Vessel of Salvation is a Basic Utility spell in the Sacrifice spellbook. It produces a sphere of light which can hold Vitality. The Paladin can sacrifice Vitality onto the sphere by RUBing it. Anyone can then TOUCH the sphere to receive the sacrifice and gain a Vitality boost. There is a substantial penalty to the Paladin himself trying to take back his sacrifice, but it works in a pinch.
Please try it out and let me know what you think, especially about the messaging. I'm not totally happy with the amount of feedback it gives at the moment, but it's solid enough to get some testing done.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
DR-ARMIFER
ILLIENA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 08:49 PM CST
Some quick testing, log below. There's something wrong with the focus messaging.
>cast
You gesture.
A crimson sphere appears between your hands and floats a few feet above the ground. As you withdraw your arms, flares of light begin to erupt from its surface.
>focus sphere
You focus your magical senses on a sphere.
You sense a pattern of Holy magic bound into the form of a sacrifical vessel.
The simple vessel is designed to contain offerings of life force.
The vessel lies dormant and unused.
which you could take with a simple touch.
You sense the vessel will last for about nine roisaen.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
>cast
You gesture.
A crimson sphere appears between your hands and floats a few feet above the ground. As you withdraw your arms, flares of light begin to erupt from its surface.
>focus sphere
You focus your magical senses on a sphere.
You sense a pattern of Holy magic bound into the form of a sacrifical vessel.
The simple vessel is designed to contain offerings of life force.
The vessel lies dormant and unused.
which you could take with a simple touch.
You sense the vessel will last for about nine roisaen.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 08:57 PM CST
>focus sphere
You focus your magical senses on a sphere.
You sense a pattern of Holy magic bound into the form of a sacrifical vessel.
The simple vessel is designed to contain offerings of life force.
The vessel lies dormant and unused.
You could take the offering with a simple touch.
You sense the vessel will last for about nine roisaen.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
Prolly should just look like that.
You focus your magical senses on a sphere.
You sense a pattern of Holy magic bound into the form of a sacrifical vessel.
The simple vessel is designed to contain offerings of life force.
The vessel lies dormant and unused.
You could take the offering with a simple touch.
You sense the vessel will last for about nine roisaen.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
Prolly should just look like that.
DR-ARMIFER
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 09:00 PM CST
Focus messaging should be fixed, and cast messaging tweaked a bit.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
ILLIENA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 09:08 PM CST
There doesn't seem to be any third party messaging when the sphere is used. This was with my sphere:
Eltarera says, "There."
You say, "I didn't see anything."
You ask, "Did it work?"
Eltarera says, "Aye."
Eltarera nods.
Eltarera recites:
"You press a palm against the sphere. Life flows through your limbs and into your core, warm and strengthening."
Eltarera says, "There."
You say, "I didn't see anything."
You ask, "Did it work?"
Eltarera says, "Aye."
Eltarera nods.
Eltarera recites:
"You press a palm against the sphere. Life flows through your limbs and into your core, warm and strengthening."
ILLIENA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 09:19 PM CST
Oh, and apparently the sphere will continue even if its caster dies. I don't know if that's a bug, but I think it's neat.
ILLIENA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 09:30 PM CST
Here's a thing. Note the missing noun:
>charge sphere 10
You harness a small amount of energy, push it through the minimal resistance of and watch it dissipate harmlessly. Well, that was fun.
Roundtime: 4 sec.
>charge sphere 10
You harness a small amount of energy, push it through the minimal resistance of and watch it dissipate harmlessly. Well, that was fun.
Roundtime: 4 sec.
ILLIENA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 10:15 PM CST
I'm not sure I see the use of this spell. It's got a huge inefficiency for the caster healing themselves, meaning it's not a great way to bank vitality for later. And group hunting isn't really a thing in DR. How do you see it being used?
EDERICK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 10:18 PM CST
The penalty does seem very harsh, any chance to have it auto restore a chunk of vitality to the paladin should the paladin fall into the You feel like you are dying state?
2DUMBARSE
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 10:33 PM CST
> I'm not sure I see the use of this spell
Haven't tried it yet but I really like this spell for triage even if I can't use it for personal emergency situations.
Haven't tried it yet but I really like this spell for triage even if I can't use it for personal emergency situations.
DR-ARMIFER
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 10:37 PM CST
The two uses I saw for the spell are.
1) Triage.
2) A good spammable Utility spell for training.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
1) Triage.
2) A good spammable Utility spell for training.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
EDERICK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 10:40 PM CST
If its supposed to be of bonus to others at our own expense, can it be tied into the soul system to give a soul boost when someone else uses it in certain situations?
BEVERAGEK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/29/2012 10:49 PM CST
It'd be sweet if other people could put vitality into the sphere as well, maybe at a penalty to the vitality ratio? That way all able bodied adventurers in triage may help newly-departed persons get back on their feet by contributing a portion of their vitality to the sphere as well. After all there's only so much vitality a Paladin can contribute on his/her own.
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
ANOUSHKA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 12:24 AM CST
>The two uses I saw for the spell are.
>1) Triage.
>2) A good spammable Utility spell for training.
I'm disappointed to see this. The secondary use just makes me question why a spell is being created with seemingly little use aside from being spammable training. As it stands, I have trouble imagining why I would pick this spell unless it becomes nearly impossible to learn Utility in any other way.
>1) Triage.
>2) A good spammable Utility spell for training.
I'm disappointed to see this. The secondary use just makes me question why a spell is being created with seemingly little use aside from being spammable training. As it stands, I have trouble imagining why I would pick this spell unless it becomes nearly impossible to learn Utility in any other way.
REWYN
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 12:32 AM CST
>>I'm disappointed to see this. The secondary use just makes me question why a spell is being created with seemingly little use aside from being spammable training. As it stands, I have trouble imagining why I would pick this spell unless it becomes nearly impossible to learn Utility in any other way.
I have to agree. This really seems a bit too niche. In combat a paladin is going to be busy doing other things given how we are set up to be tanks with endurance to be acting as triage members as well. Outside of combat, it seems over specialized.
I think a the penalty for self healing should either be lessened, or should automatically kick in if the paladin goes beneath 40% health with a lessened penalty (but at full penalty before that).
I have to agree. This really seems a bit too niche. In combat a paladin is going to be busy doing other things given how we are set up to be tanks with endurance to be acting as triage members as well. Outside of combat, it seems over specialized.
I think a the penalty for self healing should either be lessened, or should automatically kick in if the paladin goes beneath 40% health with a lessened penalty (but at full penalty before that).
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 12:51 AM CST
Do higher mana levels lessen the penalty for a Paladin self-withdrawing?
2DUMBARSE
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:06 AM CST
I don't see a problem with spells being created with training in mind, especially with how much subject of training is raised in all sorts of spell threads. I would, however, see a problem with that being the only purpose of the spell. I think it has a great place in triage, though, and fits the guild well. I know it probably won't fit everyone's playstyle, but I also know there are times my paladin has wanted help with more in triage than a quick glyph or two and the occasional AS for an empath.
More info on the spell:
Tried a min prep (5 mana - 10 roisaen duration) cast and the sphere only absorbed about 60% of my paladin's vitality. Tried a 75 mana (33 roisaen duration) cast and it absorbed ~185% of my paladin's vitality, so mana definitely increases capacity and duration significantly. Others who touch the sphere take all vitality available but the paladin who casts the spell can take no more than 10%, it seems, of the vitality (s)he invested.
I definitely can't see any practical uses for solo hunting but I can see some less altruistic uses in sparring events where an empath is available to help with the vit drain. I'm guessing a capped cast will hold around 225% of my paladin's vitality at his unbuffed 60 stamina. Given how damage works in 3.0, access to a single 22% vit recharge might turn the tide.
More info on the spell:
Tried a min prep (5 mana - 10 roisaen duration) cast and the sphere only absorbed about 60% of my paladin's vitality. Tried a 75 mana (33 roisaen duration) cast and it absorbed ~185% of my paladin's vitality, so mana definitely increases capacity and duration significantly. Others who touch the sphere take all vitality available but the paladin who casts the spell can take no more than 10%, it seems, of the vitality (s)he invested.
I definitely can't see any practical uses for solo hunting but I can see some less altruistic uses in sparring events where an empath is available to help with the vit drain. I'm guessing a capped cast will hold around 225% of my paladin's vitality at his unbuffed 60 stamina. Given how damage works in 3.0, access to a single 22% vit recharge might turn the tide.
2DUMBARSE
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:19 AM CST
>Do higher mana levels lessen the penalty for a Paladin self-withdrawing?
As far as I can tell, it's a static 10% (the results suggested the same at min prep and higher preps). That would be nice, though. I also really liked the suggestion of having the penalty be less severe in the dying state. I do wish the self heal penalty were a little less severe, and don't think it would make the spell overpowered if it's within reason. After all, to get a 20% vit heal my paladin would have to invest an amount of vitality that would kill him twice over.
As far as I can tell, it's a static 10% (the results suggested the same at min prep and higher preps). That would be nice, though. I also really liked the suggestion of having the penalty be less severe in the dying state. I do wish the self heal penalty were a little less severe, and don't think it would make the spell overpowered if it's within reason. After all, to get a 20% vit heal my paladin would have to invest an amount of vitality that would kill him twice over.
GERSTEINJ2
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:21 AM CST
Bug platside: typo, slash after his.
2nd character perspective:
A crimson sphere appears between Smozhstalker's hands, suspended rigidly in space. As he withdraws his\
arms, flares of light erupt from its surface.
<<The real thing DR needs is to get out there to the kids who actually read books.>>
BEVERAGEK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:22 AM CST
Out of curiosity, can the orb be dispelled?
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
ILLIENA
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:22 AM CST
> Out of curiosity, can the orb be dispelled?
Niet.
Niet.
REWYN
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:26 AM CST
I'm having a hard time seeing when I would use the spell outside of triage, which seems VERY niche for a spell that is also meant to be a training tool.
Now if others could invest their vitality as well at some penalized ratio, and if the penalty for the paladin was lessened a little, then that would open up this spell to being a valuable group hunting tool. I'm very excited for a new spell, and I realize not every spell will be liked by everyone, but this seems like a very odd choice for us. It might see a little use during some invasions, or to help in pvp sparring matches, but its hard to imagine other instances I would want to use this. If someone is in danger of dying, then I would far prefer a spell which directly allows me infuse them with my vitality (ala 'Lay on Hands') without the middle man (especially helpful if they are stunned or 'dying').
To echo suggestions from others:
1) Others should be able to contribute health to the Orb (at a penalty)
2) And/Or: Penalty for Paladin self healing should be curved based off the Paladins remaining health.
Now if others could invest their vitality as well at some penalized ratio, and if the penalty for the paladin was lessened a little, then that would open up this spell to being a valuable group hunting tool. I'm very excited for a new spell, and I realize not every spell will be liked by everyone, but this seems like a very odd choice for us. It might see a little use during some invasions, or to help in pvp sparring matches, but its hard to imagine other instances I would want to use this. If someone is in danger of dying, then I would far prefer a spell which directly allows me infuse them with my vitality (ala 'Lay on Hands') without the middle man (especially helpful if they are stunned or 'dying').
To echo suggestions from others:
1) Others should be able to contribute health to the Orb (at a penalty)
2) And/Or: Penalty for Paladin self healing should be curved based off the Paladins remaining health.
ASHAMAN1
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 08:10 AM CST
Neat spell, could be handy if you're the type to help a youngan, can't count how many times I would have liked something like this in the past. Question - If I fill a big sucker up (near cap its holding something silly like 230% of my vit), and someone touches it, does it fill their vit and stop, or blow the whole charge no matter?
Thanks
Thanks
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 08:39 AM CST
The problem with raising the cap that's on paladins currently is more likely from a PvP perspective. It would be rather OP if you spent a good long amount of time whittling a paladins HP down, only to have them instantly restore 50% of their vitality. Maybe the spell will get tweaked around if its found that its to low. I think in 3.0 that 20% of a paladins total HP being instantly restored could be a pretty good benefit.
I do agree that the spell should probably have an auto save effect if the paladin falls below 10% total vitality though.
I do agree that the spell should probably have an auto save effect if the paladin falls below 10% total vitality though.
DR-ARMIFER
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 08:52 AM CST
I decreased the penalty on Paladins withdrawing from their own orb. It's still not a bank, but the withdrawal should at least be noticeable.
>>The problem with raising the cap that's on paladins currently is more likely from a PvP perspective. It would be rather OP if you spent a good long amount of time whittling a paladins HP down, only to have them instantly restore 50% of their vitality.
There's a really simple solution to thwart a Paladin trying to use a vessel in PvP.
>>Question - If I fill a big sucker up (near cap its holding something silly like 230% of my vit), and someone touches it, does it fill their vit and stop, or blow the whole charge no matter?
It fills you to the top and stops.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
>>The problem with raising the cap that's on paladins currently is more likely from a PvP perspective. It would be rather OP if you spent a good long amount of time whittling a paladins HP down, only to have them instantly restore 50% of their vitality.
There's a really simple solution to thwart a Paladin trying to use a vessel in PvP.
>>Question - If I fill a big sucker up (near cap its holding something silly like 230% of my vit), and someone touches it, does it fill their vit and stop, or blow the whole charge no matter?
It fills you to the top and stops.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 09:17 AM CST
<There's a really simple solution to thwart a Paladin trying to use a vessel in PvP.
Yeah, I guess there would be a pretty simple solution.
Yeah, I guess there would be a pretty simple solution.
BEVERAGEK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 09:25 AM CST
>>There's a really simple solution to thwart a Paladin trying to use a vessel in PvP.
Can't the people who are PvPing vs the Paladin just touch the Sphere themselves?
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
Can't the people who are PvPing vs the Paladin just touch the Sphere themselves?
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
MOCKERJB
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 09:27 AM CST
Find another kind of sphere and drop it in the room to screw up parsing?
BEVERAGEK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 09:31 AM CST
Drag the Paladin away so the orb dissipates once the Paladin is no longer in the room? (Not sure if that's possible)
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
2DUMBARSE
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 09:47 AM CST
>Drag the Paladin away so the orb dissipates once the Paladin is no longer in the room? (Not sure if that's possible)
It doesn't disappear when the paladin leaves. I think the obvious solution is the simple one you mentioned earlier. Anyone can touch the sphere, which makes it useless in a PvP match. That was clearly too obvious for me to see when posting. Ha!
It doesn't disappear when the paladin leaves. I think the obvious solution is the simple one you mentioned earlier. Anyone can touch the sphere, which makes it useless in a PvP match. That was clearly too obvious for me to see when posting. Ha!
BEVERAGEK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 09:54 AM CST
What happens when the Paladin guards the sphere, similar to guarding an item?
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
2DUMBARSE
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 10:42 AM CST
>What happens when the Paladin guards the sphere, similar to guarding an item?
R>guard sphere
Who do you want to guard?
And it looks like the vit return for the caster was bumped to around 1/3 of the investment. Only tested on a min prep sphere.
R>guard sphere
Who do you want to guard?
And it looks like the vit return for the caster was bumped to around 1/3 of the investment. Only tested on a min prep sphere.
VEE-REX
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 10:43 AM CST
Can you touch the sphere and have it work even if you're at 100% vitality? So say you're pounding some Paladin into the ground and they have the sphere up... it would suck if they could keep using it but you can't.
Individuals, families, countries, continents are destroyed at the heavy hand of Vinjince.
-GM Abasha
Individuals, families, countries, continents are destroyed at the heavy hand of Vinjince.
-GM Abasha
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 10:53 AM CST
<That would actually be a nice bonus for Liches... some sort of anti-fear thing. Regular Necromancers on the other hand are the scary type and fear death.
Yeah that's what I was thinking, though, I always thought that Necromancers would probably have a fear vs whatever spell or ability in some form of a disabler too when I saw the fear category. But alas
Yeah that's what I was thinking, though, I always thought that Necromancers would probably have a fear vs whatever spell or ability in some form of a disabler too when I saw the fear category. But alas
BEVERAGEK
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 11:10 AM CST
>>I always thought that Necromancers would probably have a fear vs whatever spell or ability in some form of a disabler too when I saw the fear category.
Slight derail, but the Fear and Power contests are supposed to be associated with physical fear/power attacks.
i.e. that monster is looking at me in a scary way to the point I want to flee.
This is in contrast to a spell which assaults a target's mind and projects scary images. (which is already a Necromancer spell I believe, in the form of Petrifying Visions)
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
Slight derail, but the Fear and Power contests are supposed to be associated with physical fear/power attacks.
i.e. that monster is looking at me in a scary way to the point I want to flee.
This is in contrast to a spell which assaults a target's mind and projects scary images. (which is already a Necromancer spell I believe, in the form of Petrifying Visions)
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 11:19 AM CST
<Slight derail, but the Fear and Power contests are supposed to be associated with physical fear/power attacks.
i.e. that monster is looking at me in a scary way to the point I want to flee.
This is in contrast to a spell which assaults a target's mind and projects scary images. (which is already a Necromancer spell I believe, in the form of Petrifying Visions)
Lich spell - Aura of Fear
I love necromancing up the paladin folder
i.e. that monster is looking at me in a scary way to the point I want to flee.
This is in contrast to a spell which assaults a target's mind and projects scary images. (which is already a Necromancer spell I believe, in the form of Petrifying Visions)
Lich spell - Aura of Fear
I love necromancing up the paladin folder
ENOTS
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 12:40 PM CST
>> If I fill a big sucker up (near cap its holding something silly like 230% of my vit), and someone touches it, does it fill their vit and stop, or blow the whole charge no matter?
If someone else touches that sphere, it gives only what the person touching it needs then just sticks around.
Sometimes the key to happiness is not assuming it is locked in the first place- Ziggy
A journey of a thousand SMILES begins with a single step- Ziggy
If someone else touches that sphere, it gives only what the person touching it needs then just sticks around.
Sometimes the key to happiness is not assuming it is locked in the first place- Ziggy
A journey of a thousand SMILES begins with a single step- Ziggy
REWYN
Re: New Spell: Vessel of Salvation
12/30/2012 01:56 PM CST
I appreciate the changes. I do also appreciate and like the spell, but cant say I would get it if I was a young paladin even to train utility, mostly because paladins spend a large portion of their time in combat and training this spell in combat would only serve to get you banged up pretty bad given how vitality and wounds work in 3.0. I'm not sure this should have been targeted as our intro utility training spell. As an older paladin I'll probably pick it up after I get my other spells.
