I've been an on again off again QS buff for a while. I tend to use my old 16 kronar carved cane since it's convenient to store it in my thigh quiver. But I've sometimes wondered if I would be better off using my heavier poker-scorched uguns nuja with great impact. I finally got around to testing them to see what performance difference there might be.
I didn't target the hits. I just went for a random combat sample over 104 hits to see if the two weapons would track each other or not. Just a typical hunt. My crash test dummies were germish'din, which are unarmored and a challenge for my QS ranks. My routine was dodge feint draw slice thrust sweep.
Quarter Staff: 245 51.66%
Strength : 50
Agility : 80
A gnarled wooden cane is a quarter staff melee-ranged weapon.
You are certain that it could do:
no puncture damage
no slice damage
heavy impact damage
You are certain that the cane is fairly balanced and is fairly suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength.
You are certain that the wooden cane is of average strength, and is in pristine condition.
You are certain that the wooden cane weighs exactly 18 stones.
You are certain that the wooden cane is worth exactly 16 kronars.
Roundtime: 8 seconds.
A poker-scorched uguns nuja is a quarter staff pole-ranged weapon.
You are certain that it could do:
no puncture damage
no slice damage
great impact damage
You are certain that the nuja is fairly balanced and is fairly suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength.
You are certain that the uguns nuja is of average strength, and is in pristine condition.
You are certain that the uguns nuja weighs exactly 60 stones.
You are certain that the uguns nuja is worth exactly 4875 kronars.
Roundtime: 8 seconds.
You are certain that the wooden cane is about as strong as the uguns nuja.
You are certain that the wooden cane is somewhat more balanced than the uguns nuja.
You are certain that the wooden cane is about as suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength as the uguns nuja.
You are certain that the wooden cane does about as much puncture damage as the uguns nuja.
You are certain that the wooden cane does about as much slice damage as the uguns nuja.
You are certain that the wooden cane does somewhat less impact damage than the uguns nuja.
You are certain that the wooden cane weighs a lot less than the uguns nuja.
[Roundtime: 8 seconds]
CANE - 104 hits/4 kills
40 harmless etc
10 light
30 good
16 solid
4 hard
1 heavy
3 strong
UGUNS NUJA - 104 hits/4 kills
45 harmless etc
7 light
34 good
8 solid
4 hard
1 very heavy
5 strong
It was just a quick test. Make of it what you will. Since the results seem so close I didn't bother to multiply the number of each hit type times it's damage multiplier to come up with a single weapon number like I did in the HX tests.
Since I don't really see a lot of difference here, I'll probably stick with my gnarled wooden cane for now. After the combat rewrite things might be different.
Kaxis
Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you thrust a peach knife at a sky giant. A sky giant fails to dodge, moving directly into the blow.
URUTU
JMF90
Re: QS Test
09/12/2010 11:22 AM CDT
I think the clear winner for your situation is the cane. You're struggling to land hits to begin with, so the superior balance of the cane trumps the extra damage of the nuja. Considering ease of storage, I'd definitely stick with the cane.
>describe boar
It's a boar. It doesn't like you.
>describe boar
It's a boar. It doesn't like you.
SPECIALSAUCES
Re: QS Test
09/12/2010 01:49 PM CDT
Sell the cane to me use the other one. Everyone wins.
I will continue to get blunter on this topic until people get the message or my posts contain enough profanity to be removed. - Armifer
I will continue to get blunter on this topic until people get the message or my posts contain enough profanity to be removed. - Armifer
YAMCER
Re: QS Test
09/12/2010 02:05 PM CDT
<<My routine was dodge feint draw slice thrust sweep.>>
question: why do you stop your combo at sweep and not continue to chop -> jab-> dodge?
I've actually started using my cambrinth staff more than my 18 kronar cane.
A steel-capped ironwood quarter staff carved with multiple cambrinth-inlaid symbols is a quarter staff pole-ranged weapon.
You are certain that it could do:
no puncture damage
no slice damage
great impact damage
You are certain that the staff is fairly balanced and is fairly suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is of average strength, and is in pristine condition.
The ironwood staff is made with metal.
You wonder if the ironwood staff might weigh several tens of stones.
An ebon-hued cane is a quarter staff melee-ranged weapon.
You are certain that it could do:
no puncture damage
no slice damage
heavy impact damage
You are certain that the cane is fairly balanced and is fairly suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength.
You are certain that the ebon-hued cane is of average strength, and is in pristine condition.
You guess that the ebon-hued cane probably weighs a few tens of stones.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is about as strong as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is about as balanced as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is about as suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff does about as much puncture damage as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff does about as much slice damage as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff does a little more impact damage than the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff weighs a lot more than the ebon-hued cane.
Yamcer
"You know, while I understand the importance of seeing the (personal) validity in other's arguments, it's impossible for me to believe fully that others are correct. If their argument was correct, I'd change mine." - My GF
question: why do you stop your combo at sweep and not continue to chop -> jab-> dodge?
I've actually started using my cambrinth staff more than my 18 kronar cane.
A steel-capped ironwood quarter staff carved with multiple cambrinth-inlaid symbols is a quarter staff pole-ranged weapon.
You are certain that it could do:
no puncture damage
no slice damage
great impact damage
You are certain that the staff is fairly balanced and is fairly suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is of average strength, and is in pristine condition.
The ironwood staff is made with metal.
You wonder if the ironwood staff might weigh several tens of stones.
An ebon-hued cane is a quarter staff melee-ranged weapon.
You are certain that it could do:
no puncture damage
no slice damage
heavy impact damage
You are certain that the cane is fairly balanced and is fairly suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength.
You are certain that the ebon-hued cane is of average strength, and is in pristine condition.
You guess that the ebon-hued cane probably weighs a few tens of stones.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is about as strong as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is about as balanced as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff is about as suited to gaining extra attack power from your strength as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff does about as much puncture damage as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff does about as much slice damage as the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff does a little more impact damage than the ebon-hued cane.
You are certain that the ironwood staff weighs a lot more than the ebon-hued cane.
Yamcer
"You know, while I understand the importance of seeing the (personal) validity in other's arguments, it's impossible for me to believe fully that others are correct. If their argument was correct, I'd change mine." - My GF
URUTU
Re: QS Test
09/12/2010 03:02 PM CDT
I want to test again using a critter that's a closer match to my QS ranks. Just ran out of time last night. Maybe also against some parry gods as well. I do like my old cane. Been through a lot of hunting with it over the years with different characters.
<<question: why do you stop your combo at sweep and not continue to chop -> jab-> dodge?>>
I'm the world's worst at being lazy and using "attack" when training lower weapons. So I was just trying to come up with something that might be better. It gets me to incredibly/overwhelming within a few hits. But I'll experiment with adding chop/jab like you mention to see how it goes. I know that routine is popular.
The cambrinth staff looks like a good weapon. Run some tests and let us know what happens.
Kaxis
>Bugs pour from the togball's open orifices. Slowly but surely, the insects consume the toughened flesh and rotting bones. Ultimately, nothing is left except for a togball-sized stain on the ground, which oddly enough seems to be making quite a rude gesture with one silhouetted finger.
<<question: why do you stop your combo at sweep and not continue to chop -> jab-> dodge?>>
I'm the world's worst at being lazy and using "attack" when training lower weapons. So I was just trying to come up with something that might be better. It gets me to incredibly/overwhelming within a few hits. But I'll experiment with adding chop/jab like you mention to see how it goes. I know that routine is popular.
The cambrinth staff looks like a good weapon. Run some tests and let us know what happens.
Kaxis
>Bugs pour from the togball's open orifices. Slowly but surely, the insects consume the toughened flesh and rotting bones. Ultimately, nothing is left except for a togball-sized stain on the ground, which oddly enough seems to be making quite a rude gesture with one silhouetted finger.
FUTILITY
Re: QS Test
09/12/2010 03:07 PM CDT
I hadn't bothered to compare it to a cane, but it definitely hits harder than the regular heavy impact quarterstaffs, although not so much I'd say you should scramble to find one.
JMF90
Re: QS Test
09/12/2010 10:46 PM CDT
>I've actually started using my cambrinth staff more than my 18 kronar cane.
The WM cambrinth QS is a very nice weapon. Great impact at 50 stones, which usually requires 60 stones. I believe the balance is slightly better than a 60 stone great impact QS as well, but I don't have my spreadsheet in front of me.
>describe boar
It's a boar. It doesn't like you.
The WM cambrinth QS is a very nice weapon. Great impact at 50 stones, which usually requires 60 stones. I believe the balance is slightly better than a 60 stone great impact QS as well, but I don't have my spreadsheet in front of me.
>describe boar
It's a boar. It doesn't like you.
URUTU
Re: QS Test
09/13/2010 01:12 AM CDT
I reran the QS test with black leucros. This time there was a difference. As Cop mentioned, once the two weapons had decent chances to actually hit the target, the heavier impact of the nuja was able to give a better account of itself. The result spread was a more complicated than the first test, so I used the same hit level chart from the HX test to compute average hit strength. The damage from the uguns nuja was definitely higher than the cane: high heavy as opposed to bottom heavy.
UGUNS NUJA - 100 hits/24 kills
8.84 = heavy
19 good
17 solid
3 hard
1 strong
3 heavy
5 very heavy
12 extremely heavy
10 powerful
21 massive
4 awesome
2 vicious
1 annihilating
2 apocalyptic
CANE - 100 hits/24 kills
8.00 = heavy
1 glancing
5 light
24 good
3 solid
6 hard
5 strong
10 heavy
14 very heavy
5 extremely heavy
5 powerful
15 massive
1 awesome
1 vicious
3 earth-shaking
1 devastating
1 obliterating
Of note is that we're getting a similar hit-to-kill ratio even though one weapon is outperforming the other. This is similar to some of the results in the HX tests. The nuja is hitting harder but not quite hard enough to jump to the next increment and kill each leucro in less shots per average. So even though theoretically the nuja is the better weapon, from a practical standpoint the extra damage doesn't seem to be helping me kill more. This apparently holds true both at the mid/low end of my QS ranks (leucros) and the high end (germish'din), which to me indicates I should probably keep using my cane. Being able to keep your quarterstaff in your thigh quiver is a nice perk.
The higher damage with the nuja would help me with things like giving critters stronger stuns and dealing out injuries that compromise their ability to fight back. But I'm not sure the difference was enough to make that advantage decisive. Both weapons were smacking leucros around like bowling pins.
One thing that might have effected the results a bit was I ran the nuja test earlier in the day, when there were more hunters. There were a lot of leucros running around, so I was getting more critters per minute. I ran the cane test after the Cowboy game, and the lower number of hunters that late in the day meant I had to wait longer between leucros. My average balance with the cane test thus was definitely lower than with the nuja since it had more time to degrade between kills. Again, probably not a huge difference since the cane got me to incredibly/overwhelming in a very few hits but definitely worth mentioning.
Kaxis
Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you thrust a peach knife at a sky giant. A sky giant fails to dodge, moving directly into the blow.
UGUNS NUJA - 100 hits/24 kills
8.84 = heavy
19 good
17 solid
3 hard
1 strong
3 heavy
5 very heavy
12 extremely heavy
10 powerful
21 massive
4 awesome
2 vicious
1 annihilating
2 apocalyptic
CANE - 100 hits/24 kills
8.00 = heavy
1 glancing
5 light
24 good
3 solid
6 hard
5 strong
10 heavy
14 very heavy
5 extremely heavy
5 powerful
15 massive
1 awesome
1 vicious
3 earth-shaking
1 devastating
1 obliterating
Of note is that we're getting a similar hit-to-kill ratio even though one weapon is outperforming the other. This is similar to some of the results in the HX tests. The nuja is hitting harder but not quite hard enough to jump to the next increment and kill each leucro in less shots per average. So even though theoretically the nuja is the better weapon, from a practical standpoint the extra damage doesn't seem to be helping me kill more. This apparently holds true both at the mid/low end of my QS ranks (leucros) and the high end (germish'din), which to me indicates I should probably keep using my cane. Being able to keep your quarterstaff in your thigh quiver is a nice perk.
The higher damage with the nuja would help me with things like giving critters stronger stuns and dealing out injuries that compromise their ability to fight back. But I'm not sure the difference was enough to make that advantage decisive. Both weapons were smacking leucros around like bowling pins.
One thing that might have effected the results a bit was I ran the nuja test earlier in the day, when there were more hunters. There were a lot of leucros running around, so I was getting more critters per minute. I ran the cane test after the Cowboy game, and the lower number of hunters that late in the day meant I had to wait longer between leucros. My average balance with the cane test thus was definitely lower than with the nuja since it had more time to degrade between kills. Again, probably not a huge difference since the cane got me to incredibly/overwhelming in a very few hits but definitely worth mentioning.
Kaxis
Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you thrust a peach knife at a sky giant. A sky giant fails to dodge, moving directly into the blow.
HERSCHEDE77
Re: QS Test
09/13/2010 03:55 AM CDT
I guess my curiosity would be which one locked the weapon faster... I mean, harder hits should lock quicker, given all else equal, but was there a discernable difference to get them to ml?
URUTU
Re: QS Test
09/14/2010 12:00 AM CDT
Sorry, I didn't keep track of that. Even though it's not strictly necessary I tend to sleep through such experiments since I'm never sure how many tests I might wind up running.
Kaxis
Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you thrust a peach knife at a sky giant. A sky giant fails to dodge, moving directly into the blow.
Kaxis
Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you thrust a peach knife at a sky giant. A sky giant fails to dodge, moving directly into the blow.
GREENPAPPY
Re: QS Test
09/16/2010 09:22 PM CDT
How do the hits on the "puncture" attacks compare to the "slicing" attacks? I have always used draw slice sweep chop for my QS routine (likely aided alot by Sure Footing).
ASHBOMB
