symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/25/2019 06:27 PM CDT
I've tried it with Chaos Symbiosis and 2 of the other Symbiosis, but any time i use something like Grounding Field that has to CAST <element>, Symbiosis stays prepared and doesn't affect the spell. i have tested with some other spells, and it only works with spells that only require CAST. if you cannot do that, for whatever reason, symbiosis doesn't work with it.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/25/2019 06:54 PM CDT

> prep ignite 20

You trace a geometric sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Ignite spell.
> wie spear

>
You draw out your light spear from the backpack, gripping it firmly in your right hand.
> prep symb
You recall the exact details of the Chaos symbiosis, preparing to integrate it with the next spell you cast.
> cast spear

You twist the mana streams of your Ignite spell in a chaotic motion, inciting them into unpredictable patterns.
Tendrils of flame dart along your hand toward a steel light spear, which suddenly bursts into flames!
The complementary nature of the spell empowers you.


> prep gf 20
Since you're not feeding enough power into the spell pattern to make it coherent, you quickly work your way to the minimum required.

You trace a geometric sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Grounding Field spell.
> discern gf
The Grounding Field spell establishes an electrical field about the magician that redirects hostile energies harmlessly into Elanthia. When establishing a field it must be attuned to fire, cold or electrical sources specifically. While much trial and hardship has resulted in a stable barrier that will not interfere with the caster's own attacks be warned that the field will amplify energy sources it is not attuned to.

This is a non-battle spell that can be cast on a single target. Non-battle spells have significantly longer preparation times than battle spells. It can be cast without a target. It requires a minimum of thirty mana streams, and can expand to a maximum of one hundred mana streams woven into it. To begin to be able to cast this spell, you will need to reach the rank of a 50th degree adept. By the time you have mastered this spell, you will be ranked as a guru in your abilities as a caster. It requires the Warding skill to cast effectively. Before you can learn this spell, you must know Lightning Bolt and Ethereal Shield, and be circle 70. It will also cost two spell slots.

The spell requires at minimum 30 mana streams and you think you can reinforce it with 70 more, for a total of 100 streams.
Roundtime: 10 sec.
R>
RT with no EXP.

R> prep symb
But you've already prepared the Chaos symbiosis!
>
You feel fully prepared to cast your spell.
> cast fire

You drop briefly to one knee as you firmly press your palms into the ground.
You twist the mana streams of your Grounding Field spell in a chaotic motion, inciting them into unpredictable patterns.
A lattice-like sphere of electricity attuned to fire forms about you.

You're doing something wrong.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/25/2019 07:18 PM CDT
Your log shows what he's talking about, unless there's a lot you cut out between your cast of ignite and gf. The symbiosis should have stopped being prepared after your ignite cast but it was still prepared for your grounding field cast instead of being used despite the messaging at the ignite cast.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/26/2019 02:46 AM CDT
Not happening to me with Resonance:

>prep reso 100
That will disrupt less than a quarter of your current attunement.

You trace a careful sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Resonance spell.

You feel fully prepared to cast your spell.

>prep symb
You recall the exact details of the Chaos symbiosis, preparing to integrate it with the next spell you cast.

>cast gladius
You gesture at a gladius with an ornate damite hilt shaped into a crow with wings spread wide.
You twist the mana streams of your Resonance spell in a chaotic motion, inciting them into unpredictable patterns.
You close your eyes briefly, focusing on the dull thumping of your own heart. Extending that focus to a gladius with an ornate damite hilt shaped into a crow with wings spread wide, you feel it resonate with you.

>prep symb
You recall the exact details of the Chaos symbiosis, preparing to integrate it with the next spell you cast.

>release symb
You pause for a moment as the details of the Chaos symbiosis fade from your mind.
You release the Chaos symbiosis.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/27/2019 04:09 AM CDT
Interesting it works with resonance. other spells i've tried it with (as a War mage) don't work.

And @Dearmank you can see the second prep symb says it's still prepared. symbiosis will not stay prepared like that if it's cast with the spell. If you want to test that, use another spell and see when you prep it for the second spell, the message is different.

but otherwise, that's exactly what i'm seeing.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/27/2019 06:45 AM CDT
>>Your log shows what he's talking about, unless there's a lot you cut out between your cast of ignite and gf. The symbiosis should have stopped being prepared after your ignite cast but it was still prepared for your grounding field cast instead of being used despite the messaging at the ignite cast.

I prepped it before the second snip.

Here are the important parts

You twist the mana streams of your Ignite spell in a chaotic motion, inciting them into unpredictable patterns.
Tendrils of flame dart along your hand toward a steel light spear, which suddenly bursts into flames!
The complementary nature of the spell empowers you.

You drop briefly to one knee as you firmly press your palms into the ground.
You twist the mana streams of your Grounding Field spell in a chaotic motion, inciting them into unpredictable patterns.
A lattice-like sphere of electricity attuned to fire forms about you.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/28/2019 01:52 AM CDT
Getting the messages doesn't mean it's doing anything. i've tested it, and it does not make the spell more difficult to cast like other spells. it's also still prepared after casting those spells (Ignite and Grounding Field), which is not how it works with other spells.

At this point i don't know what your point is with that last message, other than to say you got the messaging. Which is fine, i can see that. My point still stands, that preparing symbiosis with spells like Ignite and GF do not work properly. They are not harder to cast, and it does not actually use the symbiosis. What i mean by that last part, is when you use another symbiosis like harness or explore, it gives a boost to that skill. that does not work with ignite or GF either.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/28/2019 05:50 AM CDT
You are wrong on all counts.

It uses the symb

> prep gf 10
Since you're not feeding enough power into the spell pattern to make it coherent, you quickly work your way to the minimum required.

You trace a geometric sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Grounding Field spell.
> prep symb
You recall the exact details of the Chaos symbiosis, preparing to integrate it with the next spell you cast.
>
Knowledge from your sanowret crystal about the Spidersworn and wildling spiders rings clear in your mind:
While conventional spiders spin silk, elder wildling spiders spin wildlace. Authentic wildlace contains small but extremely durable crystalline droplets similar to the structures used for egg casings. The Spidersworn consider wildlace to be a gift that brings the wearer closer to the wildling spiders. Each piece is unique in color and design, and these features cannot be altered, as to change the gift is to destroy it in one's own hubris.

The light and crystal sound of your sanowret crystal fades slightly as you come to the end of the knowledge about the Spidersworn and wildling spiders. You feel quite enlightened, if a bit mentally tired.
>
Learned: Arcana

> [heartbeat]: fatigue

>
Pulsed: Stealth, Outdoorsmanship

>
You are completely rested.
> cast fire

You drop briefly to one knee as you firmly press your palms into the ground.
You twist the mana streams of your Grounding Field spell in a chaotic motion, inciting them into unpredictable patterns.
A lattice-like sphere of electricity attuned to fire forms about you.

>
You feel fully rested.

> rel symb
But you haven't prepared a symbiosis!

It makes it more difficult

> prep gf 100

You trace a geometric sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Grounding Field spell.
> discern gf
The Grounding Field spell establishes an electrical field about the magician that redirects hostile energies harmlessly into Elanthia. When establishing a field it must be attuned to fire, cold or electrical sources specifically. While much trial and hardship has resulted in a stable barrier that will not interfere with the caster's own attacks be warned that the field will amplify energy sources it is not attuned to.

This is a non-battle spell that can be cast on a single target. Non-battle spells have significantly longer preparation times than battle spells. It can be cast without a target. It requires a minimum of thirty mana streams, and can expand to a maximum of one hundred mana streams woven into it. To begin to be able to cast this spell, you will need to reach the rank of a 50th degree adept. By the time you have mastered this spell, you will be ranked as a guru in your abilities as a caster. It requires the Warding skill to cast effectively. Before you can learn this spell, you must know Lightning Bolt and Ethereal Shield, and be circle 70. It will also cost two spell slots.

The spell requires at minimum 30 mana streams and you think you can reinforce it with 70 more, for a total of 100 streams.
Roundtime: 7 sec.
R>
RT with no EXP.

R>
Pulsed: Parry Ability, Small Edged, Large Edged, Twohanded Edged

>
You feel fully prepared to cast your spell.
> cast fire

You drop briefly to one knee as you firmly press your palms into the ground.
Your magical energies fail to manifest as you are already surrounded by a Grounding Field.

>
You feel fully rested.

> release gf
You attempt to scatter the Grounding Field about you, but the spell quickly nullifies your efforts. You'll just have to wait for the magic to wane on its own schedule.
> [heartbeat]: fatigue

You've gained a new rank in using crossbows.
>
Pulsed: Small Blunt, Large Blunt, Twohanded Blunt, Slings, Bow, Crossbow

>
You are completely rested.
> prep ignite 100

You trace a geometric sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Ignite spell.
> discern ignite
The Ignite spell adds a touch of fire to your weapon to help you strike down your enemies. Ignite's effects will even bolster weapons that already have a certain variety of fire damage, though not to the extent that it enhances the mundane sort. Of course, given the spell's nature, its effectiveness can be lost in water or if the weapon strays from your hand.

This is a non-battle spell that can be cast on a single target. Non-battle spells have significantly longer preparation times than battle spells. It can be cast on some objects. It requires a minimum of five mana streams, and can expand to a maximum of one hundred mana streams woven into it. To begin to be able to cast this spell, you will need to reach the rank of a promising novice. By the time you have mastered this spell, you will be ranked as a genius in your abilities as a caster. It requires the Utility skill to cast effectively. Before you can learn this spell, you must know one of Fire Shards or Elementalism. It will also cost two spell slots.

The spell requires at minimum 5 mana streams and you think you can reinforce it with 95 more, for a total of 100 streams.
Roundtime: 7 sec.
R>
RT with no EXP.

R>
The Grounding Field surrounding you suddenly collapses.
R>
Pulsed: Staves, Polearms, Light Thrown, Heavy Thrown, Brawling, Offhand Weapon, Melee Mastery

R> rel spell
You let your concentration lapse and feel the spell's energies dissipate.

> prep gf 100

You trace a geometric sigil in the air, shaping the pattern of the Grounding Field spell.
> discern gf
The Grounding Field spell establishes an electrical field about the magician that redirects hostile energies harmlessly into Elanthia. When establishing a field it must be attuned to fire, cold or electrical sources specifically. While much trial and hardship has resulted in a stable barrier that will not interfere with the caster's own attacks be warned that the field will amplify energy sources it is not attuned to.

This is a non-battle spell that can be cast on a single target. Non-battle spells have significantly longer preparation times than battle spells. It can be cast without a target. It requires a minimum of thirty mana streams, and can expand to a maximum of one hundred mana streams woven into it. To begin to be able to cast this spell, you will need to reach the rank of a 50th degree adept. By the time you have mastered this spell, you will be ranked as a guru in your abilities as a caster. It requires the Warding skill to cast effectively. Before you can learn this spell, you must know Lightning Bolt and Ethereal Shield, and be circle 70. It will also cost two spell slots.

The spell requires at minimum 30 mana streams and you think you can reinforce it with 70 more, for a total of 100 streams.
Roundtime: 10 sec.
R>
RT with no EXP.

R>
Pulsed: Missile Mastery, Elemental Magic, Attunement, Arcana, Augmentation

R> prep symb
You recall the exact details of the Chaos symbiosis, preparing to integrate it with the next spell you cast.
>
You feel fully prepared to cast your spell.
> cast fire
You drop briefly to one knee as you firmly press your palms into the ground.
Your spell horribly backfires.
A tingling sensation spreads through your body.

So to summarize, the first snip. Prep GF, Prep symb, cast fire, Symbiosis is used as evidenced by the messaging during casting and not having a symb prepped after.
second snip. Prep GF at 100, max cast per discern, no symb, casts no problem. Prep GF 100, Prep symb, waitfor full prep and cast to result in a horrible backfire. Obviously making the spell more difficult.


Myself and Illiena have posted logs of it working. Can you post a log of it not working? Maybe we can figure out where you're going wrong because it clearly works as intended. The only thing that Symb won't work on is Cyclics and TM.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/28/2019 03:22 PM CDT
<<What i mean by that last part, is when you use another symbiosis like harness or explore, it gives a boost to that skill. that does not work with ignite or GF either.

Since these symbioses are buffs cast on self, perhaps it makes sense they don't apply a buff to you since you're casting it on a weapon or the area.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/30/2019 03:18 PM CDT
Well i just tested with chaos and another symbiosis, and compared to before, it's working.

I don't remember when i last tested it, i just remember it wasn't working for some reason, but it is now.

So i wouldn't say i'm wrong Dearmank, just that something has changed since i last experienced the issue myself. I'll test it on my moon mage and see if i still experience it, but it may be different considering they are on The Fallen instead of Prime.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/30/2019 05:24 PM CDT
Why can't you admit you're wrong? I'm pretty sure Illiena isn't in TF. There are some minor variations in prime and TF but that would be pretty big. Also it would be more likely to NOT work in TF. You're either mis-remembering or you were doing something wrong.

Also you just posted about it but you can't remember when you last tested it?
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 04/30/2019 06:25 PM CDT
I can definitively say that war mage spells (and all other guilds' spells for that matter) do work with symbiosis as expected. 3 types of spells do not work with symbiosis: targeted magic, debilitation, and cyclics.

I got grounding field years ago thinking it'd be good to train with symbs, but I got it removed at the spell library when I realized you can't release it normally for continued casts. I just got the spell again to confirm that this mechanic has not changed and that symbiosis does in fact work correctly with grounding field and other spells that use cast <element> such as ETF. I've trained with ETF for years using symbs and never seen what you're talking about here.

There IS a bug with symbiosis with backlash, which may have been what you experienced. If you have a symb prepped when you backlash, the symb stays prepped. This is not true for backfires.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST 05/02/2019 04:51 AM CDT
Seriously Dearmank? i didn't immediately test it and post it on the forums, as i don't always jump on and immediately think i need to post it. same reason many bugs go unreported, they get forgotten or the details get clouded and can't be duplicated.

I tested it after you saying you got normal results, and i can't reproduce what i saw. for all i know it's because GF doesn't act like other spell and can be released and renewed by recasting. For all you know, i did something different and you're wrong?

Just because you can't find a bug doesn't mean it doesn't exist. And i apologize to the GMs reading this, since this thread has gone down hill for no reason.
Reply
Re: symbiosis doesn't work with spells that don't just CAST **NUDGE** 05/02/2019 10:03 AM CDT
Let's move away from the snark and keep with the constructive comments please.

Iristi
DragonRealms Board Monitor

Any questions or comments, please contact me at MOD-Iristi@play.net or Senior Board Monitor Helje at DR-Helje@play.net.
Reply