cotton, basic silk, satin) to something more unique (nightsilk, spidersilk, watersilk), be prepared to provide that material even if you have not needed to in the past. Likewise with gems, or some woods.

2) Be prepared to be flexible with your design. There are some phrases, words, or word placements that we (as GMs) need to adjust according to our alteration rules. For example, commas cannot be added to TAPs, which means that we may ask you to drop a word or two from an adjective heavy TAP request. Why? Well let's say you want "a brilliant blue super-absorbent flexible spongy hair barrette with cascading green curly beaded ribbons." Because of all the descriptors, the correct way of writing such would look something like:

"a brilliant blue, super-absorbent, flexible, spongy hair barrette with cascading green, curly, beaded ribbons."

Which means that if you LOOKED at the person wearing it, you would see:

You see GM Reexa

She is wearing black trousers, a white blouse, a brilliant blue, super-absorbent, flexible, spongy hair barrette with cascading green, curly, beaded ribbons, and some boots.

According to this, I'm wearing trousers, boots, a blouse, a blue, a super absorbent, a flexible, a spongy hair barrette, a curly...you see the problem? An alterer can help you whittle down your descriptions so that you say what you want to, with less words.

3) Along the lines of the above comes a suggestion, not a necessity, but in my opinion it's an important thought to keep in mind. We're in a text-based world, and rely on words to convey the images since graphics are absent. With that in mind: "show, don't tell." Or, to coin a phrase from school: "active versus passive voice."

Let me note here that passive voice is NOT incorrect by any means, and there are many people that prefer passive voice to active voice. It's a bit of a personal fingernail-on-chalkboard for me, so if I see it I'll usually try and talk you out of it, but it's NOT incorrect. However, the difference is that passive voice tends to "list" things, while active voice tends to "paint a picture". Active voice isn't an easy way to write for a lot of people, but if it's something you can get a handle on, you may find it more pleasant to read through. And, as a bonus, you may find that using active voice trims words out of the description, making it more concise.

4) Partnered with number 3, consider the "flow" of your alteration. I know many players (and GMs!) who will do the double log-in trick so they can get their inventory "arranged" correctly, flowing from head to toe in logical sequence. Your alteration should do the same. There are many options when considering the flow of an item: back to front, front to back, top to bottom. Broad to detailed, or vice versa. It doesn't matter which direction you choose, but choose one and go with it. Consider the following:

Option 1: The cloak features a sequined red fox across the back, tail curled and brushing the hem. A ruby clasp framed in gold closes the garment, while red-tipped fox fur lines the hood. Tiny rubies stitched along the hem complement the clasp, and brush the sequined tail. The body of the cloak is lined with snowbeast fur.

Option 2: The cloak features a sequined red fox across the back, tail curled and brushing the hem. Red-tipped fox fur lines the hood, blending into the snowbeast fur that lines the body of the cloak. A ruby clasp framed in gold closes the garment, complementing the tiny rubies stitched alond the hem.

Both options present the same features, but how does your eye flow in your imagination?

Option 1: Back of cloak on the outside, front of the cloak, inside top of the cloak, bottom outside of the cloak to the bottom of the back of the outside of the cloak, inside body of the cloak.

Option 2: Back of the cloak, inside of the cloak, front of the cloak, bottom of the cloak.

The eye of your imagination follows a more logical progression with Option 2, making you more inclined to have a full visual picture of the cloak when you are done reading. And, incidentally, that was made up on the fly so anyone is welcome to steal it if they like it, provided you can provide the materials if requested. ;)

5) Racial references should be capitalized; thus "dwarven chain" should be "Dwarven chain". Also, if you opt to create an item with some racial references, be prepared that the alterer may need to obtain approval from the appropriate "Race Champion" before your alteration can proceed; this can add time to your alteration completion.

6) "Title" descriptors that identify an item as belonging to or designed for a specific person or group of people are very sketchy, and may be turned down unless there is precedence in game for that item. For example, there are items in game with the labels of "hunter's", "stalker's, "sniper's", etc. However, these items have specific properties associated with them that allow these labels. If your item did not have this label originally, it cannot be added to your item because your item will not match the template of those original "base items" (there's that phrase again!) Likewise, using a guild title as an identifier (marshall's, sorrower's, trailmaster's) will likely be rejected unless the alterer received permission from the respective Guild Team. For anything else, consider what it is about your alteration that identifies the item as being such. You could CALL anything an "herbalist's" pack, but if all you see when you look at it is that it's brown and has a stain on it, there isn't anything about it that tells you it's specifically for an herbalist. A stained pack with embroidered healing herbs, many pockets, and a strap to hold and protect glassware...with that, you're getting somewhere.

7) "Paladin Guild vs. Paladin vs. paladin: When to capitalize and when not to.": Our guilds are like our RL professions. If you keep this in mind when designing your alteration, you can apply a modern analogy to your designing strategy:

Jane is a doctor. She is Doctor Jane. She works at the hospital. She works at Memorial General Hospital.

Jane is a paladin. She is Paladin Jane. She is a member of the paladins. She is a member of the Paladin Guild.
******************************************************************

I'm certain that you'll have other tips, and that I'll think of more to add as they occur to me. In the meantime, please feel free to ask for clarification if any of this seems confusing!

That is the MOST useful post I've ever seen a GM make regarding alterations. Thankyou very much! Think you could get that posted somewhere permanent? Like on the website somewhere or in game with the premie alteration guidelines?


Vien De'Lionne

Wow, Reexa! That was above and beyond, and very thoughtful and kind of you to post. Big kudos =)

Currently, there are only a couple of GMs that can do tattoos, and for now, tattoo alterations and training are on hold pending some revisions in the training process.


I have an alteration from Osera does this mean I'm out of luck or should I just keep holding and see if he comes around. Maybe we can discuss other options. Atalas.

Niamara gives Reexa some more crackers.

That being said, I noticed in your post something about a dual log to get things in order. This is the first I've heard of this and would love for my inventory to flow head to toe! What do I do to get this?


Niamara

wondering if anyone knows anything about this I have an alteration voucher for Lailoni, and I've noticed she tends to come to the sea caves, now I've had an alteration done in the past 4 months in the seacaves do I still have to wait to redeem this voucher or does the voucher nix that waiting rule and the next time she's around I can get into the tent to have my alteration done reguardless if the waiting period is up or not.

Thanks

Kristen

This probably won't happen since "shifting is illegal" but how about an alterer who could make specific changes to your appearance? Like "a single white streak above her left eye" in the character's hair color. Or "gold-flecked emerald eyes."

Bard Lydaiva's (and others) player

An alterer did come around once to dye hair.

There was a huge hue and cry on the boards about how she was usurping the empath's abilities.

Personally, I'd like to see more feature alterations like they have over in GemStone.


A dark brown Zoluren marnet squeaks with excitement as it pursues a small insect across the surface of the water. A final lunge brings the hapless creature into the marnet's mouth where it is rapidly consumed.