<<So, ah, tonight, I witnessed a cleric half my circle casting divine radiance faster than I can cast any of my targeted spells, and I questioned him about it, and his skills are also about half mine. I'm a warrior mage, and I was under the influence that we were the masters of targeted magic...does this seem a bit broken to anyone else?

No. Only because unless the target is undead snap-casting DR basically does squat. And also, he's probably learning TM at a horrid rate. If he's anything like me he needs to snap-cast DR 30 times to reach 'thoughtful.'

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

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<<I'll rescind my post anyhow; I was not aware that I could snap cast my spells if I targetted them first. Silly me!

Oh, yeah. I guess that WOULD make a difference. And between a slightly-paused min-prep Aether Lance or Fireshard and a DR machine-gun, I'd still take the Fireshard

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

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>I was under the influence ~ Fyrrus

Maybe all the flashing lights were cause you fell off the wagon? ::flees::

(one for the out of context theater, heh)

--
Ranger Hanryu _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _, Sword of House Calibanor
>We are Rangers, all your releases are belong to us. ~ Sylvado

<<Keep in mind too that Divine Radiance is an easy spell to cast, and to pack extra mana into.

Agreed, but I was only kind of surprised/dismayed/emotionally wounded that a cleric half my circle and half my ability could snap spells at higher mana, and faster.

Of course, this isn't true (which is why I rescinded my post) because when we 'target' it brings our spells to full preparation, or something of the like. As easy as DR is, I still wouldn't be satisfied if that were the reason because AEL is probably of similar difficulty or easier, but I thought I couldn't snap it.

Targetting makes all the difference, eh? I'm sorry if I came off as a jerk, I didn't mean to seem so GvG about it, I was just dismayed.

Fyrrus

Actually don't feel too bad. It's all about learning, right? I assumed snap cast spells, like DR, was the way to learn TM, since that has been what I have used. It always confused me why the other TM spells, like Harm Evil or Hand of Tenemlor, would always backfire if I did.

Now I know; DR is just unique like that. And know if half the battle. G. I. Jooooooooooooe! :grins:

Do you have to actually target the citter before you snap cast a war mage spell? I usually just have to face the critter, and then I use my macro ( prep dr /r/ cast abdomen /r ). Rinse and repeat until dead.

Nikpack
player of Celeiros and Makona

"I would suggest taking everything as some sort of IC bias unless you see something which seems to offer incontrovertible proof of an OOC issue." -- Navak

As I recall, TM also receives the learning bonus from damage done like weapons do. So while he might be snap-casting DR at piddly x prep like an automatic rifle, a targetted and slightly-delayed Aether Lance will fill your target pool much better. If you measure the learning rate over time there's really no competition. As said earlier, that massive snap-casting must be great for PM, but for the skill in question (target) it's no comparison. So not only can you cast AL almost as fast as he can DR now that you target first, but each individual cast also fills the pool much faster (especially against the living) :).

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

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I love learning.

<<( \xprep ael 15\rtarget\rcast\r )

What does the x before the prep command in your macro mean?


Nikpack
player of Celeiros and Makona

"I would suggest taking everything as some sort of IC bias unless you see something which seems to offer incontrovertible proof of an OOC issue." -- Navak

Personnally I get emotionally offended when War Mages kill undead faster than Flavius....but I have learned to deal with it.

My point- War Mages kill things better, learn TM better...don't fret.

Flavius

Fyrrus- my reply was somewhat tongue in cheek. Certainly we can hit noncorporeal undead very well- only paladins have the possibility of killing them faster. And certainly Warmies can't. My point was that Warmies with Chain Lightning, say 40th circle and above, can kill most undead faster than a cleric of similar or even higher circle. This is simply because most undead(and cursed) creatures are corporeal and hitable by anyone. This somewhat contradicts our supposed superiority in dealing with undead/cursed. But at least we aren't limited to that anymore- thanks the gods for that!

So, once again- my point being that don't fret- warmies still learn TM better than clerics, and kill better with TM than clerics.

<<Gasp! WMs can hit undead with a spell! They're not allowed to do that! >>

I dont get it?

Verbal

<<Im lit? Imm CL? What?>>

Immune to lightning, immune to CL.

This is why it's bad to randomly abbreviate words that don't have a common and accepted abbreviation, people...

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Marksman Ahmir Nam'al

[pi]

>>>Huh? How? All of my spells fall apart when I try to target or cast at undead, at least, incorpreal undead. Grendels and the like, fleshy undead, I can hurt sometimes. Am I missing something?

Try going one over the minimum prep. So instead of just prep gz put in prep gz 6 or whatever min(prep)+1 is.

Amagaim; the player of,

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Our culture doesn't get smarter. It finds new ways of being retarded.

Not immune. I can unbalance a death spirit using Anger the Earth (easiest-tier roar) as well as Nightmare berserk, a roar helm, invoked warpaint, and grouped with four other people. In other words... yeah, they're effectively immune to intimidation. So... maybe with a capped mana, max prep spell that's very mana efficient... and while using a capped TM CJ... maybe you could land a grazing blow with Chain lightning.

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

---

They're supposed to be immune to intimidation and they're not... so I would think they're not completely immune to target. Just uh... effectively immune. Like 600% resistance or something as opposed to "negates lightning damage." But it's really a matter of semantics. Effective immunity is the result either way. Just make target damage them and give some powerful vs. living AoE attacks to Clerics. Everyone by happy.

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

---

3 Cleric spells in development already. I have no reason or justification whatsoever, but one of them says 'targetted AoE attack spell" because that's something that is sorely needed. Seems a lot of warmies complain whenever another guild gets a half-competent target spell anyways. I mean... I'm not a warrior mage anymore so I certainly open myself to valid arguments, but is the phrase 'warmies are losing their place as masters of target' I've seen flying around so much seem sort of ridiculous, or is it just me?

So yes! Holy Magic feedback. I have no idea to confirm or deny if they're indeed immune to target. Maybe. I was told they were immune to intimidation though and they're not (I think? unless I'm remembering casting on a skeleton or a dark fiend or something. Coulda sworn it was a DS).

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

---

Well...

You can sort of damage noncorporeal undead with TKT.

You just need to huck a blessed weapon or ammunition at it.

Not that it really helps one bit 99% of the time.

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Rev. Reene, player of a few

Rumet asks, "You know the best thing about Talian?"
>
Talian looks around a moment before glancing at Rumet. With a small grunt, he walks over to Rumet and pokes him in the eyes!
He falls to the ground stunned!

I don't think WMs only mind Clerics getting a targeted AE spell so much because we're a bit upset at not having any released development in the past year and a half... pretty soon you just start complaining about everything heh... And yes, incorporeal undead are 100% immune to any damage TYPE that's not holy, TKTing blessed arrows aside.

I thought clerics remained the masters of killing undead too - because HE bypasses armor, so they will always kill single undead/cursed faster than anyone else? Clerics do need Harm Hoarde though heh, there's no denying that. I personally wouldn't mind seeing cursed undead being made more resistant to electrical damage - and weaker against fire. Though that might already be coded, and the people who you've seen killing the cursed undead are just much much higher in circle. I mean, by the time you have CL, you're at least circle 40 with close to 200 TM. Frying a room full of grendels or steeds isn't much of a challenge by any means ;)

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http://www.drplat.com - The DragonRealms Platinum Community Website. Be sure to vote DragonRealms as your #1 MUD!

Yeah and the Ways was just about out of QC back before Simucon 2005. Your point? Just because something is in QC doesn't mean it won't be 5 years before we see it. Heh, not knocking the GMs, just pointing out we've had no RELEASED (like I said above) development in a long time :(

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http://www.drplat.com - The DragonRealms Platinum Community Website. Be sure to vote DragonRealms as your #1 MUD!

Okay before someone feels the need to point out to Verbal that clerics were blessed with releases in 2005, he knows that, and we know that. While all guilds would love new releases and new toys, I will interpret his point(without his consent or approval) to state the obvious- clerics have had more releases in the last year than warmies- and with those new releases we are still vastly behind warmies and moonies in overall developement. Roughly 10-14 spells behind both guilds, not even a developed concept as to clerical enchanting..blah, blah, blah.

I am not even complaining about the clerics guild lack of progress- because a) we don't have any gm's right now anyways and b) the quality of what we have gotten is pretty satisfactory and c) what good does it do?

So I don't feel too sorry for warmies lack of developement for a year or whatever, nor do I expect warmies to have much sympathy for the clerics guild's situation. Pointing out either doesn't do much good. Best you can do is be a strong advocate for what will benefit your guild.

Flavius

<<Good post. I am just pointing out why Warmies typically won't have sympathy for Clerics, or Thieves, or Moon Mages... or most other guilds. See, if weapon enchanting had come out, I think most of us would be on the bandwagon to get a CREATION system for ALL guilds. Sadly that hasn't been the case, so here we sit..

Total Warmie spells: 41
Total Moonie spells: 45
Total Cleric spells: 31 (with 3 in the works).

Additional WM features: cantrips, familiar system, Blackfire system
Additional MM features: sects
Additional Cleric features: communes

Thieves have not had a release in what... twice as long as the last Warmie release? I agree that something should come soon and it's being worked on, but you can see here the plain and simple reason why the spare GMs are pumping out Cleric spells right now instead of finalizing a Warmie release.

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Malkien the Barbarian has already been to the moon: that's why there are no signs of life there.
Apis the Cleric's tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried.

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